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Japan Earthquake: nuclear plants

 
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Aug1-12, 06:19 PM   #13584
 
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Japan Earthquake: nuclear plants


Quote by Tepconium-311 View Post
Reinforced structures, gas lines and all this don't really matter in an exclusion zone, I guess.
And, how much is the genetic degenerative damage to be valued? Is genetic health of later generations a "priority" at all?
If you could ask your descendants seven generations later, they might strongly disagree with today's "priorities"....
The 15,867 deaths from the Fukushima quake and tsunami are documented. The collapsed structures, fires, and flooding that killed them matter. They'll have no further descendants. The future genetic damage you refer to, though perhaps serious, is speculative.
 
Aug2-12, 04:12 AM   #13585
 
Quote by Tepconium-311 View Post
And, how much is the genetic degenerative damage to be valued? Is genetic health of later generations a "priority" at all?
If you could ask your descendants seven generations later, they might strongly disagree with today's "priorities".
By the speed genetic engineering is moving, in a hundred years or so we will be able to "dial a genome" of our children.
 
Aug2-12, 11:01 AM   #13586

Nuclear Engineering 2012
 
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Quote by tsutsuji View Post

Here is the program with English titles when provided or translations of Japanese titles:


Workshop on Tokyo Electric Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant accident - distributed documents


Index

http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...23/program.pdf Program (Japanese)

July 23 (meeting hall A)

AM-1 Session: accident events analysis (1)

http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...723/AM-1-1.pdf Tepco, Detailed analysis of the accident progression of Units 1 to 3 by using MAAP code (some Japanese, some English)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...723/AM-1-2.pdf JNES, Accident Sequence Analysis of Unit 1 to 3 Using MELCOR Code (English)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...723/AM-1-3.pdf JAEA, Analysis for Accident Progression with THALES2 Code (English)

AM-2 Session: accident events analysis (2)

http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...723/AM-2-1.pdf Toshiba, Hitachi-GE, Study for the leakage potential of PCV which have suffered by the condition of Fukushima accident (Japanese)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...2-2%281%29.pdf JNES, Analysis of reactor water level and PCV pressure and temperature in the hypothesis of very small piping leaks: (1) Reactor water level analysis using RELAPS5 Code (Japanese)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai.../AM-2-2(2).pdf JNES, Analysis of reactor water level and PCV pressure and temperature in the hypothesis of very small piping leaks: (2) PCV pressure and temperature analysis using MELCOR Code (Japanese)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...723/AM-2-3.pdf JNES, Accident sequence analysis using event tree of level 1 PSA (some Japanese, some English)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...723/AM-2-4.pdf JNES, Analysis of concrete erosion depth caused by melted fuel (Japanese)

AM-3 Session: estimates of released quantities

http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...723/AM-3-1.pdf JNES, Source Term Analysis Using MELCOR Code (English)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...723/AM-3-2.pdf Tepco, Estimation of radioactive release resulting from Fukushima Dai-ichi NPS accident (English)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...723/AM-3-3.pdf JAEA, Estimation of Time Trend of Atmospheric Releases on 131I and 137Cs (English)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...723/AM-3-4.pdf CRIEPI, Direct release rate of radionuclides to the ocean from the Fukushima Daiichi Nuclear Power Plant estimated numerically by a regional ocean model (English)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...723/AM-3-5.pdf JAMSTEC, Estimation of the total amount of 137Cs direct release associated with the Fukushima accident (English)


July 23 (meeting hall B)

BM-1 Session: Offsite status

http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...723/BM-1-1.pdf Cabinet Office, Designating and Rearranging the Areas of Evacuation (English)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...723/BM-1-2.pdf Ministry of Environment, Overview of offsite cleanup activities (English)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...723/BM-1-3.pdf JAEA, Overview of the Results of the Decontamination Model Projects (English)

