View Full Version : How atheistic are you? How many gods do you NOT believe in?
FlexGunship
Jan17-11, 11:29 AM
Often, members of our species rate themselves by how religious they are. I hope you all don't mind if I start a brief poll. I'm going to enter in the most common possible responses (though I know there are so many possible answers).
There are over 2870 known gods or goddesses that are classified as "deities" (http://wiki.answers.com/Q/How_many_gods_and_goddesses_are_there). Rather than ask how many you DO believe in, I'm going to pose a different question:
How many gods do you NOT believe in?
EDIT: I should be clear:
"2870" means you are an atheist. (Perfect atheist)
"2869" means you are a monotheist. (Almost a perfect atheist)
"2867" means you are a traditional Christian polytheist. (Still very very atheistic)
"0" means you are the most amazing "true believer" ever! (You could also use this as an "other" option, I guess... sorry I didn't add one.)
A trick post eh? If people don't fully read your post and go by the title, they will be voting wrong.
FlexGunship
Jan17-11, 11:38 AM
A trick post eh? If people don't fully read your post and go by the title, they will be voting wrong.
No, sorry. It was a mistake. I fixed the thread as quickly as I could and added an "EDIT" to clarify. Honest mistake.
http://img1.sendscraps.com/se/016/002.jpg
No, sorry. It was a mistake. I fixed the thread as quickly as I could and added an "EDIT" to clarify. Honest mistake.
http://img1.sendscraps.com/se/016/002.jpg
Awwww.
Was the IPU included in the list? I *do* believe in the IPU.
FlexGunship
Jan17-11, 11:47 AM
Awwww.
Was the IPU included in the list? I *do* believe in the IPU.
I'm not 100% sure that the Invisible Pink Unicorn is worshiped as a deity. There are many many more supernatural beings that aren't included in the 2870 number. I'm pretty sure the IPU is one of the "other ones."
Chi Meson
Jan17-11, 11:47 AM
Since there is no god TO believe in, then there is no god NOT to believe in. Hence "0" would be the choice for the perfectly atheistic person.
Nyah :tongue:
I like the fact that all monotheists are classified as "almost perfect atheists." I'm sure that this will go over well! :rolleyes:
Also, what's a Christian polytheist?
FlexGunship
Jan17-11, 11:49 AM
Since there is no god TO believe in, then there is no god NOT to believe in. Hence "0" would be the choice for the perfectly atheistic person.
Nyah :tongue:
Hmm, it's actually impossible to argue that. You're right. It should really be: "How many god-claims do you NOT believe in?"
Sigh...
I like the fact that all monotheists are classified as "almost perfect atheists." I'm sure that this will go over well! :rolleyes:
Well, to be fair (2869/2870) is very close to (2870/2870). It's 0.99965 to 1.00000. I mean, that's a pretty tight tolerance, all things considered. So, mathematically speaking, monotheists are pretty close to perfect atheists.
Also, what's a Christian polytheist?
Some sects of Christianity worship the holy trinity has a three-figure godhead.
I was going to go for 2869, that is I do not believe in any of these god-claims except for ONE!... Wow,that was a close one! I was about to become an atheist. :biggrin:
FlexGunship
Jan17-11, 12:22 PM
This is really surprising, there are no monotheists on PF. Granted the sample size is small...
This is really surprising, there are no monotheists on PF. Granted the sample size is small...
Problem is if you believe in one god; you would assume that all different gods are just different representations of one god so you would end up believing in all gods.
I would like one more option "NA" :biggrin:
FlexGunship
Jan17-11, 12:46 PM
Problem is if you believe in one god; you would assume that all different gods are just different representations of one god so you would end up believing in all gods.
I would like one more option "NA" :biggrin:
Not necessarily. Yahweh even had a commandment forbidding belief in competing gods like Baal. So, you could still believe in just one god but recognize a multitude of non-gods.
Problem is if you believe in one god; you would assume that all different gods are just different representations of one god so you would end up believing in all gods.
