Congratulations to Gross, Politzer, Wilczek [Archive]

Lubos Motl

Oct5-04, 06:44 AM

<jabberwocky><div class="vbmenu_control"><a href="jabberwocky:;" onClick="newWindow=window.open('','usenetCode','toolbar=no, location=no,scrollbars=yes,resizable=yes,status=no ,width=650,height=400'); newWindow.document.write('<HTML><HEAD><TITLE>Usenet ASCII</TITLE></HEAD><BODY topmargin=0 leftmargin=0 BGCOLOR=#F1F1F1><table border=0 width=625><td bgcolor=midnightblue><font color=#F1F1F1>This Usenet message\'s original ASCII form: </font></td></tr><tr><td width=449><br><br><font face=courier><UL><PRE>Today I woke up a bit early, to see how they have decided at\n\nhttp://nobelprize.org/\n\nThey decided correctly at last! We\'ve been guessing Gross, Politzer, and\nWilczek as the strongest candidates for the physics Nobel prize at least\nfor five years. This time was different, and our belief was strong.\n\nGross and Wilczek in particular are continuing to be the leaders of the\nfield of particle physics. Wilczek is our colleague at MIT, and David\nGross is the director of the Kavli Institute for Theoretical Physics in\nSanta Barbara.\n\nDavid Gross is also - I believe - the first string theorist awarded by the\nNobel prize. (Among hundreds of his important papers, he is a\nco-discoverer of the heterotic string.) Well, the prize is not exactly for\nstring theory this time, but at least, it is for something that may be\ndual to a string theory. :-)\n\nYou can read about the history of asymptotic freedom - that was\nappreciated by the committee - in Gross\' article "25 years of asymptotic\nfreedom" (well, now it\'s over 30 years)\n\nhttp://arxiv.org/abs/hep-th/9809060\n\nWe hope that the stringiness of the awarded discovery will be better next\ntime; the beginnings are often modest, and string theory is the best\nexample. ;-)\n\nCongratulations, Gentlemen, and thank you for your numerous contributions,\nleadership, and excitement!\n_____________________________________ _________________________________________\nE-mail: lumo@matfyz.cz fax: +1-617/496-0110 Web: http://lumo.matfyz.cz/\neFax: +1-801/454-1858 work: +1-617/384-9488 home: +1-617/868-4487 (call)\n^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^\n\n\n</UL></PRE></font></td></tr></table></BODY><HTML>');"> <IMG SRC=/images/buttons/ip.gif BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER ALT="View this Usenet post in original ASCII form">  View this Usenet post in original ASCII form </a></div><P></jabberwocky>Today I woke up a bit early, to see how they have decided at

http://nobelprize.org/

They decided correctly at last! We've been guessing Gross, Politzer, and
Wilczek as the strongest candidates for the physics Nobel prize at least
for five years. This time was different, and our belief was strong.

Gross and Wilczek in particular are continuing to be the leaders of the
field of particle physics. Wilczek is our colleague at MIT, and David
Gross is the director of the Kavli Institute for Theoretical Physics in
Santa Barbara.

David Gross is also - I believe - the first string theorist awarded by the
Nobel prize. (Among hundreds of his important papers, he is a
co-discoverer of the heterotic string.) Well, the prize is not exactly for
string theory this time, but at least, it is for something that may be
dual to a string theory. :-)

You can read about the history of asymptotic freedom - that was
appreciated by the committee - in Gross' article "25 years of asymptotic
freedom" (well, now it's over 30 years)

http://arxiv.org/abs/http://www.arxiv.org/abs/hep-th/9809060

We hope that the stringiness of the awarded discovery will be better next
time; the beginnings are often modest, and string theory is the best
example. ;-)

Congratulations, Gentlemen, and thank you for your numerous contributions,
leadership, and excitement!
__{_______________________________________________ _____________________________}
E-mail: lumo@matfyz.cz fax: +1-617/496-0110 Web: http://lumo.matfyz.cz/
eFax: +1-801/454-1858 work: +1-617/384-9488 home: +1-617/868-4487 (call)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Hendrik van Hees