BM-2 Session: Present plant status and present countermeasure implementation status

http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...723/BM-2-1.pdf Tepco, The overall status of Fukushima Daiichi NPS (Japanese)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...723/BM-2-2.pdf Tepco, The mid to long term roadmap toward decommissioning and research and development plan (Japanese)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...723/BM-2-3.pdf Tepco, Condition inside PCV assumed based on the atmosphere gas measurement results (hydrogen, xenon and krypton behaviors) (Japanese)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...723/BM-2-4.pdf JNES, Evaluation of xenon concentration in unit 2 PCV atmosphere (Japanese)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...723/BM-2-5.pdf Tepco, Progress status of the fuel removal from Unit 1-4 spent fuel pools (Japanese)

July 24 (meeting hall A)

AT-4 Session: Earthquake, tsunami

http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...724/AT-4-1.pdf Tepco, Earthquake Ground Motion Observed at the NPS and the Ground Motion Simulation (English)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...724/AT-4-2.pdf Tepco, Tsunami Survey Results in the NPS and Reproduction Analysis Using Tsunami Inversion (English)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...724/AT-4-3.pdf JNES, The JNES model on the construction of a design basis tsunami based on probabilistic tsunami evaluation (Japanese)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...724/AT-4-4.pdf Tepco, Fukushima Daiichi NPS after the Tohoku-Chihou-Taiheiyou-Oki Earthquake: Impact of ground motion on Fukushima Daiichi NPS Units 1-3 (Japanese)

AT-5 Session: Liquid phase leaks from PCV

http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...724/AT-5-1.pdf Tepco, Investigation result of the inside of PCV and the investigation plan to identify the leakage path of radioactive materials (Japanese)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...724/AT-5-2.pdf Tepco, Various Approaches for Understanding State of Plants (Japanese)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...724/AT-5-3.pdf JNES, Inference of PCV cooling status based on data after nitrogen injection (Japanese)


AT-6 Session: Lessons learnt from the accident

http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...724/AT-6-1.pdf Cabinet secretariat, Reform of Nuclear Regulation Organisation and System in Japan (English)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...724/AT-6-2.pdf NISA, Discussion on basic direction of safety regulation on severe accidents (English)

July 24 (meeting hall B)

BT-3 Session: Unit 4 spent fuel pool

http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...724/BT-3-1.pdf Tepco, Investigation of the cause of hydrogen explosion at the Unit 4 Reactor Building (English)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...724/BT-3-2.pdf JNES, Study on the Issues about Hydrogen Explosion at Fukushima Dai-ichi NPS (English)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...724/BT-3-3.pdf Tepco, Regarding the integrity of the spent fuel pool at unit4 (English)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...724/BT-3-4.pdf JNES, Analysis of Fuel Heat-up in a Spent Fuel Pool during a LOCA (English)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...724/BT-3-5.pdf Kajima corporation, Seismic safty evaluation of the Spent Fuel Pool at the unit4 (English)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...724/BT-3-6.pdf JNES, Seismic Safety Evaluation of the Spent Fuel Pool at the Unit 4 (English)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...724/BT-3-7.pdf US NRC, Fukushima Lessons Learned : Spent Fuel Pools (English)
http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/shingikai...724/BT-3-8.pdf IAEA, Safety of the Spent Fuel Pool (English)
 
Aug3-12, 10:32 AM   #13587

Nuclear Engineering 2012
 
Recognitions:
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http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/english/files/program_en.pdf 23/24 July workshop program in English

http://www.nisa.meti.go.jp/english/f...S_handout.html 23/24 July workshop document links with English titles
 
Aug3-12, 01:03 PM   #13588

Nuclear Engineering 2012
 
Recognitions:
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The 8th mid & long term meeting was held on 30 July 2012: http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01.html

1) Previous related topics:

The 7th meeting (25 June 2012) http://www.physicsforums.com/showpos...ostcount=13512

The 6th meeting (25 May 2012) : http://www.physicsforums.com/showpos...ostcount=13399

The 5th meeting (23 April 2012) : http://www.physicsforums.com/showpos...ostcount=12979

