Closed form expression for this?

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  • #1
aaaa202
1,169
2
Say we have NA blue balls and NB red balls mixed together in an urn. When we pick a ball it leaves the urn. I want to find the probability of picking n red balls in a row.
The probability of picking a red ball is:
NA/(NA+NB)
But each time a red ball leaves the urn the probability of picking the next will be:
(NA-1)/(NA+NB-1)
So in general for n successive red ball picks the probability must be:

p(n) = ∏i=0n(NA-1)/(NA+NB-i)

First of all I want to ask if this is correctly deduced. Secondly, I want to know if you can evaluate a product like the above in a closed form.
 
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  • #2
aaaa202 said:
Say we have NA blue balls and NB red balls mixed together in an urn. When we pick a ball it leaves the urn. I want to find the probability of picking n red balls in a row.
The probability of picking a red ball is:
NA/(NA+NB)
But each time a red ball leaves the urn the probability of picking the next will be:
(NA-1)/(NA+NB-1)
So in general for n successive red ball picks the probability must be:

p(n) = ∏i=0n(NA-1)/(NA+NB-i)

First of all I want to ask if this is correctly deduced. Secondly, I want to know if you can evaluate a product like the above in a closed form.

I'll change to a nicer notation: we start with N balls altogether, R red and B blue, with R+B=N. If you draw n <= R balls, what is the probability all n are red? Note: this is very different from asking that if we pick all balls, one at a time, we ever get n red balls in a row; that would be a much harder problem.

As you said, the answer is
[tex] p(n) = \frac{R}{N} \frac{R-1}{N-1} \cdots \frac{R-n+1}{N-n+1}.[/tex]
This can be written in terms of factorials and binomial coefficients (if you think that is nicer and fits your definition of "closed form"):
[tex] p(n) = \frac{R!}{(R-n)!} \frac{(N-n)!}{N!}= \frac{C(R,n)}{C(N,n)},[/tex]
where [tex] C(a,b) = \frac{a!}{b!(a-b)!}[/tex] is the binomial coefficient.

RGV
 

1. What is a closed form expression?

A closed form expression is a mathematical expression that can be written in a finite number of operations using only basic mathematical operations, such as addition, subtraction, multiplication, division, and exponentiation. It does not involve infinite series or integrals.

2. Why is it important to have a closed form expression?

Closed form expressions allow for a clear and concise representation of a mathematical concept. They are also useful for simplifying calculations and making it easier to understand and analyze mathematical relationships.

3. How is a closed form expression different from other mathematical expressions?

A closed form expression is different from other mathematical expressions, such as recursive or open form expressions, because it can be written in a finite number of steps without any infinite or repeating elements. It is also often the most accurate and efficient way to express a mathematical relationship.

4. Can any mathematical expression be written in closed form?

No, not all mathematical expressions can be written in closed form. Some expressions, such as those involving transcendental functions like sine and cosine, cannot be expressed in finite terms using basic mathematical operations.

5. How can I determine the closed form expression for a given mathematical relationship?

Finding the closed form expression for a given mathematical relationship often involves using techniques such as algebraic manipulation, substitution, and pattern recognition. It may also require knowledge of specific mathematical identities and formulas.

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