Lorentz Force Question - Where did the y dot come from ?

In summary, the conversation is about a penning ion trap and the equations needed to calculate the total electromagnetic force on a particle in the trap. The potential of the trap electrodes is given by V(x,y,z) = A(2z^2 - x^2 - y^2), and there is a superimposed uniform B-field B = B(z hat). The question asks for the expression of the z-component of the force, and the solution involves using the y-component of the velocity. The conversation also discusses the equations of motion for the x and y components, with some disagreement on the correct answer. The final conclusion is that the x and z components of the force can be calculated using the equations x double dot = q/m
  • #1
Physics Enemy
17
0
Basically the question is about a penning ion trap. You need to use the equation for the Lorentz Force, which I have. It says the trap electrodes have a potential:

V(x,y,z) = A(2z^2 - x^2 - y^2); There's a superimposed uniform B-Field B = B(z hat)

It then asks you to write down an expression for the z-component of the total electromagnetic force on a particle of charge q, explaining why it doesn't depend on B. I did that. It then says write down the equation of motion. I did that.

It then asks you to do the same thing with the x and y components i.e.) Find the x and y components of the total force, write down the equations of motion, etc.

But the solution shows a y dot in the equation of motion in the x-direction:

x double dot = q/m[2Ax + B(y dot)]

Where did this y dot come into it? Any ideas? I thought a V term is next to B?
Thanks guys, muchly appreciated. :smile:
 
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  • #2
[tex]\dot{y}[/tex] is the y-component of the velocity.
 
  • #3
fzero said:
[tex]\dot{y}[/tex] is the y-component of the velocity.
Thanks, I realized a few mins ago lol. The x and z cross to give the y-direction. For some reason I also thought V was potential, not velocity. It's a little v, of course. :redface:
 
  • #4
I actually disagree with their answer, shouldn't it be -y dot? x cross z gives -y, I think ...
 
  • #5
Physics Enemy said:
I actually disagree with their answer, shouldn't it be -y dot? x cross z gives -y, I think ...

The equation you wrote above was for this [tex]x[/tex] component of the force, which contains [tex] (\vec{v} \times \vec{B})_x = v_y B_z[/tex].
 
  • #6
fzero said:
The equation you wrote above was for this [tex]x[/tex] component of the force, which contains [tex] (\vec{v} \times \vec{B})_x = v_y B_z[/tex].
Yes you're right. V x B = (V_y * B)xhat - (V_x * B)yhat + (0)zhat
So the x component is B*ydot, and y component is -B*xdot
 

1. How does the Lorentz force equation incorporate the "y dot" term?

The "y dot" term in the Lorentz force equation comes from the cross product between the velocity of the charged particle and the magnetic field. It represents the component of the velocity that is perpendicular to the magnetic field.

2. Why is the "y dot" term important in the Lorentz force equation?

The "y dot" term is important because it allows us to calculate the force on a charged particle moving in a magnetic field. Without it, we would only be able to calculate the force in the direction of the magnetic field.

3. What is the significance of the "y dot" term in the Lorentz force equation?

The "y dot" term is significant because it helps us understand the motion of charged particles in magnetic fields. It allows us to determine the direction and magnitude of the force acting on the particle, as well as its trajectory.

4. How does the "y dot" term affect the motion of a charged particle in a magnetic field?

The "y dot" term affects the motion of a charged particle by causing it to experience a force perpendicular to both its velocity and the magnetic field. This force can cause the particle to move in a circular or helical path, depending on the strength and orientation of the magnetic field.

5. Can the "y dot" term be negative in the Lorentz force equation?

Yes, the "y dot" term can be negative in the Lorentz force equation. This can occur if the velocity of the charged particle is in the opposite direction of the magnetic field, resulting in a negative cross product. The sign of the "y dot" term will affect the direction of the resulting force on the particle.

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