I would like one more option "NA" :biggrin:
This is not necessarily true. You would need to know what qualifications one must have to become a GOD? I. e. I know that I would worship Cyrus! ... Giving it a second thought, nah, a bug can kill him. :biggrin:
I'm quite busy right now, if this thread doesn't end up locked, I'd be happy to reply later.
I would prefer to see a "All of them" as on option. Someone selecting 2870 always risks that one or two gods have been lost during counting. Besides, we don't know how many gods are worshiped on Mars or Aldebaran, so the count is pathetically local.
FlexGunship
Jan17-11, 01:13 PM
I would prefer to see a "All of them" as on option. Someone selecting 2870 always risks that one or two gods have been lost during counting. Besides, we don't know how many gods are worshiped on Mars or Aldebaran, so the count is pathetically local.
Well, can you accept 2870 as a theoretically reference value and everything else is a fraction there of? Whatever number of deities might have been proposed, that number is normalized to 2870.
I would prefer to see a "All of them" as on option. Someone selecting 2870 always risks that one or two gods have been lost during counting. Besides, we don't know how many gods are worshiped on Mars or Aldebaran, so the count is pathetically local.
Ok, you've excluded the possibility that any of these counted gods might've claimed to be worshiped on any other place un/known to us? :biggrin:
Well, can you accept 2870 as a theoretically reference value and everything else is a fraction there of? Whatever number of deities might have been proposed, that number is normalized to 2870.
Now you are twisting your own words. Have you thought about becoming a politician?
FlexGunship
Jan17-11, 01:22 PM
Now you are twisting your own words. Have you thought about becoming a politician?
No.
Yes.
It's not that the idea hasn't been carefully considered, but rather, the many facets have yet to be mutually resolved.
Should I decide to enter the arena of public service, I would do so in such a way so as to not compromise my dedication to both my family, and my god.
No comment at this time.
Now you are twisting your own words. Have you thought about becoming a politician?
:rofl:
Ok, you've excluded the possibility that any of these counted gods might've claimed to be worshiped on any other place un/known to us? :biggrin:
No, I am just pointing to the fact that the number given is almost for sure underestimated.
No, I am just pointing to the fact that the number given is almost for sure underestimated.
:rofl:
Was the IPU included in the list? I *do* believe in the IPU.
What about the FSM?
Since there is no god TO believe in, then there is no god NOT to believe in. Hence "0" would be the choice for the perfectly atheistic person.
Nyah :tongue:
And "0" is also the perfect answer for a person who has a direction of understanding towards a higher power that is essentially Nothing but higher and more refined levels of Nothing=0 :smile:
no.
yes.
it's not that the idea hasn't been carefully considered, but rather, the many facets have yet to be mutually resolved.
should i decide to enter the arena of public service, i would do so in such a way so as to not compromise my dedication to both my family, and my god.
no comment at this time.
lol..
Ask Terry Pratchet, he knows all about multiple gods.
OmCheeto
Jan17-11, 02:51 PM
I only believe in the gods of PF.
Happy birthday, god of physics.
http://home.europa.com/~garry/bow.gifhttp://home.europa.com/~garry/bow.gifhttp://home.europa.com/~garry/bow.gifhttp://home.europa.com/~garry/bow.gifhttp://home.europa.com/~garry/bow.gifhttp://home.europa.com/~garry/bow.gif
FlexGunship
Jan17-11, 02:56 PM
There's not a single monotheist in the entire forum?!
There's not a single monotheist in the entire forum?!
HELLO!
A little more chicken soup? :!!)
FlexGunship
Jan17-11, 03:06 PM
HELLO!
A little more chicken soup? :!!)
:rofl::rofl::rofl:
Okay... I don't get it. Someone want to help me out?
nismaratwork
Jan17-11, 03:06 PM
Is it just me, or do people seem to be avoiding 2869? Could it be the placement, or... something about the last two digits? Hm. :uhh:
nismaratwork
Jan17-11, 03:07 PM
Okay... I don't get it. Someone want to help me out?
Lacy = Hardcore Monotheist... in the sense that her people have a long tradition of monotheism... actually THE tradition. Before that... monolatrism... can you guess?! CAN YOU?!!!!