The 4th meeting (28 March 2012) : http://www.physicsforums.com/showpos...ostcount=12764

The 3rd meeting (27 February 2012) was translated into English on Tepco's website : http://www.tepco.co.jp/en/nu/fukushi...ference-e.html

2) Translation:

30 July 2012 government-Tokyo Electric mid and long term response committee, steering committee (8th meeting)

http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01a.pdf Agenda
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01b.pdf Participants

Document 1
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01c.pdf Abstract of the proceedings of 7th steering committee meeting

Document 2: Plant status
Document 2-1: Plant status
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01d.pdf Plant parameters
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01e.pdf Accumulated water storage status

Document 3 Study and execution of each special plan

3-1 Cooling by closed loop water injection
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01f.pdf Schedule
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01g.pdf Unit 2 alternative thermometer installation progress status

3-2 Treatment of accumulated water
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01h.pdf Schedule
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01j.pdf Improvement of closed loop line reliability
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01k.pdf Multinuclide removal facility (ALPS) qualification test and facility design status
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01m.pdf Subdrain purification test status report

3-3 Countermeasures to reduce environmental radiations
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01n.pdf Schedule
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01p.pdf Future schedule as regards harbour related works etc.
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01q.pdf Consequences on water quality of the covering of the sea floor in the harbour
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01r.pdf Future operation policy of the seawater circulation purification device
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01s.pdf Results of evaluation of additional releases from reactor buildings

3-4 Improvement of working conditions
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01t.pdf Schedule
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01u.pdf Results of questionnaire survey in relation with improvement of working conditions at Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant and future course of action

3-5 Countermeasures for spent fuels pools
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01v.pdf Schedule
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01w.pdf Debris removal work, reactor building top part, unit 3
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01x.pdf Debris removal work, reactor building top part, unit 4
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01y.pdf Unit 1 operating floor status survey
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01z.pdf Unit 4 spent fuel pool fresh fuel (unirradiated fuel) integrity survey

3-6 Preparations for fuel debris removal
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...20730_01aa.pdf Schedule
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...20730_01bb.pdf Survey into unit 3 torus room, reactor building underground floor

3-7 Treatment and disposal of radioactive waste
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...20730_01cc.pdf Schedule
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...20730_01dd.pdf Debris, cut down trees management status
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...20730_01ee.pdf Collection of samples to analyse debris and cut down trees

Document 4
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...20730_01ff.pdf Fukushima Workshop on the development of machinery and equipments toward the decommissionning process, etc. of Tokyo Electric Fukushima Daiichi NPP (event guide) [7 August 2012, in Koriyama, Fukushima prefecture]

Document 5
http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...20730_01gg.pdf roadmap progress (abstract)
 
Aug3-12, 06:20 PM   #13589
 
When will the area around the Fukushima Daiichi Nuclear Power Plant be repopulated?

How much land is off limits in terms of Square Miles or Kilometers?

Are the radiation risks serious or negligible within this area if one lives there permanently?

Do the benefits of nuclear power offset the economic loss of this land possibly being rendered useless?
 
Aug4-12, 03:30 PM   #13590
 
Off-topic (sorry):

I logged in and read the following ad:
Hi Tepconium-311, have you thanked a PF Mentor today? They spend hours each day making sure PF is a great site! Spend two minutes and send a Mentor a PM or VM thanking them. Makes their day! :)
May I ask why tsutsuji has not yet been awarded Mentor status?
IMHO he deserves it. May I suggest him as a Mentor candidate?

(Thank you tsutsuji for your great contributions)

Edit:
Quote by Tjfjfjgh99 View Post
Do the benefits of nuclear power offset the economic loss of this land possibly being rendered useless?
I'd be curious, too, how much all that restricted land and property would have cost if bought at once at a real estate broker. (Before accident, of course)
 
Aug4-12, 06:00 PM   #13591
 
Recognitions:
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Has there been any analysis of the seawater contamination incident at the Chubu Electric Hamaoka #5 reactor?
According to this article posted Aug 4, 2012 at Atomic Power Review:
http://atomicpowerreview.blogspot.co...taminated.html
there was a pipe failure in the main condenser during shutdown, so that a lot of secondary cooling circuit sea water contaminated the reactor.
In the current environment, that unit is probably a writeoff, but there are surely some real lessons to be learned if a deliberate shutdown can cause such a damaging failure to occur.
 
