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The fine line between marriage and divorce...

by rhody
Tags: divorce, fine, line, marriage
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rhody
#1
Sep29-11, 04:46 PM
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I found Iris Kraznow's article was interesting, she packs a number of assertions in her article, enough for a fair discussion. I normally don't post here, but I thought it would be good for members for confirm or refute her findings based on:
I'm just coming off 200 interviews and two years of listening to mature wives reflect on -- or moan about -- how they are managing to stick it out in long marriages. Scenes from their relationships that range from 15 to 70 years are woven together in my new book, The Secret Lives of Wives: Women Share What It Really Takes To Stay Married coming out in early October.
Rhody...
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Evo
#2
Sep29-11, 04:52 PM
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I decided that I'd rather be alone than in an unhappy marriage.
Jimmy Snyder
#3
Sep29-11, 06:18 PM
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It stands to reason that people think about divorce more than they actually engage in it. Now we have anecdotal evidence as well, 200 cases of it. The centrifugal forces are tremendous in any group of people living together and one example of people living together is a married couple. About the only centripetal force in that case is the expense and bother of a divorce. In the US, half of marriages end in divorce. I wonder what percentage of non-marriage setups break apart. I mean shacking up, or communes, or apartment sharing, etc. What are the average lengths of these relationships?

Ivan Seeking
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Sep30-11, 12:36 AM
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The fine line between marriage and divorce...

Marriage isn't just about being in love. It is also a partnership and a life you build together.

My chapter called Separate Summers is filled with women who take their own vacations, take their own summers, take charge of their own lives. Couples who allow each other to grow separately are the ones with the best chance of growing together and staying together.
That's why my office and man cave is 400 feet from the house.
rhody
#5
Oct3-11, 12:31 PM
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This is controversial from the article:
My biggest shock is how many outwardly cheerful women who have been married forever think about divorce if not weekly, at least once a month.
Do any of you think this way ? To be fair, lets apply it to men too, and for young people, would you say your parent's contemplate divorce ?

Rhody...
FlexGunship
#6
Oct3-11, 12:36 PM
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I consider divorce constantly, and I'm not even married.
rhody
#7
Oct3-11, 02:10 PM
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Quote Quote by FlexGunship View Post
I consider divorce constantly, and I'm not even married.
Flex,

Understand, I was hoping to generate some funny stories, with names changed to protect the innocent or guilty, please feel free to add some that may entertain us.

Rhody...
rhody
#8
Oct12-11, 02:42 PM
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One last gasp to keep this thread alive... from the article...

I can't use my "I hope this thread dies trick" more than once, now, can I ?
The biggest shocker is the number of wives in stable unions who frequently contemplate fleeing their marriages. These are not abused wives; they are women with nice husbands who give them orgasms and jewelry and stability.
and
Maybe they were simply sick of being around each other. And maybe one or both of them finally couldn't take it any more.
and
Finally, the wives with the highest marital satisfaction have a tight circle of wild women friends with whom to drink, travel and vent about their husbands.
For men, the same thought applies, substitute fishing rods for jewelry... and male friends...

Rhody...
rhody
#9
Oct14-11, 05:49 AM
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Blub, blub, blub.... time for this thread to meet it's maker, since there are no takers, at least I ended it with a rhyme...

Rhody...
FlexGunship
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Oct14-11, 08:02 AM
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Quote Quote by rhody View Post
blub, blub, blub.... Time for this thread to meet it's maker, since there are no takers, at least i ended it with a rhyme...

Rhody...
c-c-c-c-c-combo breaker!!
SNRote
#11
Nov2-11, 10:48 AM
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Evo, I agree with you. I'd rather be alone than in an unhappy marriage. I have been married for 5 years and just not willing to compromise my happiness anymore. I filed for divorce and am moving out immediately. The movers are coming this weekend. We both need space from each other.
Evo
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Nov2-11, 08:15 PM
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Quote Quote by SNRote View Post
Evo, I agree with you. I'd rather be alone than in an unhappy marriage. I have been married for 5 years and just not willing to compromise my happiness anymore. I filed for divorce and am moving out immediately. The movers are coming this weekend. We both need space from each other.
Sorry to hear it didn't work out, it takes more guts to admit it's not working than to suffer through it.

Hope things work out for you and that you find happiness again. At least you given yourself and your spouse the chance to start over. Kudos to you.
Mépris
#13
Nov3-11, 02:20 AM
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@Rhody: I think both my parents secretly do. I've observed that they are still together simply because it's "convenient" and not because they particular want to. They're fairly old, have grown used to each other's little habits, the children (who are adults now. lol?) and I suppose it's also because it's safe. I might be wrong but hey, I've been living them for the past eighteen years. :)
One should also note that it was an arranged marriage. I'm not too familiar with their socio-historic context but my understanding is that this was the norm here up until recently.

In my experience, relationships need to have a lot of effort put into them and largely because of that, they don't last as long as the parties concerned would like them to. What happens is that they slowly rot, sometimes the mess is cleaned and eventually, those involved move on to new relationships. After a while, that "spark" that was once there is lost and what used to be exciting gets very monotonous.

With living being already monotonous as it is, I don't think it's fair that people should willingly put themselves through such things and I find that moving on to other relationships is for the better, in the grand scheme of things.

This is something that I've been observing with my friends as of late and I strongly suspect that within the next few months, they will move on.
Edin_Dzeko
#14
Nov4-11, 01:51 AM
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Quote Quote by rhody View Post
One last gasp to keep this thread alive... from the article...

I can't use my "I hope this thread dies trick" more than once, now, can I ?

and

and

For men, the same thought applies, substitute fishing rods for jewelry... and male friends...

Rhody...