FlexGunship
Jan17-11, 03:12 PM
Lacy = Hardcore Monotheist... in the sense that her people have a long tradition of monotheism... actually THE tradition. Before that... monolatrism... can you guess?! CAN YOU?!!!!
Well, that fits quite a few religions.
Judaism was monlatrist, Catholicism is monlatrist (from a certain point of view given all of the saints).
Am I close? I'm not sure if "chicken soup" should tip me off, but I'm not aware of any chicken-worshiping religions.
nismaratwork
Jan17-11, 03:25 PM
Well, that fits quite a few religions.
Judaism was monlatrist, Catholicism is monlatrist (from a certain point of view given all of the saints).
Am I close? I'm not sure if "chicken soup" should tip me off, but I'm not aware of any chicken-worshiping religions.
Judaism! shbingo!
I don't know about the part I bolded, but if not worship there's a clear love and link.
Okay... I don't get it. Someone want to help me out?
You are a victim of your own oversophistication.
FlexGunship
Jan17-11, 03:29 PM
You are a victim of your own oversophistication.
A felony in 23 states.
JaredJames
Jan17-11, 03:33 PM
I have to agree with above. Given I dismiss the idea of a god(s) then I can't "not believe" in any of them. So for me it's a 0. But I'm not sure if I should vote as it would skew the results.
FlexGunship
Jan17-11, 03:36 PM
I have to agree with above. Given I dismiss the idea of a god(s) then I can't "not believe" in any of them. So for me it's a 0. But I'm not sure if I should vote as it would skew the results.
Grr... there's a difference between "believing xxxxx doesn't exist" and "not believing in xxxxx." If you claim you can fly, I can either "not believe it" or "believe you can't." They are different.
Flex getting angry... FLEX SMASH!!!
http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTTWWJwxItrqAcGJc7J3BXOYXPmjjyO5 CDCRRs8CQPLf1mPmIS6
We could fix it by asking "how many gods do you lack belief in?"
JaredJames
Jan17-11, 03:54 PM
I dismiss the whole notion of god(s), therefore there's nothing for me to believe / not believe.
To believe is to accept something - you believe in god, you accept there is a god.
To not believe is to reject something - you don't believe in god, you have entertained there may be one and said "nuh, no chance", for whatever reason that may be.
To dismiss it, I'm not even letting the possibility in. I'm not getting to the point of deciding to believe or not. In my case, I have no reason to even entertain the notion as there is absolutely zero evidence for it. To try to make such a choice on that basis would be ridiculous.
I'm not re-wording the "I don't believe" argument, I'm giving another option.
nismaratwork
Jan17-11, 04:00 PM
A felony in 23 states.
:rofl:
@Borek: :rofl:
SO... anyone going to tackle the 69-gap?
I dismiss the whole notion of god(s), therefore there's nothing for me to believe / not believe.So you lack belief. You don't disbelieve. Correct?
JaredJames
Jan17-11, 04:04 PM
So you lack belief. You don't disbelieve. Correct?
Correct.
Ivan Seeking
Jan17-11, 04:10 PM
Correct.
You are saying that a God might exist but you've seen no evidence?
So you lack belief. You don't disbelieve. Correct?
Why does it make me think about 2nd amendment thread.
You are saying that a God might exist but you've seen no evidence?Lacking belief means you don't even bother to consider the possibility enough to disbelieve. You don't even consider it an option that it could exist.
JaredJames
Jan17-11, 04:18 PM
Lacking belief means you don't even bother to consider the possibility enough to disbelieve. You don't even consider it an option that it could exist.
Thank you evo, couldn't have said it better myself.
The longer the thread, the more I think it should be deleted or moved to philosophy.
FlexGunship
Jan17-11, 04:31 PM
The longer the thread, the more I think it should be deleted or moved to philosophy.
No, please! The thread isn't doing anything wrong... its those silly forum members. They keep arguing about minutia. The thread itself has actually been very well-behaved!
Furthermore, I was told that it made an anonymous contribution to your favorite charity.
No, please! The thread isn't doing anything wrong... its those silly forum members. They keep arguing about minutia. The thread itself has actually been very well-behaved!
