Where Did the Electrons Go During Rutherford's Experiment?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion centers around the interactions of alpha particles and electrons during Rutherford's gold foil experiment, exploring the nature of these interactions and the implications for atomic structure. Participants examine whether alpha particles hit electrons and the consequences of such interactions, delving into theoretical interpretations and the historical context of the experiment.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions whether alpha particles hit electrons during bombardment and speculates on their fate.
  • Another participant clarifies that Rutherford's experiment focused on the deflection of alpha particles rather than absorption, suggesting that alpha particles would ionize electrons rather than interact directly with them.
  • A participant explains that the deflection of alpha particles occurs primarily due to interactions with atomic nuclei, not electrons, which have minimal impact on the alpha particles' paths.
  • One participant proposes a hypothesis that electrons may not have been present as particles during the experiment, suggesting they behave as waves under certain conditions.
  • Another participant compares the size of alpha particles to electrons, arguing that the small size of electrons does not significantly affect the trajectory of alpha particles.
  • There is mention of the dual wave-particle nature of electrons, with a participant noting that theories regarding this property were not fully developed until later in history.
  • A question is raised about deep inelastic collisions of electrons, which seems to introduce a different topic into the discussion.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the nature of electron interactions with alpha particles, with some emphasizing the negligible effect of electrons and others proposing alternative interpretations of electron behavior. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the specifics of these interactions.

Contextual Notes

Participants reference historical assumptions about atomic structure, such as the "Plum Pudding" model, and the evolution of theories regarding electron behavior, indicating a dependence on the development of scientific understanding over time.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to those studying atomic physics, the historical context of scientific experiments, or the wave-particle duality of electrons.

benzun_1999
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Dear reader,
Did the alpha particles hit the electrons during the alpha particle bombardment? if so where did they go?

-benzun
 
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Er hmm... Rutherford's experiment referred to the deflection of alpha particles, not their absorption. Their detector lacked the sophistication to working out anything to do with that.

alpha - electron interactions? One would expect the alpha particle to simply ionise the particle, and become a helium atom. As far as I know, of course.
 
Are you referring to Rutherford's famous experiment, the one where he fired alpha particles at a thin sheet of gold, expecting them to go through the sheet which a majority of did but some reflected off or were deflected at odd angles? if so then...

The alpha particles that were almost completely reflected hit the nuclei of an atom. An atom's nuclei is massive (full of mass) but compared to at entire atoms radius they are tiny which is why so few were reflected. This is why Rutherford was quoted 'It's like firing a shell at a sheet of paper, and the shell bouncing back' It was that suprising to him because before that he had accepted the traditional 'Plum Puddiing' assumption of atomic structure.

The alpha particles that were deflected off and less obtuse angles where, so did not follow the beam, were repelled by the charge of the nucleus of the gold atoms. The electrons had very little-no deciding factor in the path of the alpha particles.

Im not sure if this has helped answer your question or if you wanted a more detailed answer but oh well, this is the best i can give!
 
yes ...

Yes i am talking about the experiment you mentioned but I am not clear adout the answer you gave. i feel that the alpha particels must have not hit the electrons as electrons were not there due to the reason that they were waves then. as per my hypothesis electronsonly act as particles when an another wave interacts with it.

-benzun
The more the dimentions we know, more we know.
 
Um yeah... riiiiiiight... theory development, anyone?

- Warren
 
The electrons are simply to small to effect the passage of an alpha particle. How much is the path of your car effected when a bug splats on the windshield?
 
Well, next year is the return of the 17 year cidadas. Enough of them splat on your windshield and you can't see where you're going. Good thing alpha particles don't have drivers. They could really have screwed up the data.

Njorl
 
Yeah if u think about it an alpha particle is a He2+ ion, so is approximately 3000 times (i think) the size of an electron so there is no worries about electrons, even with their high mass/charge ratio, affecting the path of the alpha particles. :smile: Electrons are seen as waves AND particles depending on the way their interactions are explained. Because theories on electrons having wave like properties, hadnt really been developed until Einstein was around, electrons are classed as particles. If they were waves anyway, surely the interactions would have no affect, all they would do is provide energy but in not enough proportions to affect a high energy stream of massive particles
 
does anyone mean the deep inelastic collision of electrons?
 
  • #10
I shouldn't think so...what's that anyway?
 

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