Interesting but the way I see it, you can't really manipulate marriage in a lab like some typical science experiment. There are several factors that come into play when it comes to marriage. So those statements about the group of women don't necessarily apply to everybody and every marriage.

What I derived from those specific quotes above is that, even when you're married, each person needs their individual space
Edin_Dzeko
#15
Nov4-11, 02:03 AM
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Quote Quote by Mépris View Post
@Rhody: I think both my parents secretly do. I've observed that they are still together simply because it's "convenient" and not because they particular want to. They're fairly old, have grown used to each other's little habits, the children (who are adults now. lol?) and I suppose it's also because it's safe. I might be wrong but hey, I've been living them for the past eighteen years. :)
One should also note that it was an arranged marriage.
I'm not too familiar with their socio-historic context but my understanding is that this was the norm here up until recently.

In my experience, relationships need to have a lot of effort put into them and largely because of that, they don't last as long as the parties concerned would like them to. What happens is that they slowly rot, sometimes the mess is cleaned and eventually, those involved move on to new relationships. After a while, that "spark" that was once there is lost and what used to be exciting gets very monotonous.

With living being already monotonous as it is, I don't think it's fair that people should willingly put themselves through such things and I find that moving on to other relationships is for the better, in the grand scheme of things.

This is something that I've been observing with my friends as of late and I strongly suspect that within the next few months, they will move on.
[1] well you don't really know like you pointed out in the ending of that paragraph. you could be wrong. when their alone you don't know what they do / say so your observations are not enough to come to such a conclusion.

[2] Not just effort but equal effort from both sides which ultimately boils down to the two people wanting the same thing out of the relationship. sometimes they are on different pages in-terms of what they want out of the relationship and that determines the amount of effort that's put in. relationships that are based primarily on sexual desire, appeal in beauty tend to lose "spark". because what happens if someone comes by who is better looking? what happens when you get tired of the sex? people who see more in their spouse other than beauty and sex tend to last longer. beauty fades.

[3] how is it not fair? they're not being forced and are doing it out of will. that right there cancels unfairness out of the equation. if people understand the commitment that was required in marriage, then they would make wise, hard though decisions about who they are marrying before they say, "I do". consider the vows that are exchanged between two married people and what those vows really mean.

problem is, since a tender age the idea that if "I date this guy/girl and I get bored then I'll just break up and go for the next thing on the block" has been engraved into the minds of teens so that mindset gets taken into the marriage.
Mépris
#16
Nov4-11, 07:46 AM
P: 830
My parents watch TV and travel to work together. When they're not doing that, they're sleeping or working. Neither of which are activities they engage in with the other. ;)

Sure, it does fade - I never implied otherwise, iirc. How 'bout this one: people change.

I don't think it's fair on both parties if they force themselves to make something work. As you said, people won't necessarily stay in phase forever.

Too much of a generalisation. Think about what you said. Think there might be some deeper issues in there. Had a bad high school experience, perhaps?

Anyway, I don't necessarily think that what you say is true. Perhaps it's a phenomenon that you seem to see in people you know/talk to. While I don't like the idea of being married at all, maybe when it comes to it, I might change my mind. I personally don't see what a marriage can do for one that a monogamous domestic partnership can't.
cmb
#17
Nov4-11, 08:04 AM
P: 628
Can't live with 'em. Can't live without 'em!

I reckon the optimum number of married partners to have is around 0.3, but unfortunately they only come in integer values. Thinking about divorce every so often is therefore an attempt at 'PWM'-ing the on-or-off status of marriage to the preferred value. It's why many re-marry after divorce.

The most successful, divorce-free marriages I have seen are where;
a) one partner fully, and genuinely, hands over responsibility for the married life, has no ambitions other that to perform their task [whether employed or housekeeping] and will defer on all decisions to the other partner,
b) both are happy to go off to do 'their own thing' and live their own lives for >50% of the time,
c) argue like cat-and-dog (let's off steam) but forget immediately what they were arguing about.

The bad marriages typically occur where;
a) one is, or both are, totally infatuated with the other at the outset, because this never lasts and new ambitions (work/love-life) evolve
b) one feels ignored when the other explores their own pursuits,
c) argue like cat-and-dog and have long memories of what they were arguing about.
Edin_Dzeko
#18
Nov4-11, 12:07 PM
P: 223
Quote Quote by Mépris View Post
My parents watch TV and travel to work together. When they're not doing that, they're sleeping or working. Neither of which are activities they engage in with the other. ;)

Sure, it does fade - I never implied otherwise, iirc. How 'bout this one: people change.

I don't think it's fair on both parties if they force themselves to make something work. As you said, people won't necessarily stay in phase forever.

Too much of a generalisation. Think about what you said. Think there might be some deeper issues in there. Had a bad high school experience, perhaps?

Anyway, I don't necessarily think that what you say is true. Perhaps it's a phenomenon that you seem to see in people you know/talk to. While I don't like the idea of being married at all, maybe when it comes to it, I might change my mind. I personally don't see what a marriage can do for one that a monogamous domestic partnership can't.
[1] No one is forcing them so I don't see where this idea of unfairness comes in. There's no gun to a head or knife to a throat. It's the individual's choice to stay in or not. There's something called commitment. You don't just walk out, or leave [file for a divorce].

[2] Why don't you bet money on the answer to that if you're a wo(man)? No didn't have a bad experience in h.s. Never did.

[3] In your initial post you brought it all together by making a reference to your friends. That's what I consider "people you know/talk to". If anything your post was centered around your folks and your friends. Not enough to arrive at your conclusions.

[4] There lies the problem. You don't like marriages / have a bad view of marriages to begin with that's the reason for what you're writing.


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