Oct6-04, 08:03 AM

<jabberwocky><div class="vbmenu_control"><a href="jabberwocky:;" onClick="newWindow=window.open('','usenetCode','toolbar=no, location=no,scrollbars=yes,resizable=yes,status=no ,width=650,height=400'); newWindow.document.write('<HTML><HEAD><TITLE>Usenet ASCII</TITLE></HEAD><BODY topmargin=0 leftmargin=0 BGCOLOR=#F1F1F1><table border=0 width=625><td bgcolor=midnightblue><font color=#F1F1F1>This Usenet message\'s original ASCII form: </font></td></tr><tr><td width=449><br><br><font face=courier><UL><PRE>Lubos Motl wrote:\n\n> We hope that the stringiness of the awarded discovery will be better\n> next time; the beginnings are often modest, and string theory is the\n> best example. ;-)\n\nWell, I\'m also very glad that finally QCD is awarded with a Nobel prize.\nFor string theory, it\'s (I\'m sorry to say so) much too early to expect\none, since the Nobel prize is not given for mathematics. The urban\nlegend is that this was Nobel\'s revenge for Mittag-Leffler\'s affair\nwith Mrs. Nobel ;-)).\n\nThus, the string theorists have to wait until it is clear that string\ntheory is really physics and not pure mathematical speculation. Strong\narguments are not enough; we need experimental facts!\n>\n> Congratulations, Gentlemen, and thank you for your numerous\n> contributions, leadership, and excitement!\n\nYes, it\'s really high time that the idea of asymptotic freedom and QCD\nas the theory for strong interactions was awarded!\n\n--\nHendrik van Hees Cyclotron Institute\nPhone: +1 979/845-1411 Texas A&M University\nFax: +1 979/845-1899 Cyclotron Institute, MS-3366\nhttp://theory.gsi.de/~vanhees/ College Station, TX 77843-3366\n</UL></PRE></font></td></tr></table></BODY><HTML>');"> <IMG SRC=/images/buttons/ip.gif BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER ALT="View this Usenet post in original ASCII form">  View this Usenet post in original ASCII form </a></div><P></jabberwocky>Lubos Motl wrote:

> We hope that the stringiness of the awarded discovery will be better
> next time; the beginnings are often modest, and string theory is the
> best example. ;-)

Well, I'm also very glad that finally QCD is awarded with a Nobel prize.
For string theory, it's (I'm sorry to say so) much too early to expect
one, since the Nobel prize is not given for mathematics. The urban
legend is that this was Nobel's revenge for Mittag-Leffler's affair
with Mrs. Nobel ;-)).

Thus, the string theorists have to wait until it is clear that string
theory is really physics and not pure mathematical speculation. Strong
arguments are not enough; we need experimental facts!
>
> Congratulations, Gentlemen, and thank you for your numerous
> contributions, leadership, and excitement!

Yes, it's really high time that the idea of asymptotic freedom and QCD
as the theory for strong interactions was awarded!

--
Hendrik van Hees Cyclotron Institute
Phone: +1 979/845-1411 Texas A&M University
Fax: +1 979/845-1899 Cyclotron Institute, MS-3366
http://theory.gsi.de/~vanhees/ College Station, TX 77843-3366

