Sick freak kills first-graders


by Jack21222
Tags: firstgraders, freak, kills, sick
Evo
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#217
Dec18-12, 05:33 PM
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Seriously, this thread isn't about gun control. Please leave discussions pro or con guns out. The NRA plans to make some "major statement" as they call it next week, perhaps that will be something that gives enough new reasons to restart yet another gun thread. The talk of new bans on assault rifles is increasing in the media, so I'm also considering moving some of the "gun posts" to another thread, but it's always the same thing, flamewars start, thread gets closed. Wash, rinse, repeat.

I am still in the process of finding and cleaning up recent posts, but it's going to require editing which I don't have time for right this minute. So please save the "you deleted my post, but left his" for tomorrow, it is always possible that I will miss posts.

Thank you.
CAC1001
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Dec18-12, 05:50 PM
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Quote Quote by Evo View Post
Seriously, this thread isn't about gun control. Please leave discussions pro or con guns out. The NRA plans to make some "major statement" as they call it next week, perhaps that will be something that gives enough new reasons to restart yet another gun thread. The talk of new bans on assault rifles is increasing in the media, so I'm also considering moving some of the "gun posts" to another thread, but it's always the same thing, flamewars start, thread gets closed. Wash, rinse, repeat.

I am still in the process of finding and cleaning up recent posts, but it's going to require editing which I don't have time for right this minute. So please save the "you deleted my post, but left his" for tomorrow, it is always possible that I will miss posts.

Thank you.
My apologies; edited my post.
Astronuc
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Dec18-12, 06:47 PM
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Quote Quote by Evo View Post
Seriously, this thread isn't about gun control. Please leave discussions pro or con guns out. The NRA plans to make some "major statement" as they call it next week, perhaps that will be something that gives enough new reasons to restart yet another gun thread.
The National Rifle Association on Tuesday broke its silence on last Friday's mass shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Conn., denouncing the "horrific and senseless murders" and vowing to "help make sure this never happens again."

. . . .
http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/n...-politics.html
Evo
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Dec18-12, 07:00 PM
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Yes, the NRA plans to make a statement Friday.
Astronuc
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Dec18-12, 07:16 PM
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Six-year-old Arielle Pozner was in a classroom at Sandy Hook school when Adam Lanza burst into the school with his rifle and handguns. Her twin brother, Noah, was in a classroom down the hall.
http://gma.yahoo.com/siblings-sandy-...opstories.html
nsaspook
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#222
Dec18-12, 08:14 PM
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NEWTOWN, Conn. – The gunman who slaughtered 20 children and six adults at a Connecticut elementary school may have snapped because his mother was planning to commit him to a psychiatric facility, according to a lifelong resident of the area who was familiar with the killer’s family and several of the victims’ families.
Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/12/18...#ixzz2FSZQnUvC
Mentalist
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#223
Dec18-12, 08:32 PM
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Quote Quote by IMP View Post
At least some people are thinking about this logically:

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/...3Rpb25z;_ylv=3
That is logical thinking? It does not have logical basis, so I don't get how you can assert that it is logical for teachers to carry guns. That seems more like a mess than something that would avert crisis.

Reading some of the comments made it ever more laughable. "Well trained"

Just because you're well trained with a gun does not mean you are well trained under such situations liken to what happened in Aurora, Colorado or Newtown. In addition, here is a scenario:

Violence breaks, gun shots heard, perpetuator runs into the gym, whilst one teacher standing over kids on the ground. A math teacher runs out with his gun, assumes the other teacher has snapped, and begins shooting. Now all the teachers are shooting whilst the perpetuator is in the gymnasium slaughtering more people.

In other words, these teachers are trained to be teachers not police officers or swat team members. Their emotional stability and awareness in such situations is just the emotional knee-jerk reaction any common-day person would have. Bad idea, and I would never allow my children to go to a school with teachers carrying guns (if I had kids).

How about paying more taxes for police or security personnel? How about more safety precautions in case incidents like these happen?
Drakkith
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Dec18-12, 09:10 PM
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Quote Quote by Mentalist View Post
That is logical thinking? It does not have logical basis, so I don't get how you can assert that it is logical for teachers to carry guns. That seems more like a mess than something that would avert crisis.
Careful, logic is not set in stone, it is very much dependent on what a person thinks should be done and how.

Just because you're well trained with a gun does not mean you are well trained under such situations liken to what happened in Aurora, Colorado or Newtown. In addition, here is a scenario:

Violence breaks, gun shots heard, perpetuator runs into the gym, whilst one teacher standing over kids on the ground. A math teacher runs out with his gun, assumes the other teacher has snapped, and begins shooting. Now all the teachers are shooting whilst the perpetuator is in the gymnasium slaughtering more people.
You bring up a valid point. Allowing teachers to carry guns is not guaranteed to actually be any safer. Would more people end up injured or killed due to accidental discharges or shootings? Will there be teachers who threaten students at gunpoint when they get get out of line because they don't know how else to handle them? I'm sure there are plenty of others.

In other words, these teachers are trained to be teachers not police officers or swat team members. Their emotional stability and awareness in such situations is just the emotional knee-jerk reaction any common-day person would have. Bad idea, and I would never allow my children to go to a school with teachers carrying guns (if I had kids).
I think you may underestimate their ability to handle the situation, but I do agree that there are likely to be "friendly fire" situations pop up.

