Quasars,white dwarf and neutron stars

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around quasars, white dwarfs, and neutron stars, exploring their characteristics, formation, and differences in composition. Participants delve into the nature of quasars as galaxies with supermassive black holes and the distinctions between white dwarfs and neutron stars, including the processes involved in their formation and stability.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that quasars are highly active, distant galaxies with supermassive black holes at their centers, actively consuming matter.
  • Others propose that quasars may represent an earlier stage in the evolution of galaxies, particularly during a period when they were more numerous in the universe.
  • It is suggested that neutron stars are composed primarily of neutrons, formed when electrons and protons combine under extreme gravitational pressure, although there is debate about the stability of neutrons in this context.
  • Some participants clarify that white dwarfs are remnants of smaller stars where atomic structure remains intact, while neutron stars represent a more extreme state of matter.
  • There is a discussion about the nature of supermassive black holes and why they appear to be active primarily in quasars, despite being present in most galaxies.
  • One participant mentions the phenomenon of superluminal velocities in jets associated with certain astronomical objects, attributing this to relativistic effects rather than actual faster-than-light travel.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express varying views on the nature and implications of quasars, as well as the processes involved in the formation of neutron stars and white dwarfs. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the stability of neutrons within neutron stars and the conditions under which quasars are active.

Contextual Notes

Some claims about quasars and their evolutionary significance depend on specific interpretations of astronomical data, and the discussion includes references to relativistic effects that may not be universally accepted. Additionally, the stability of neutrons in neutron stars is presented with conflicting viewpoints.

sage
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quasars are highly active but extremely distant galaxies, right?what kind of galaxies are they and do they represent an earlier stage of the lives of the conventional galaxies?i've a vague idea that quasars a galaxies in which the supermassive black holes at the centres are actively gobbling up matter. am i right?

what exactly is the difference between a white dwarf and a neutron star in terms of composition. are neutron stars made of neutrons?where did the protons go. please clarify.
 
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Quasars a galaxies that seem to be radiating a lot more energy than normal galaxies. It is believed, but not confirmed, that this is due to black holes at their centres releasing gravitational energy as matter falls into it.

Quavers, on the other hand, are a cheesy corn snack. They're floaty light.

Yes, neutron stars are made of neutrons. White dwarves with more than 1.4 solar masses can collapse under their own gravity, becoming more and more dense. This gravity ultimately forces the electrons and protons in the star's atoms to forge neutrons. A typical neutron star may have many solar masses in a volume with a radius the size of a large city.
 
I'm not up to date on the latest explanation of quasars, but I can help on the second problem.

At core collapse, the mass of a neutron star core is so great that the electrostatic forces that keep the atoms apart is overcome. The electrons and protons combine to form neutrons (like normal beta decay in reverse) and as neutrons aren't repulsed from each other (as protons are) the neutrons form one big mass - like a huge atomic nuclei.
The density of this is huge and the size remarkably small.


A White dwarf is the remainder of a smaller star and here the atoms remain intact (although under enormous pressure). A white Dwarf is incredibly hot (100,000 deg) and will slowly cool down over billions of years.
 
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Adrian Baker said:
At core collapse, the mass of a neutron star core is so great that the electrostatic forces that keep the atoms apart is overcome. The electrons and protons combine to form neutrons (like normal beta decay in reverse) and as neutrons aren't repulsed from each other (as protons are) the neutrons form one big mass - like a huge atomic nuclei.
Neutrons actually are repulsed from one another. They are Fermions and they obey the Pauli exclusion principle - they resist being packed into the same quantum state as their identical neighbors. It is this repulsion that keeps the neutron star from further collapse, although as you pointed out, it is already a VERY degenerate form of matter.
 
sage said:
quasars are highly active but extremely distant galaxies, right?what kind of galaxies are they and do they represent an earlier stage of the lives of the conventional galaxies?i've a vague idea that quasars a galaxies in which the supermassive black holes at the centres are actively gobbling up matter. am i right?

what exactly is the difference between a white dwarf and a neutron star in terms of composition. are neutron stars made of neutrons?where did the protons go. please clarify.

You hit the nail on the head. The most probable explanation for quasars is that they contained SMBHs gulping down matter. They represent an early stage in the evolution of galaxies; quasars were very numerous in the era known as the "http://www.jb.man.ac.uk/merlin/nam/dragns/cosmology.html ", that occurred between 1 billion and 3 billion years of the life of the Universe. In the local Universe, quasars are not so abundant, because they "shed their skin" to become normal galaxies
 
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what are DRAGNs meteor?
aren't neutrons on their own, a very unstable particle?then how do they remain stable within a neutron star?every galaxy seems to have a supermassive black hole at its core-so why are they active within the quasars only?
 
sage said:
what are DRAGNs meteor?
I'm not Meteor, but here is a thumbnailed gallery. These objects are double-lobed emission events. If you believe that the redshift of the emitting object is entirely cosmological, and place these emitting objects at the distances suggested by these redshifts, you will find that the materials in the jets often moves at superluminal velocities - even 6-10x lightspeed. This is blithely explained as an optical illusion arising from the orientation of the jets almost directly at us.

http://www.jb.man.ac.uk/atlas/icon.html
 
haha, I remember my high school physics teacher telling me someone had found something traveling faster than the speed of light. It was one of these things. I have always wanted to tell him he was wrong!
 
Unless the axes of all those objects are exactly normal to our line of sight then there will be relativistic perspective effects producing the appearance of superluminal expansion.

Garth
 

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