Furthermore, I was told that it made an anonymous contribution to your favorite charity.
I think you'ld do a good diplomat. :biggrin:
Math Is Hard
Jan17-11, 04:53 PM
The longer the thread, the more I think it should be deleted or moved to philosophy.
Sorry, it doesn't meet the Phil guidelines.
nismaratwork
Jan17-11, 06:02 PM
Sorry, it doesn't meet the Phil guidelines.
I like the new Phil guidelines more than this thread. :biggrin:
╔(σ_σ)╝
Jan17-11, 06:54 PM
This thread is lame. :-)
nismaratwork
Jan18-11, 01:03 AM
This thread is lame. :-)
You have an interesting sense of humor, but I like it.
The longer the thread, the more I think it should be deleted or moved to philosophy.
Because we all know, General Discussion is not the place for long threads :P
AlephZero
Jan18-11, 07:27 AM
We could fix it by asking "how many gods do you lack belief in?"
That only fixes it if you can prove the existence of at least one god.
Otherwise, it is in the same "meaningless words" category as a variation on Bertrand Russell's standard example, "how many kings of the USA have been bald".
That only fixes it if you can prove the existence of at least one god.
Otherwise, it is in the same "meaningless words" category as a variation on Bertrand Russell's standard example, "how many kings of the USA have been bald".
You guys forgot how to have fun. Just enjoy the freaking irony of this thread. Have fun! :P
AlephZero
Jan18-11, 07:37 AM
You guys forgot how to have fun. Just enjoy the freaking irony of this thread. Have fun! :P
"I don't do irony. I send my shirts to the laundry."
-- Scott Adams
FlexGunship
Jan18-11, 08:15 AM
You have an interesting sense of humor, but I like it.
Why "but"? Shouldn't you say "and"?
"You have an interesting sense of humor, AND I like it."
What a curious distinction you've made!
Nismar, you seem to be very intelligent, but I like you.
"2869" for me. I'm a monotheist. I believe in myself.
nismaratwork
Jan18-11, 10:42 AM
Why "but"? Shouldn't you say "and"?
"You have an interesting sense of humor, AND I like it."
What a curious distinction you've made!
Nismar, you seem to be very intelligent, but I like you.
Good point, you have a good sense of humor, AND I like it, and you. I can only plead a deep need for sleep!
And I just LOVE this thread. It breaks the surface tension. I use soap a lot to make bubbles.
I love bubbles. They are light, float away, break, the dross falls to the earth and 0 remains.
I also think this can be a good way to think in abstracts by playing without hurting anyone. :biggrin:
FlexGunship
Jan18-11, 10:56 AM
Good point, you have a good sense of humor, AND I like it, and you.
Geeze, dude, calm down... you're acting all, like, you want to hold hands, or something... pfffst...
FlexGunship
Jan18-11, 10:59 AM
From this:
And I just LOVE this thread. It breaks the surface tension.
To this:
I use soap a lot to make bubbles. I love bubbles.
In nothing but a single space-bar hit. Admirable if not mildly incomprehensible.
nismaratwork
Jan18-11, 12:35 PM
Geeze, dude, calm down... you're acting all, like, you want to hold hands, or something... pfffst...
... I can't quit you... :biggrin:
FlexGunship
Jan18-11, 12:46 PM
... I can't quit you... :biggrin:
I'm never gonna' give you up, Nismar. Never gonna' let you down.
http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRmsF0rUttc78I_cICMxne0wBg2TQ3aB 5SSCDPdCZ-Yv2tLjhzY
nismaratwork
Jan18-11, 12:51 PM
I'm never gonna' give you up, Nismar. Never gonna' let you down.
http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRmsF0rUttc78I_cICMxne0wBg2TQ3aB 5SSCDPdCZ-Yv2tLjhzY
I hate you for putting Rick bloody Astley in my head. I have to go stick a coat-hanger up my nose now, and try to fish out, THE BAD SONG!!!...
... never gonna turn around, and hurt you!
ARRRGH!!!
FlexGunship
Jan18-11, 12:53 PM
Is it just me, or are the poll results really interesting? Of the theistic crowd: 25% believe in one god, 25% believe in three gods, and 50% believe in ALLLLLLLL of the gods.