Aug6-12, 05:45 AM   #13592

Nuclear Engineering 2012
 
Recognitions:
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http://www3.nhk.or.jp/news/genpatsu-...806/index.html Tepco has released part of the accident's teleconference videos. Journalists can go to Tepco's main office and watch there 150 hours of the videos taken for 5 days starting on 11 March 2011. They are not allowed to record the videos or the sound. An about one and a half hour edited abridged version prepared by tepco is available for the public to watch.

http://www3.nhk.or.jp/daily/english/20120806_30.html (same story, English version)

http://www.tepco.co.jp/tepconews/library/movie-01j.html The teleconference edited version is available on the last tab on the right, under "2012/8/6 本店会議録... (1:28:58)".

Quote by Tepconium-311 View Post

(Thank you tsutsuji for your great contributions)
Thanks for your support. I was given the "PF contributor" status and I feel very honoured by that.


http://www.tepco.co.jp/en/nu/fukushi...20803_02-e.pdf Investigation on the Misconnection of Thermometer Wiring at Fukushima Daiichi Nuclear Power Station :
[unit 1] 3. Dry well water level*: 1
Connected to the digital recorder with the wiring on the work site side switched off
→Connection was redone properly
* Set value: O.P. +27,150mm (Approx. 20m from the bottom of PCV)
What are we supposed to do with this "set value"? Isn't the water level more likely to be very low, a few cm above the bottom like at unit 2?
 
Aug7-12, 08:47 AM   #13593
 
Quote by tsutsuji View Post
http://www.tepco.co.jp/en/nu/fukushi...20803_02-e.pdf Investigation on the Misconnection of Thermometer Wiring at Fukushima Daiichi Nuclear Power Station :


What are we supposed to do with this "set value"? Isn't the water level more likely to be very low, a few cm above the bottom like at unit 2?
I didnt really understand that one myself when I read about it, especially since it also says they've set the reactor 2 one to an even higher level. For all intents and purposes I believe such instrumentation is useless right now anyway, will just have to wait for actual surveys of DW conditions at the other reactors.
 
Aug7-12, 12:46 PM   #13594

Nuclear Engineering 2012
 
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Quote by Tepconium-311 View Post
Hmm, could the pipe simply have molten and welded shut?
There is more about the alternative thermometer insertion plan and related assumptions in the following document.
 
Aug7-12, 12:48 PM   #13595

Nuclear Engineering 2012
 
Recognitions:
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Quote by tsutsuji View Post
The 8th mid & long term meeting was held on 30 July 2012:

3-1 Cooling by closed loop water injection

http://www.meti.go.jp/earthquake/nuc...120730_01g.pdf Unit 2 alternative thermometer installation progress status
1) Previous related topics:

1 March 2012 report ( http://www.physicsforums.com/showpos...ostcount=12465 part 1, http://www.physicsforums.com/showpos...ostcount=12485 part 2, http://www.physicsforums.com/showpos...ostcount=12492 part 3)

23 April 2012 report: http://www.physicsforums.com/showthr...78#post3939578 (insertion and freezing mock-ups)

28 May 2012 government-Tokyo Electric mid and long term response committee, steering committee (6th meeting): http://www.physicsforums.com/showthr...rs#post3941037 Results of the surveys on location concerning the environment improvement for the purpose of installing alternative thermometers in unit 2's RPV

01 June 2012 videos:

http://photo.tepco.co.jp/en/date/201...20601_02e.html "Decontamination around the truck bay door at Unit 2, Fukushima Daiichi NPS" (released on 1 June 2012)

http://photo.tepco.co.jp/en/date/201...20601_01e.html "Mock-up test to check the insertability of the alternative thermometer at Unit 2" (released on 1 June 2012)

