Flat Velocity Curve: Newton vs MOND Theory

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In summary: R,z) = -4\pi G \int_{0}^{\infty}\int_{0}^{\infty}\frac{R^{'2} \Sigma (R^{'},z^{'})dR^{'}dz^{'}}{\sqrt{R^2+R^{'2}+z^2}} (sorry, I cannot display it correctly in this format).In summary, the conversation discusses the dynamics of a star in a circular disk galaxy and the application of Newton's law to determine the velocity curve. The concept of MOND theory is also mentioned and it is argued that Newtonian mechanics can predict a flat velocity curve without the need for MON
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zachzach
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Consider a star of mass m at a distance r form the center of a circular disk galaxy. Newton's law: F = GM(r)m/(r^2) where M(r) is the amount of mass inside the radius r. If we consider a uniform galaxy then density (p) is p = M/L where L is the length = 2*pi*r. So M(r) = p*2*pi*r. Setting the force of gravity equal to centripetal force (mv^2/r) you get G*2*pi*p = v^2 or
v = [2G*pi*p]^(1/2) which is a constant. Why do you need MOND theory. To me it seems Newtonian mechanics predicts a flat velocity curve.
 
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  • #2
zachzach said:
Consider a star of mass m at a distance r form the center of a circular disk galaxy. Newton's law: F = GM(r)m/(r^2) where M(r) is the amount of mass inside the radius r. If we consider a uniform galaxy then density (p) is p = M/L where L is the length = 2*pi*r. So M(r) = p*2*pi*r. Setting the force of gravity equal to centripetal force (mv^2/r) you get G*2*pi*p = v^2 or
v = [2G*pi*p]^(1/2) which is a constant. Why do you need MOND theory. To me it seems Newtonian mechanics predicts a flat velocity curve.

Firstly, your simplified form of Newton's law only applies in certain cases such as when the mass is spherically symmetrical, or like a segment of a sphere along a diameter towards the relevant direction.

Secondly, I don't get your maths for the mass. If the galaxy is of uniform density per area of the disk, the mass inside a given radius would be proportional to the square of the radius. For the mass to be proportional to the radius, the area density would have to vary as 1/r.
 
  • #3
zachzach said:
Consider a star of mass m at a distance r form the center of a circular disk galaxy. Newton's law: F = GM(r)m/(r^2) where M(r) is the amount of mass inside the radius r. If we consider a uniform galaxy then density (p) is p = M/L where L is the length = 2*pi*r. So M(r) = p*2*pi*r. Setting the force of gravity equal to centripetal force (mv^2/r) you get G*2*pi*p = v^2 or
v = [2G*pi*p]^(1/2) which is a constant. Why do you need MOND theory. To me it seems Newtonian mechanics predicts a flat velocity curve.

As Jonathan said, it's wrong.
Your galaxy isn't spherical, you can't use your (wrong) formulas. Fix them and find the rotation curve of the bulge.
If you want to find the disk rotation curve you should write your potential considering a cylindrical distribution (hint: Green's functions), then
[tex]
\frac{v_{c}^{2}}{R} = \frac{\partial \phi (R,z=0)}{\partial R}
[/tex]
 

What is the Flat Velocity Curve problem?

The Flat Velocity Curve problem refers to the observation that stars and gas in galaxies rotate at a constant speed, despite being further from the center of the galaxy where the gravitational force should be weaker according to Newton's laws of gravity.

What is Newton's theory of gravity?

Newton's theory of gravity states that the force of gravity between two objects is directly proportional to the product of their masses and inversely proportional to the square of the distance between them.

What is MOND theory?

MOND (Modified Newtonian Dynamics) theory is an alternative theory of gravity proposed to explain the Flat Velocity Curve problem. It suggests that the force of gravity is stronger at large distances, which can account for the observed constant speed of stars and gas in galaxies.

What evidence supports MOND theory?

Several observations, such as the Flat Velocity Curve problem, the rotation of galaxies in clusters, and the motion of galaxies in galaxy clusters, are consistent with MOND theory. Additionally, MOND theory can also explain the observed distribution of matter in the universe without the need for dark matter.

How does MOND theory differ from Newton's theory?

MOND theory differs from Newton's theory in that it suggests a different relationship between gravity and distance. While Newton's theory follows the inverse square law, MOND theory proposes that the strength of gravity deviates from this law at large distances. Additionally, MOND theory does not require the existence of dark matter to explain the observed phenomena in the universe.

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