I mean, just imagine, you could invent a god and be like: "hey, I just invented this god--" and they would be like: "no way! Tell me about him so I can believe in him!"
JaredJames
Jan18-11, 01:13 PM
I mean, just imagine, you could invent a god and be like: "hey, I just invented this god--" and they would be like: "no way! Tell me about him so I can believe in him!"
Well strictly speaking, I was under the impression that's how it works anyway... :wink:
From this:
To this:
In nothing but a single space-bar hit. Admirable if not mildly incomprehensible.
Yeah! Thank you. :smile: "mildly incomprehensible" is this like mild hot sauce? :biggrin:
We are going places! :rofl:
Love and laughter= light release.
FlexGunship
Jan18-11, 04:27 PM
Love and laughter= light release.
Just a light release? Well, let me know when you're ready for the whole thing.
nismaratwork
Jan18-11, 04:30 PM
Just a light release? Well, let me know when you're ready for the whole thing.
Oh man... now the phrase, "full release" is just rattling around my head like a penny in duct-work! Pure evil man...puuuure evil. Now it's Rick Astley singing full release. Great... I'm going to have some really weird dreams now. :tongue:
Thank you for not having made me a man! Thank you for not having made me a slave!
Signed,
Freedom!!~
nismaratwork
Jan19-11, 06:50 AM
Thank you for not having made me a man! Thank you for not having made me a slave!
Signed,
Freedom!!~
Oh, come on now, really?! OK, we're not always the brightest or cleanest creatures, but thank god?! :cry:
*talks to groin* "It's OK lads, she didn't mean a word of it, stop crying!!!!"
:rofl:
Oh, I am going to the bad place, whatever and wherever that is...
note: Not having made me a slave? Is that a traditional ending to prayer or are you intimating about just which organs are in charge of guys? In case you're wondering the organ is:....
... The Phneebenhompherfrackabrack! It's a little-known organ first isolated by Mary Poppins and the Marx Brothers.
Oh, come on now, really?! OK, we're not always the brightest or cleanest creatures, but thank god?! :cry:
*talks to groin* "It's OK lads, she didn't mean a word of it, stop crying!!!!"
:rofl:
Oh, I am going to the bad place, whatever and wherever that is...
note: Not having made me a slave? Is that a traditional ending to prayer or are you intimating about just which organs are in charge of guys? In case you're wondering the organ is:....
... The Phneebenhompherfrackabrack! It's a little-known organ first isolated by Mary Poppins and the Marx Brothers.
The answer is Both. Thank you for asking.
Well indeed very small but well known :surprised.... to some.
To the OP, I think you might consider adding "how many do you not believe in but fear going to some place, whatever and where ever that may NOT be... :biggrin:
Why ever would Mary Poppins feel a need to isolate Phnee ben hompher frackabrack? Was he not behaving?
Oh Dear! :blushing:
*talks to groin* "It's OK lads, she didn't mean a word of it, stop crying!!!!"
:rofl:
How many little lads do you have staying with you? Poor Dear. :redface:
FlexGunship
Jan19-11, 01:16 PM
To the OP, I think you might consider adding "how many do you not believe in but fear going to some place, whatever and where ever that may NOT be... :biggrin:
Ah, the converse of Pascal's wager? Or is it inverse? You've asked that question in a profoundly confusing way.
nismaratwork
Jan19-11, 01:31 PM
The answer is Both. Thank you for asking.
Well indeed very small but well known :surprised.... to some.
To the OP, I think you might consider adding "how many do you not believe in but fear going to some place, whatever and where ever that may NOT be... :biggrin:
Why ever would Mary Poppins feel a need to isolate Phnee ben hompher frackabrack? Was he not behaving?
Oh Dear! :blushing:
How many little lads do you have staying with you? Poor Dear. :redface:
Hmmm, if you mean do we fear going to, "the bad place"... probably not... if you mean a fear of possible extinction, I think the universal answer would be yes.
Oh, and Phnee would have to be one unlucky guy to be the son of Hompher! Kids can be cruel, but I think that's a name-set that would really haunt a kid.