25 June 2012 Mid & long term meeting : Unit 2 alternative thermometer installation progress status: http://www.physicsforums.com/showpos...ostcount=13523

12 July 2012: Checking SLC pipe integrity handout 1: http://www.tepco.co.jp/en/nu/fukushi...20712_05-e.pdf
13 July 2012: Checking SLC pipe integrity handout 2: http://www.tepco.co.jp/en/nu/fukushi...20713_04-e.pdf

2) Translation:

01/11

02/11

03/11
Attached Thumbnails
alternative thermometers 01of11.png   alternative thermometers 02of11.png   alternative thermometers 03of11.png  
 
Aug7-12, 12:52 PM   #13596

Nuclear Engineering 2012
 
Recognitions:
Gold Membership Gold Member
Translation:

04/11

05/11

06/11
Attached Thumbnails
alternative thermometers 04of11.png   alternative thermometers 05of11.png   alternative thermometers 06of11.png  
 
Aug7-12, 12:55 PM   #13597

Nuclear Engineering 2012
 
Recognitions:
Gold Membership Gold Member
Translation:

07/11

08/11

09/11
Attached Thumbnails
alternative thermometers 07of11.png   alternative thermometers 08of11.png   alternative thermometers 09of11.png  
 
Aug7-12, 12:58 PM   #13598

Nuclear Engineering 2012
 
Recognitions:
Gold Membership Gold Member
Translation:

10/11

11/11
Attached Thumbnails
alternative thermometers 10of11.png   alternative thermometers 11of11.png  
 
Aug7-12, 01:10 PM   #13599

Nuclear Engineering 2012
 
Recognitions:
Gold Membership Gold Member
http://www3.nhk.or.jp/news/genpatsu-...807/index.html It was found by viewing the teleconference videos that on 12 March 2011 after the unit 1 explosion, late in the night an official said "disband !" and almost all high rank officials left the main office response center that was supposed to support Fukushima Daiichi during the accident. Tepco explained that although high rank officials had left, "technicians were remaining and were responding".


http://ajw.asahi.com/article/0311dis...AJ201208070052 "The following scene, from March 14, 2011, highlights the difficulties between those at the plant trying to deal with the emergency and executives at TEPCO's Tokyo headquarters trying to provide advice"

http://ajw.asahi.com/article/0311dis...AJ201208070055 "TEPCO's edited video sheds little light on truth"
 
Aug9-12, 04:49 PM   #13600
 
Quote by etudiant View Post
Has there been any analysis of the seawater contamination incident at the Chubu Electric Hamaoka #5 reactor?
According to this article posted Aug 4, 2012 at Atomic Power Review:
http://atomicpowerreview.blogspot.co...taminated.html
there was a pipe failure in the main condenser during shutdown, so that a lot of secondary cooling circuit sea water contaminated the reactor.
In the current environment, that unit is probably a writeoff, but there are surely some real lessons to be learned if a deliberate shutdown can cause such a damaging failure to occur.
Indeed, how rotten must this nuclear plant look inside now, if immediate photos after discovery already remind of scrap metals yard.
See here for images!

Quote by tsutsuji View Post
Translation:

04/11
[...]
05/11

06/11
[...]
"The obstruction is inferred to be inside the RPV."
This is very interesting.

Let's remember how RPVsapparently fail.
Look at this (the sources are reputable, I hope) which I found here.

Let's say it in a very prosaic manner: they seem to p!ss, instead of sh!tting.

I mean, look at Swedish experiment still photo. Hottest and softest area first gets penetrated. It flows, it doesn't drop.

What if corium sploshing out of vessel warmed up pipe, making a (near) perfect weld in combination with containment overpressure?

(NUCENG, any idea?)

(BTW, tsutsuji, thank you again very much for translating this mega-interesting piece of information!)
Attached Thumbnails
rpvsploosh.jpg  
 
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