How about paying more taxes for police or security personnel? How about more safety precautions in case incidents like these happen?
How about realizing this is an extremely unlikely incident and not wasting the money? I believe the other thread on this incident ballparked an estimate for replacing the doors in schools with bulletproof ones at like 2 billions dollars or something. And I think that's just the door cost! Labor costs would probably be at least as much if not more. (I've seen some of these installed. They aren't always easy)

Plus you not only have to figure out what would be effective, but also whether you want your children to go to school everyday and deal with whatever new safeguards are put in place. I say this because some people advocate checkpoints and other things that would make schools more like prisons...or airports.

It's very easy to fall into the "my/our children's lives are worth any price" realm. It's much more difficult to take a step back and look at the bigger picture and figure out what works and is also feasible compared to what is just a waste of time and money.
enosis_
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#225
Dec18-12, 10:28 PM
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One of my associates grew up in the Newtown area. Her niece attends the middle school and was in class when it happened. She confirmed it's a very small and close community where everyone either knows each other or are related and every family is affected. I asked if her sister planned to relocate out of the area and was surprised by the response. She said if this could happen in Newtown, where could they go that would be safer?

I had no response.
nsaspook
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#226
Dec19-12, 01:49 AM
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Quote Quote by enosis_ View Post
She said if this could happen in Newtown, where could they go that would be safer?

I had no response.
Big city schools with real police and physical security measures.
http://www.laspd.com/about.html
Astronuc
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Dec19-12, 09:19 AM
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Quote Quote by Reuters on Yahoo
The family of Principal Dawn Hochsprung invited mourners to visit at a local funeral home on Wednesday afternoon, though the burial was due to be private at an undisclosed time.

Another of the teachers, Victoria Soto, was among those to be buried at a funeral on Wednesday.

Funerals were also scheduled for 6-year-old Charlotte Bacon, 7-year-old Daniel Barden and 6-year-old Caroline Previdi, while the family of 7-year-old Chase Kowalski invited mourners to a public visitation and prayer vigil.

The surviving children from Sandy Hook Elementary faced another day at home as school authorities and parents made plans for an eventual return to a different location - the unused Chalk Hill School in nearby Monroe, where a sign across the street read, "Welcome Sandy Hook Elementary!"

. . . .
http://news.yahoo.com/schools-reopen...002828916.html
jedishrfu
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#228
Dec19-12, 01:01 PM
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A possible motive for the rampage came out in the Huff Post article today. They believe his mother was in the process of committing him and that he became angry when he found out.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/1...ef=mostpopular
Astronuc
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#229
Dec19-12, 04:10 PM
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Letter from John to his best friend Jack Pinto.

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/...191902176.html
gravenewworld
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Dec19-12, 08:19 PM
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Thomas Jefferson on The Constitution:

"I am not an advocate for frequent changes in laws and constitutions, but laws and institutions must go hand in hand with the progress of the human mind. As that becomes more developed, more enlightened, as new discoveries are made, new truths discovered and manners and opinions change, with the change of circumstances, institutions must advance also to keep pace with the times. We might as well require a man to wear still the coat which fitted him when a boy as civilized society to remain ever under the regimen of their barbarous ancestors."
BobG
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Dec19-12, 08:43 PM
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Quote Quote by gravenewworld View Post
Thomas Jefferson on The Constitution:
"I am not an advocate for frequent changes in laws and constitutions, but laws and institutions must go hand in hand with the progress of the human mind. As that becomes more developed, more enlightened, as new discoveries are made, new truths discovered and manners and opinions change, with the change of circumstances, institutions must advance also to keep pace with the times. We might as well require a man to wear still the coat which fitted him when a boy as civilized society to remain ever under the regimen of their barbarous ancestors."
This must be part of the reason Texas doesn't like including Thomas Jefferson in their curriculum. (But it is important for Texas school children to learn about the NRA.)
nsaspook
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#232
Dec20-12, 04:44 AM
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Demonize the entire state of Texas over some idiot like Barton? That's important to the topic.
Astronuc
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#233
Dec20-12, 06:13 AM
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Quote Quote by WABC-TV Ch 7
James Mattioli especially loved recess and math, and his family described him as a "numbers guy" who came up with insights beyond his years to explain the relationship between numbers. He particularly loved the concept of googolplex, which a friend taught him. He was born four weeks before his due date, and his family often joked that he came into the world early because he was hungry. They wrote in his obituary that 6-year-old James, fondly called 'J,' loved hamburgers with ketchup, his Dad's omelets with bacon and his Mom's French toast. He often asked to stop at Subway and wanted to know how old he needed to be to order a footlong sandwich. He loved sports and wore shorts and T-shirts no matter the weather. He was a loud and enthusiastic singer and once asked, "How old do I have to be to sing on a stage?" His family recalled that he was an early-riser who was always ready to get up and go. He and his older sister were the best of friend. He was a thoughtful and considerate child, recently choosing to forgo a gift for himself and use the money to buy his grandfather a mug for Christmas.



Profiles of the Newtown shooting victims
http://abclocal.go.com/wabc/story?se...rbs&id=8921731
turbo
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#234
Dec20-12, 06:18 AM
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Too sweet.


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