Arnold Neumaier

Oct8-04, 06:20 AM

<jabberwocky><div class="vbmenu_control"><a href="jabberwocky:;" onClick="newWindow=window.open('','usenetCode','toolbar=no, location=no,scrollbars=yes,resizable=yes,status=no ,width=650,height=400'); newWindow.document.write('<HTML><HEAD><TITLE>Usenet ASCII</TITLE></HEAD><BODY topmargin=0 leftmargin=0 BGCOLOR=#F1F1F1><table border=0 width=625><td bgcolor=midnightblue><font color=#F1F1F1>This Usenet message\'s original ASCII form: </font></td></tr><tr><td width=449><br><br><font face=courier><UL><PRE>Lubos Motl wrote:\n\n> David Gross is also - I believe - the first string theorist awarded by the\n> Nobel prize. (Among hundreds of his important papers, he is a\n> co-discoverer of the heterotic string.) Well, the prize is not exactly for\n> string theory this time, but at least, it is for something that may be\n> dual to a string theory. :-)\n\n\'\'There is a candidate for a truly unified theory, the \'Superstring Theory\'.\nThis theory states that the basic building blocks are one-dimensional\nobjects, strings, which are so small that their extension is not revealed\nat the energies at which we measure today. The Superstring Theory contains\nsupersymmetry as one of its basic symmetries and includes the Standard Model\nas well as the gravity theory. There is, however, no experimental evidence\nfor this theory yet. Nevertheless, the framework is quite unique and\nthere is a strong belief in the physics community that it could be the\nright way to find the unique theory that unifies all the interactions.\nOnly the future can tell if this is true.\'\'\nFrom p.13 of the\n\'Advanced information on the Nobel Prize in Physics, 5 October 2004\'\nhttp://nobelprize.org/physics/laureates/2004/phyadv04.pdf\n\nIt took 30 years after experiments proved QCD correct to get a Nobel prize\nfor it.\n\nString theory is not even at the stage where there is experimental\nevidence for it.\n\nSo it seems that a Nobel prize for string theory will come only\nin the very far future, if ever.\n\n\nArnold Neumaier\n\n\n</UL></PRE></font></td></tr></table></BODY><HTML>');"> <IMG SRC=/images/buttons/ip.gif BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER ALT="View this Usenet post in original ASCII form">  View this Usenet post in original ASCII form </a></div><P></jabberwocky>Lubos Motl wrote:

> David Gross is also - I believe - the first string theorist awarded by the
> Nobel prize. (Among hundreds of his important papers, he is a
> co-discoverer of the heterotic string.) Well, the prize is not exactly for
> string theory this time, but at least, it is for something that may be
> dual to a string theory. :-)

''There is a candidate for a truly unified theory, the 'Superstring Theory'.
This theory states that the basic building blocks are one-dimensional
objects, strings, which are so small that their extension is not revealed
at the energies at which we measure today. The Superstring Theory contains
supersymmetry as one of its basic symmetries and includes the Standard Model
as well as the gravity theory. There is, however, no experimental evidence
for this theory yet. Nevertheless, the framework is quite unique and
there is a strong belief in the physics community that it could be the
right way to find the unique theory that unifies all the interactions.
Only the future can tell if this is true.''
From p.13 of the
'Advanced information on the Nobel Prize in Physics, 5 October 2004'
http://nobelprize.org/physics/laureates/2004/phyadv04.pdf

It took 30 years after experiments proved QCD correct to get a Nobel prize
for it.

String theory is not even at the stage where there is experimental
evidence for it.

So it seems that a Nobel prize for string theory will come only
in the very far future, if ever.