Flex: It's a decent wager, but it's not called a wager for nothing. Personally, I decline, but I know some atheists so superstitious that it may as well be religious sans organization.
DevilsAvocado
Jan19-11, 04:23 PM
"hey, I just invented this god--"
Not so fast my dear lad. All new inventions must be approved by the Supernatural Patent Office. My client has since the beginning of time been in office as the head clerk.
In case your invention is not sufficiently incompatible with the other 2870, and thus capable of creating a great deal of pandemonium, it will not be accepted. End of story.
If you do not get the point – we have all the papers ready for a comprehensive lawsuit, thank god.
http://i51.tinypic.com/fwmv76.png
So many Lads, so little time.
:rofl: :devil: :rofl:...
Insanity
Jan19-11, 05:30 PM
What about the Great Green Arkleseizure? or Almighty Bob?
drankin
Jan19-11, 05:32 PM
:bugeye:
So if I only believe in one God, then I don't believe in zero gods, right? This is a similar type of poll used in politics. Confusing enough to get the desired result by the pollster.
:bugeye:
So if I only believe in one God, then I don't believe in zero gods, right? This is a similar type of poll used in politics. Confusing enough to get the desired result by the pollster.If there are 2,870 gods and you only believe in one then you don't believe in 2,869. That would be your choice.
drankin
Jan19-11, 06:26 PM
If there are 2,870 gods and you only believe in one then you don't believe in 2,869. That would be your choice.
But not 0 could mean 1 as well. And who counts these things anyway?? Poor guy.
DevilsAvocado
Jan19-11, 06:33 PM
So many Lads, so little time.
:rofl: :devil: :rofl:...
Yup. The only reason for time is so that every lad doesn't happen ... at once ... http://planetsmilies.net/confused-smiley-17512.gif
Chicken soup? Yes please! http://planetsmilies.net/eat-drink-smiley-7819.gif
But not 0 could mean 1 as well. And who counts these things anyway?? Poor guy.No he explains it in the OP. Choosing zero means that means that you believe in all gods because the number of gods that you "don't believe" in are zero. In other words, out of 2,870, you choose to disbelieve none, which means you believe in all.
DevilsAvocado
Jan19-11, 06:48 PM
But not 0 could mean 1 as well. And who counts these things anyway??
I think the Indian scholar Pingala counts all the 0 and 1, but it’s a mess, because 10 means you’re something between a monotheist and polytheist... http://planetsmilies.net/confused-smiley-17525.gif
nismaratwork
Jan19-11, 06:55 PM
I think the Indian scholar Pingala counts all the 0 and 1, but it’s a mess, because 10 means you’re something between a monotheist and polytheist... http://planetsmilies.net/confused-smiley-17525.gif
A monolatrist?
So how exactly would an agnostic fit into your scheme?
FlexGunship
Jan19-11, 10:29 PM
Flex: It's a decent wager, but it's not called a wager for nothing. Personally, I decline, but I know some atheists so superstitious that it may as well be religious sans organization.
It's really not a decent wager. It's an intellectual-coward's wager. Pascal's wager is a thinly veiled threat not different from the threat Catholic priests would hurl at my every Sunday until I was 18.
No he explains it in the OP.
I thought I actually did pretty well with the explanation. Sheesh. Sorry, everyone.
So how exactly would an agnostic fit into your scheme?
Uh, I guess I don't know. Agnostic seems a little silly at this point, doesn't it? I mean, what data are you realistically waiting for? A few more miracles?
Sorry... that sounded rude. I didn't mean it like that... bad night, everyone.
Ivan Seeking
Jan20-11, 01:24 AM
not different from the threat Catholic priests would hurl at my every Sunday until I was 18.
So it isn't just me! I can understand their position. :rofl:
:biggrin:
It's really not a decent wager. It's an intellectual-coward's wager. Pascal's wager is a thinly veiled threat
A threat, but not veiled.
Math Is Hard
Jan20-11, 02:10 AM
What is "thinly-veiled" here is a dig at people of faith. We're pushing hard against the religious discussion guidelines.
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