Exploring Action and Reaction with Magnetic Coils

In summary, the conversation is about a theoretical device that could create movement in space without expelling anything. It involves using two pipes with magnet coils on each end to propel a ball back and forth, while also rotating the pipes in opposite directions to cancel out any other movement. The conversation also addresses potential issues such as friction and energy conversion, as well as the feasibility of the device in space. There is also a discussion on the mechanics behind the device and the possibility of creating a diagram to better explain it.
  • #1
t0yland
5
0
This is probably off the wall but I would like some other peoples opinions none the less.

Imagine two 10kg, 1 meter long pipes that are closed off at each end. At the ends are magnet coils to propel and object back and forth. Inside the pipes there is a magnet disk/ball/whatever that is 1kg.

Both of these pipes are situated on a platform in order to swing the pipes around like a centrifuge. Each pipe will swing the opposite way in order to cancel out any other movement.

Both pipes are parallel to each other, with the ball in each of them, at the same end. The magnetic coils are now activated to send the ball flying to the other end at 10m/s. When the ball hits the other end the pipes are the swung around in opposite directions. Rinse and repeat.

It seems to me such a device, in space, would create movement without expelling anything. Essentially you create a reaction which gets the pipes moving at 1m/s opposite of the ball. When the ball hits the other side the whole apparatus would stop. However it would have moved.

Perhaps I’m crazy but please prove it wrong? :rofl:
 
Physics news on Phys.org
  • #2
first point is are we too assume no frictional forces take place?
second point is we a dealing with a closed system were no external energy sources are affecting this so all the energy would be either kinetic or potetial.
some of this energy would be converted into heat .
 
  • #3
jamie said:
first point is are we too assume no frictional forces take place?
second point is we a dealing with a closed system were no external energy sources are affecting this so all the energy would be either kinetic or potetial.
some of this energy would be converted into heat .

Of course there would be friction and some energy would be lost to this. It is electically powered though.

The whole point is its a system that would propel a mass in space without a reaction. It does this by delaying the reaction by a fraction of a second. Granted you never really could get up to a high speed with such device.
 
  • #4
the problem is in your "rotation". The object is heavier on one end, to symetrically rotate it in space creating "no movement' you would have to rotate around the center of gravity which is offset. this will bring your device full swing back to its original location.

was good thinking though, i approve
 
  • #5
terrabyte said:
the problem is in your "rotation". The object is heavier on one end, to symetrically rotate it in space creating "no movement' you would have to rotate around the center of gravity which is offset. this will bring your device full swing back to its original location.

was good thinking though, i approve

Yes it is heavier in one end for 90 degrees. After that the weight would be on the other side and move it back. If you spin an object 180 degrees you will be at your starting location.
 
  • #6
i think you mean 360 degrees
 
  • #7
Yes if your talking only using one object.
We are using two pipes here though. Each pipe at this instant would have the 1kg ball on one side. The pipes would be parallel to each other and then swung 1 clockwise and the other counterclockwise. All the centripetal forces would be canceled out when they stop.

Its kind of hard to describe this without showing a diagram. Sorry if its vague.
 
  • #8
as far as equilibrium goes, rotating an offset mass in space exerts a force on the axis of rotation proportionate to the amount of the offset

rotating your device 180 degrees with the mass offset (rotation about the center axis <.5 meter mark>) will create the force to push the device back to where it started.

rotating the device about the center of gravity or center of mass would nullify this force being exerted, but by virtue of having a longer end of pipe on one side, you're going to end up at square 1 anyways
 
  • #9
this is my analysis using my admittedly limited knowledge of physics

we need to get some of the physics Big-heads in here for a proper appraisal, really. I am not that confident in my answers

or we can build one and take to space

TO SPACE!
 
  • #10
I don't think the whole idea is properlly being conveyed. How do I post a diagram? :uhh:

Yes, in usual systems the whole device would be back to square one. However in this idea the math says it won't :)

Edit:

Oh btw, supposable angular and linear movement are reserved to each other. One can not change angular movement to linear and visa versa. So technically rotating a mass 'shouldnt' move the system at all.
 
Last edited:
  • #11
I don't think the whole idea is properlly being conveyed. How do I post a diagram?

you GOT me on that one... ::uhh::
 

1. What are magnetic coils and how do they work?

Magnetic coils are wires that are wound around a core material, usually made of metal, in a specific shape. When an electric current flows through the coils, it creates a magnetic field around the core. This magnetic field can attract or repel other magnetic materials, depending on the direction of the current and the orientation of the coils.

2. What is action and reaction in the context of magnetic coils?

Action and reaction refers to the principle of Newton's Third Law of Motion, which states that for every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction. In the case of magnetic coils, the action is the creation of a magnetic field when an electric current flows through the coils, and the reaction is the movement or force exerted on other magnetic materials in the vicinity of the coils.

3. How can I explore action and reaction with magnetic coils?

One way to explore action and reaction with magnetic coils is to create a simple circuit with a battery, wires, and a switch. Connect the wires to the positive and negative terminals of the battery, and then connect the ends of the wires to the magnetic coils. When you turn on the switch, the electric current will flow through the coils and create a magnetic field. You can then observe the movement or force exerted on other magnetic materials, such as paper clips or small magnets, placed near the coils.

4. What are some practical applications of magnetic coils and their action and reaction?

Magnetic coils have a wide range of practical applications, including in electromagnets, electric motors, generators, MRI machines, and speakers. In these devices, the action and reaction of the magnetic field created by the coils play a crucial role in their functioning.

5. Are there any safety precautions I should take when working with magnetic coils?

Yes, it is important to take certain safety precautions when working with magnetic coils. Since they can produce strong magnetic fields, it is advisable to keep them away from electronic devices, credit cards, and other magnetic-sensitive materials. Also, be careful not to touch the coils while they are connected to a power source, as this can cause electric shocks. It is also recommended to use insulated wires and wear protective gear, such as gloves and safety glasses, while handling the coils.

Similar threads

  • Introductory Physics Homework Help
2
Replies
43
Views
2K
  • Other Physics Topics
Replies
4
Views
1K
Replies
14
Views
2K
  • Other Physics Topics
Replies
20
Views
4K
  • Mechanical Engineering
Replies
28
Views
2K
  • Other Physics Topics
Replies
1
Views
3K
  • Electromagnetism
Replies
3
Views
1K
  • Other Physics Topics
Replies
3
Views
2K
  • Special and General Relativity
Replies
5
Views
1K
Replies
8
Views
932
Back
Top