Understanding the Causes of Vibrations in Systems

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    Vibrations
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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers on the causes of vibrations in various systems, exploring the distinctions between thermal energy and other forms of energy that contribute to vibrations. It encompasses theoretical considerations and conceptual clarifications regarding mechanical and atomic vibrations.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant asserts that vibrations do not originate from thermal energy, suggesting that they arise from the inherent energy of a system, such as a spring with masses.
  • Another participant argues that the energy in the system, which causes vibrations, is related to thermal energy, but emphasizes that external forces are necessary to impart energy to the system.
  • A different viewpoint highlights that the cause of vibrations varies by system, noting that atomic vibrations are due to thermal energy, while larger mechanical systems experience vibrations from other forces, such as torque or external manipulation.
  • One participant proposes an analogy of electromagnetic forces as springs, explaining that interactions at the atomic level, influenced by infrared energy, lead to molecular vibrations, which they equate with thermal energy, while also noting the disorder of these vibrations.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the relationship between thermal energy and the causes of vibrations, with no consensus reached on whether vibrations stem solely from thermal energy or from other external forces. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the definitions and implications of energy types in relation to vibrations.

Contextual Notes

Participants rely on varying definitions of energy and its sources, leading to potential misunderstandings. The discussion does not resolve the complexities of how different energy forms contribute to vibrations across different systems.

Valkyrie_Lenneth
I would like to think that: vibrations do not come from thermal energy.

A spring with two masses at each end of that spring do not vibrate due to thermal energy of the air around. That system vibrate because :when the spring is stretched, it creat a force pulling the two masses toward each other, but when the two masses are too close to each other, the spring create a force pushing the two masses apart.
That process goes on and on,which is called vibration.

So , fre vibrations of a system come from the own energy of that system.
 
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I believe that the "energy of that system" to which you refer is the same thing physicists are speaking of when they say "thermal energy" of a system. But even in this illustration, the energy had to come from an outside source. In the case of the wieghts on a spring, it is not heat from the sarrounding air that puts energy into the system, but some external force moving the weights.
 
The cause of a vibration depends on the system you are examining.
If you are looking at atoms, they vibrate due to thermal energy.
If you look at a larger mechanical system, the vibration is typically due to some other force. For example, a spinning rod or wheel that is not balanced (torque/angular momentum) in an engine/transmission system, or a guitar string that has been pushed.
But the underlying reason is Kinetic Energy.
 
If you imagine that the electromagnetic force between atoms are springs. Through the life time of these interacting atoms, they will be jostled by a whole host of things. For example infra red energy will interact with the electromagnetic field of the electons in the atom/molecule. Imparting energy to the bounds between the atoms. As energy is not destroyed, one place that the energy manifests is the vibration of these particles. So what you say is correct,vibrations do not come from thermal energy. Molecular vibrations ARE thermal energy.
The interesting thing about these vibrations or heat, is they are highly disorded. So converting this energy to some thing else is very difficult/impossible. Without heating something else.

Duncan

Ohh I like this character counter ggggggggggggggrrrrrrrrrrrooooooooww.
 

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