Arnold Neumaier

Thomas Larsson

Oct11-04, 03:52 AM

<jabberwocky><div class="vbmenu_control"><a href="jabberwocky:;" onClick="newWindow=window.open('','usenetCode','toolbar=no, location=no,scrollbars=yes,resizable=yes,status=no ,width=650,height=400'); newWindow.document.write('<HTML><HEAD><TITLE>Usenet ASCII</TITLE></HEAD><BODY topmargin=0 leftmargin=0 BGCOLOR=#F1F1F1><table border=0 width=625><td bgcolor=midnightblue><font color=#F1F1F1>This Usenet message\'s original ASCII form: </font></td></tr><tr><td width=449><br><br><font face=courier><UL><PRE>\nLubos Motl <motl@feynman.harvard.edu> wrote in message news:<cju1ei\\$tt5\\$1@lfa222122.richmond.edu>...\ n\n\n> David Gross is also - I believe - the first string theorist awarded by the\n> Nobel prize. (Among hundreds of his important papers, he is a\n> co-discoverer of the heterotic string.) Well, the prize is not exactly for\n> string theory this time, but at least, it is for something that may be\n> dual to a string theory. :-)\n>\n\nHow surprising that you say that!\n\nActually, QCD is very different from string theory. Asymptotic freedom is a\nproperty of correlation functions when points come close to each other. In\nstring theory the only observable is the S-matrix (or so you have told us).\nSo how can asymptotic freedom be expressed in string theory, when there are\nno correlation functions?\n\nShort-distance singularities can be present even if you have general\ncovariance, since they depend only on the smooth structure and not on the\nmetric structure of the manifold. Only in topological field theories\n(including LQG) are the correlation functions independent of separation.\nThe lesson from conformal field theory is that short-distance singularities\nand anomalous dimensions are possible only in the presence of the right\nanomalies.\n</UL></PRE></font></td></tr></table></BODY><HTML>');"> <IMG SRC=/images/buttons/ip.gif BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER ALT="View this Usenet post in original ASCII form">  View this Usenet post in original ASCII form </a></div><P></jabberwocky>Lubos Motl <motl@feynman.harvard.edu> wrote in message news:<cju1ei$tt5$1@lfa222122.richmond.edu>...

> David Gross is also - I believe - the first string theorist awarded by the
> Nobel prize. (Among hundreds of his important papers, he is a
> co-discoverer of the heterotic string.) Well, the prize is not exactly for
> string theory this time, but at least, it is for something that may be
> dual to a string theory. :-)
>

How surprising that you say that!

Actually, QCD is very different from string theory. Asymptotic freedom is a
property of correlation functions when points come close to each other. In
string theory the only observable is the S-matrix (or so you have told us).
So how can asymptotic freedom be expressed in string theory, when there are
no correlation functions?

Short-distance singularities can be present even if you have general
covariance, since they depend only on the smooth structure and not on the
metric structure of the manifold. Only in topological field theories
(including LQG) are the correlation functions independent of separation.
The lesson from conformal field theory is that short-distance singularities
and anomalous dimensions are possible only in the presence of the right
anomalies.

Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to=

Oct27-04, 10:56 AM

<jabberwocky><div class="vbmenu_control"><a href="jabberwocky:;" onClick="newWindow=window.open('','usenetCode','toolbar=no, location=no,scrollbars=yes,resizable=yes,status=no ,width=650,height=400'); newWindow.document.write('<HTML><HEAD><TITLE>Usenet ASCII</TITLE></HEAD><BODY topmargin=0 leftmargin=0 BGCOLOR=#F1F1F1><table border=0 width=625><td bgcolor=midnightblue><font color=#F1F1F1>This Usenet message\'s original ASCII form: </font></td></tr><tr><td width=449><br><br><font face=courier><UL><PRE>\nIn article <ck0qfe\\$v19\\$1@lfa222122.richmond.edu>, Hendrik van Hees\n<hees@comp.tamu.edu> writes:=20\n\n> Well, I\'m also very glad that finally QCD is awarded with a Nobel prize.\n> For string theory, it\'s (I\'m sorry to say so) much too early to expect\n> one, since the Nobel prize is not given for mathematics. The urban\n> legend is that this was Nobel\'s revenge for Mittag-Leffler\'s affair\n> with Mrs. Nobel ;-)).\n\nI believe this legend is taken up at http://www.snopes.com/ and found to=20\nbe just that---a legend.\n\nActually, Nobel chose---rightly or wrongly---the 5 fields (physics,=20\nchemistry, medicine or physiology, peace and literature---note that the=20\neconomics prize is not a "real" Nobel Prize, but was added later, not by=20\nNobel (long dead) nor by his heirs or foundation) because he believed=20\nthat these were most relevant to improving the well-being of mankind. I=20\ncan see why he, at least from his perspective, would not have chosen=20\nmathematics (nor astronomy, nor many other fields).\n</UL></PRE></font></td></tr></table></BODY><HTML>');"> <IMG SRC=/images/buttons/ip.gif BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER ALT="View this Usenet post in original ASCII form">  View this Usenet post in original ASCII form </a></div><P></jabberwocky>In article <ck0qfe$v19$1@lfa222122.richmond.edu>, Hendrik van Hees
<hees@comp.tamu.edu> writes:=20

> Well, I'm also very glad that finally QCD is awarded with a Nobel prize.
> For string theory, it's (I'm sorry to say so) much too early to expect
> one, since the Nobel prize is not given for mathematics. The urban
> legend is that this was Nobel's revenge for Mittag-Leffler's affair
> with Mrs. Nobel ;-)).

