Tackling the Work-Energy Theorem

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the work-energy theorem, exploring the relationship between work, kinetic energy, and the underlying physics concepts such as force, acceleration, and distance. Participants examine the mathematical representations and implications of these concepts, including the role of squared velocity in kinetic energy and the derivation of the theorem.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant suggests that the distance in the work equation is influenced by acceleration and time, proposing that time is embedded in distance.
  • Another participant emphasizes the necessity of understanding the squared term in kinetic energy as an abstract concept, suggesting that intuition about energy is crucial.
  • A participant questions the complexity of the equation Δv² = 2ad and references a textbook explanation relating kinetic energy to momentum, expressing confusion about the correlation.
  • One participant proposes a direct relationship between work and kinetic energy by isolating acceleration and distance, questioning why these magnitudes are multiplied.
  • Another participant provides a derivation of the work-energy relationship using calculus and the chain rule, linking work done to the change in kinetic energy.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express various interpretations and approaches to the work-energy theorem, with no consensus reached on the best method of explanation or derivation. Disagreements arise regarding the clarity and utility of different formulations and relationships.

Contextual Notes

Some participants note the dependence on specific assumptions, such as constant acceleration, and the complexity introduced by different mathematical approaches. The discussion reflects a range of perspectives on the foundational concepts involved.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be useful for students and enthusiasts of physics seeking to deepen their understanding of the work-energy theorem and its mathematical underpinnings, as well as those interested in the conceptual challenges associated with energy and motion.

omin
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I'm trying to tackle the work-energy theorum.

It has occurred to me that the distance in work: Force x distance

is determined by the acceleration in the force variable, and time of force as well.

The distance, creates a halving of the final product of the Joule unit, because the distance is half the acceleration. I also see the distance is also a result of the time of force. A longer distance implies more time the force occurred. So, acceleration and time result in the distance, but time is sort of embedded in the distance.

I've read, Work = KE: Force x distance = 1/2 mass x velocity ^2.

I see the 1/2ing property in Work, because the distance traveled at an acceleration rate is half, but how is the speed squared explained for the other part of KE representation?

I hope that made sense.
 
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Energy does not make sense unless its units are the same as mass times speed squared. If you are not happy with the "squared", then you need to develop more intuition about energy. I'm not kidding; energy is an abstract quantity, not like volume (you can see), or force (you can feel).

A simple way to derive the result you want is using the formula from elementary physics:[tex]\Delta v^2=2ad[/tex]. This works for a constant acceleration.

A better way that does not require a to be constant is the following (but you need to know calculus): [tex]W=\int Fdx=m\int adx=m\int {dv\over dt}dx=m\int {dv\over dx}{dx\over dt}dx=m\int vdv=m\Delta v^2/2[/tex]
 
[tex]\Delta v^2=2ad[/tex], seems a bit cumbersome. My textbook explains something similar by comparing momentum to energy, but saying that kinetic energy is equal to momentum squared divided by twice the mass. I just don't get the round about way that shows the corelation.

Since I've asked the question, something occurred to me in looking at the equation, that seems to be a bit more directly representative.

If I think in terms of KE by isolating the the magnitude of acceleration and the magnitude of distance traveled, I see the work acceleration and distance magnitudes corelate exactly.

In terms of there respective magnitudes:

In Work = mass(acceleration)(distance).

In KE = mass (velocity) and either (distance) or (average velocity)

The acceleration magnitude is multiplied by the distance or average velocity magnitude the acceleration produces. Why they are multiplied is my next question. Do you know why?
 
You could use lineal momentum. krab used the chain rule.

[tex]W = \int F dx[/tex]

Newton's 2nd Law

[tex]F = \frac{dP}{dt}[/tex]

Constant Mass

[tex]F = m \frac{dv}{dt}[/tex]

Substituting

[tex]W = m \int \frac{dv}{dt} dx[/tex]

You know

[tex]v = \frac{dx}{dt}[/tex]

so

[tex]vdt = dx[/tex]

Substituing again:

[tex]W = m \int \frac{dv}{dt} vdt[/tex]

[tex]W = m \int vdv[/tex]

[tex]W =\frac{m \Delta v^2}{2}[/tex]

Work done is equal to the change in the kinetic energy

[tex]W = \Delta K[/tex]

For your books way:

[tex]\frac{P^2}{2m} = \frac{mv^2}{2} \frac{m}{m}[/tex]

Same thing.
 
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