Couldn't find em, so I had them made

[vadslram]

I looked everywhere to find a certain Tshirt and no where are they made so..
I went to a local shop. The poor guy had NO idea what it meant.
History
My son's High School scolastic team was holding an NAQT tourney at his school and since the kids were working so hard I figured that something special was needed
so...
...
..
http://home.mindspring.com/~dave.mcdonald1/plane.JPG

Sad thing is some of the teacher/coaches had no idea what it meant.

(edit) sorry bout the size, I'm at work and don't have any graphics programs.

 

[berkeman]

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Yeah, I guess you have to have seen that problem asked again and again and again to appreciate the humor. You'll be able to spot the physicists as you walk around with that shirt on -- they're the ones who spit out their coffee and start gagging as they laugh out loud. :tongue2:

 

[russ_watters]

Wow, what a painful thing to put on a shirt.

 

[mattmns]

I am one of those people that has no clue what that means. Anyone care to explain?

 

[Ivan Seeking]

It looks like the Boeing line to me.

 

[renigade666]

hahaha. If I understand the shirt correctly, the problem I've heard over and over again that would apply to this senarior is:
"What happens to a plane when it is put on a conveyor belt?"
ie. does it lift off? Or just run its wheels along the belt?

:D

 

[light_bulb]

it lifts off.

 

[Danger]

:rofl:
Excellent design! You'll be the instigators of lots of fights.

 

[Maxwells Demon]

I doesn't lift off... LETS HAVE A DISCUSSION :D

no airflow around the wings so it doesn't lift off... only thing moving is the belt and the wheels

 

[Maxwells Demon]

Light_Bulb said that it would lift off

 

[dontdisturbmycircles]

Lol, I just realized this is a spawn from this discussion : Or at least I think it is . ( This should give the clueless an idea as to what is being discussed.)

http://www.hdskate.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3185

 

[FredGarvin]

Damn that's funny.

 

[dontdisturbmycircles]

I doesn't lift off... LETS HAVE A DISCUSSION :D

no airflow around the wings so it doesn't lift off... only thing moving is the belt and the wheels

I could be ignorant, but I don't think so!

How could an airplane regularly take off, then? The propeller! Whether or not the wheel is spinning on the treadmill is irrelevant! I don't think there is a need for a discussion on this on a physics forum, is there? lol

 

[renigade666]

I doesn't lift off... LETS HAVE A DISCUSSION :D

no airflow around the wings so it doesn't lift off... only thing moving is the belt and the wheels

Agreed. No lift = No flying

Besides... if you look at it relative to a person on the ground... that would look pretty funny to see a plane start to take off from not moving :tongue2:

 

[dontdisturbmycircles]

Its a free spinning wheel?? Cmon guys. :rofl:

 

[Maxwells Demon]

dontdisturbmycircles:

I don't know what you're talking about..

That plane would not take off, end of discussion..

 

[berkeman]

Agreed. No lift = No flying

Besides... if you look at it relative to a person on the ground... that would look pretty funny to see a plane start to take off from not moving :tongue2:

Think in terms of thrust, and about how an ice plane or sea plane can take off...

 

[Maxwells Demon]

http://www.hdskate.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3185

OH GOD :D:D:D:D:D::D

 

[dontdisturbmycircles]

The thing is maxwell, the plane doesn't really move backwards (at least not near as fast as it is being accelerated forwards by the propeller). If you were to design a shopping cart with really good almost frictionless (like in the airplane scenario) wheels and then put it on a conveyer belt, it wouldn't go down the conveyer belt at the same speed as the conveyer belt unless the wheels were stuck.

 

[Maxwells Demon]

Why the hell are you telling me this? I said the plane wouldn't move...! the wheels of the plane is going forward and the conveyor belt backwards ergo the plane doesn't move.. No velocity, no wind, and no wind no pressure on the wings.. no flying..

really don't know why you are telling me this, omg..

 

[dontdisturbmycircles]

Yes that is correct you said the plane wouldn't move, but you are incorrect. I am not trying to prove myself correct but thought you may be interested in knowing why it is true. :-) But if not, that is fine, I don't mind :p.

 

[Maxwells Demon]

It wouldn't move forward or backwards.. I thought you were able to figure out what I meant by your self.. Please forgive me for being so unprecise.

BTW check this out:

Sacto:
"Now, that said, the plane would still most likely be able to move forward and gain speed, due to the fact that someone would need to control the speed of the treadmill/conveyor belt. The speed that the wheels are moving on the plane one second is going to be different from the next. If the engines were engaged, the acceleration provided from the boost would most likely overcome the maximum rate of speed that the belt could achieve, and start to gain speed and move forward. Let's also talk about durability of the belt as well, which would probably not be durable enough to stand up to such a weight, like that of an airplane, and also such a high rate of speed. It would rip and probably damage the plane."