I believe this legend is taken up at http://www.snopes.com/ and found to=20
be just that---a legend.

Actually, Nobel chose---rightly or wrongly---the 5 fields (physics,=20
chemistry, medicine or physiology, peace and literature---note that the=20
economics prize is not a "real" Nobel Prize, but was added later, not by=20
Nobel (long dead) nor by his heirs or foundation) because he believed=20
that these were most relevant to improving the well-being of mankind. I=20
can see why he, at least from his perspective, would not have chosen=20
mathematics (nor astronomy, nor many other fields).

DickT

Oct28-04, 01:29 PM

<jabberwocky><div class="vbmenu_control"><a href="jabberwocky:;" onClick="newWindow=window.open('','usenetCode','toolbar=no, location=no,scrollbars=yes,resizable=yes,status=no ,width=650,height=400'); newWindow.document.write('<HTML><HEAD><TITLE>Usenet ASCII</TITLE></HEAD><BODY topmargin=0 leftmargin=0 BGCOLOR=#F1F1F1><table border=0 width=625><td bgcolor=midnightblue><font color=#F1F1F1>This Usenet message\'s original ASCII form: </font></td></tr><tr><td width=449><br><br><font face=courier><UL><PRE>\n\n\nhelbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to= reply) wrote in message news:<clm1va\\$ib7\\$2@online.de>...\n> In article <ck0qfe\\$v19\\$1@lfa222122.richmond.edu>, Hendrik van Hees\n> <hees@comp.tamu.edu> writes:=20\n>\n> > Well, I\'m also very glad that finally QCD is awarded with a Nobel prize.\n> > For string theory, it\'s (I\'m sorry to say so) much too early to expect\n> > one, since the Nobel prize is not given for mathematics. The urban\n> > legend is that this was Nobel\'s revenge for Mittag-Leffler\'s affair\n> > with Mrs. Nobel ;-)).\n>\n> I believe this legend is taken up at http://www.snopes.com/ and found to=20\n> be just that---a legend.\n>\n\n(I sure hope this makes it past the monitor, just this once?)\nThe story I heard in math grad shool in 1960 was that Nobel and\nMittag-Leffler courted the same young woman in their student days and\nshe married Mittag-Lefffler, which was a great blow to Nobel. This\ndoesn\'t have the weakness of the adultery story; that Nobel never\nmarried.\n</UL></PRE></font></td></tr></table></BODY><HTML>');"> <IMG SRC=/images/buttons/ip.gif BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER ALT="View this Usenet post in original ASCII form">  View this Usenet post in original ASCII form </a></div><P></jabberwocky>helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to= reply) wrote in message news:<clm1va$ib7$2@online.de>...
> In article <ck0qfe$v19$1@lfa222122.richmond.edu>, Hendrik van Hees
> <hees@comp.tamu.edu> writes:=20
>
> > Well, I'm also very glad that finally QCD is awarded with a Nobel prize.
> > For string theory, it's (I'm sorry to say so) much too early to expect
> > one, since the Nobel prize is not given for mathematics. The urban
> > legend is that this was Nobel's revenge for Mittag-Leffler's affair
> > with Mrs. Nobel ;-)).
>
> I believe this legend is taken up at http://www.snopes.com/ and found to=20
> be just that---a legend.
>

(I sure hope this makes it past the monitor, just this once?)
The story I heard in math grad shool in 1960 was that Nobel and
Mittag-Leffler courted the same young woman in their student days and
she married Mittag-Lefffler, which was a great blow to Nobel. This
doesn't have the weakness of the adultery story; that Nobel never
married.