Ryan:
"Sacto, you can't factor in alternate variables like whether or not the conveyer belt will be able to keep up. I am pretty sure he wasn't asking if a real life conveyer belt could do it."

Sacto:
"My bad, I didnt know you were talking about magic fantasy land. I guess in a land where **** that doesn't follow logic happens, the plane would actually take off."

Ryan:
"I didn't say what you said wasn't logical, it was just irrelevent. So if I can factor in any possible variable than I can logically say that the plane will take off because a giant half-hippo half-giraffe man will come and pick it off the ground.
Physics problems like these are allowed only one variable, junior."

hahahhaha

and then people started joking:

"The plane will lose a lot of calories, become thinner, and then a bunch of passengers will have to get off because there is no room."

"I believe that in it's need to take off it would evolve into a helicoptor and it doesn't need to worry about a moving ground."

damn... :D

 

[Maxwells Demon]

uke:
"I was thinking that but afraid I'd just get powned. Now that I got your backup though. wind from the tread mill will come under the wings and lift it up. They aren't standing still they're moving very fast but it creates the illusion that they're still because they're balancing each other out. its not simply 5+-5=0 its more like 5 = 5. If you were on a road and there was a lot of wind and you started running into it, you can balance it out power for power but you'd still end up being lifted up. Thats how I see it. 5 = 5 not 5 + -5 = 0"

omfg 5=5 hahahha

 

[dontdisturbmycircles]

It wouldn't move forward or backwards.. I thought you were able to figure out what I meant by your self.. Please forgive me for being so unprecise.

I don't want to argue with you, this is a fairly interesting problem :). I want to be peaceful.

I am saying that it WILL move forwards, please just take 3 minutes to think about this.

Say you held this wheel thingy at the handles and put it on a conveyer belt...

http://img73.imageshack.us/img73/1750/wheelfa4.jpg

Assume that it spins without any friction at the contact with the rod in the middle. Which way would the thing move? It wouldn't, of course, right? The wheel would just spin. (In reality there probably would be a small force due to friction)

Is this not the exact same thing as the airplane wheels? There are two horizontal forces, the one pushing the plane forwards, provided by the propeller, and the one pushing it backwards (the practically nonexistant one, as shown in the last paragraph) Now it should be easy to see that the one that exists wins, and the plane moves forwards, and thus eventually the wings get enough lift and the plane takes off.

The wheels of the airplane don't provide the forward thrust, the propeller does, you could stick two blocks of slippery ice at the bottom of the airplane and you could take off. (ok, that's a bit of a stretch)

Fin, that's it.

 

[Maxwells Demon]

Nick:

"2-The other option is that if the surfaces are not super bumpy, the plane would have sooooo much friction on it caused by gravity pushing the heavy ass plane down, so it would start to slow up, and thus the conveyer belt would as well. Eventually both would stop, just from reducing speed soo much."

Ryan:
"And your second option is ****ed up too in a number of ways. When a plane is moving, friction is already taken into account. Its not like your going to start moving and all the sudden friction is going to come into affect and youll be like "oh ****! i forgot about that." If you drive at a constant speed of 60mph, your not going to start slowly slowing down because of the friction of the tires."

 

[Maxwells Demon]

dontdisturbmycircles

There are to opposite and equal forces? The jet propulsion moving the plane "forward" and the conveyor belt spinning backwards..

So I don't really see what you're talking about?

 

[dontdisturbmycircles]

Yes but the conveyer belt spinning backwards does not push the PLANE backwards, it simply SPINS the wheels. So they are NOT equal and opposite, really think about it maxwells, please! But I think that's enough, you can private message me later if you want and we can carry on the discussion. I don't want to get this thread locked. :-)

 

[Maxwells Demon]

I see what you mean.. you mean if the wheels of the plane had no friction at the shaft, and the conveyor belt were spinning, then the plane would be still... And THEN turning on the jet turbines it would gain velocity and fly.. but I really don't think this is the case, because then the conveyor belt would just spin even faster to make up for the velocity the jet turbines would put into the plane...

can we get some second opinions??

 

[FredGarvin]

I can't believe you were serious with debating this. Someone please lock this thread if that's what it's coming to.

For the umpteen thousandths time, the airplane will take off. Do a search for one of the many threads in which this has already been discussed to death.

 

[dontdisturbmycircles]

Yea, I didn't mean to start a debate as I said in my first post we shouldn't have to debate it on a physics forum. , it is an interesting problem though. But yea that's not what this thread is about so my applogies to the OP.

PS - If I knew how popular this question was and how many times it has been discussed on the net I would not have started it and simply would have pointed him to one of the discussions. I thought it was an interesting problem and wanted to convince him that it wouldn't matter. I now see that its has been discussed waaaay too much, even on physicsforums.

 

[Integral]

It is to bad that this thread could not aviod the disscusion which the shirt represents.

So I guess the final words in this thread will be

Cool Shirt.

'nuff said.

Locked.