Revolutionizing Electronics: The Plastic Conductor Discovery

In summary: So I'm not really sure what he's trying to say.In summary, this expert summarizer believes that the conductor's conductivity is controlled by its surface area and resistance to current. The comment about "by weight" was meant to emphasize how the material is optimized for conductivity, but still not as volumetrically efficient as metal. Multistrand wires are used mainly to allow more bending without damage.
  • #1
moe darklight
409
0
plastic conductor?

I just tooned into the end of a segment on "daily planet" about this guy who found out a way to create a plastic conductor. He says it conducts electricity as well as a metal wire and is very light weight (and will literally change the world of electronics).

Anyone have any more info on this or how it's done? I was doing something else while the TV was on in the background so I don't remember much of the details, but I remember the guy saying it was done through a chemical process.
 
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  • #2
Plastic conductors are usually called electrically conductive organic compounds. Polyacetylene is a well-known one. By weight, some of these conduct electricity as well as metal wire. By volume, the conductivity is usually less than most metal conductors.

From Wiki:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conductive_polymer
 
  • #3
By weight?

Previous poster stated comparisions of conductivity by weight. This is highly erroneous.

Conductivity is controlled by a function of surface area and electon resistance. A 1-inch thick copper rod has far less conductivity than an equal mass of copper that has been spun into tiny threads. Electricity flows along the outside of materials...therefore the more surface area, the more capacity for electron movement (current or quantum vibration).

A measure of electrical conductivity by weight is quite nonsensical. It's result would end in an equation of convoluted functions of surface area, geometrical topography, and volumetric ratios (which would all be needed to effectively remove mass from the equation...and thus solvable).

Perhaps you were thinking of heat conducivity...but that would be a discussion about heat capacitance and transfer rates (for which materials could be compared with regard to mass)...not in the realm of conductive plastics.
 
  • #4
SharpVI said:
Previous poster stated comparisions of conductivity by weight. This is highly erroneous.

Conductivity is controlled by a function of surface area and electon resistance. A 1-inch thick copper rod has far less conductivity than an equal mass of copper that has been spun into tiny threads. Electricity flows along the outside of materials...therefore the more surface area, the more capacity for electron movement (current or quantum vibration).

A measure of electrical conductivity by weight is quite nonsensical. It's result would end in an equation of convoluted functions of surface area, geometrical topography, and volumetric ratios (which would all be needed to effectively remove mass from the equation...and thus solvable).

Perhaps you were thinking of heat conducivity...but that would be a discussion about heat capacitance and transfer rates (for which materials could be compared with regard to mass)...not in the realm of conductive plastics.

You misunderstood chemisttree's statement. The point was that electrically conductive plastics are generally much less conductive than metal. The comment about "by weight" was meant to emphasize the characteristics of the material -- how they are optimized for conductivity (but still aren't as volumetrically efficient as metal).

And your comment about electricity flowing on the outside of wires is only true for high frequencies, where the skin depth of the AC current shrinks to the order of the cross-sectional dimension of the conductor.
 
  • #5
SharpVI said:
Electricity flows along the outside of materials

When there is no current, but some charge, charge carriers certainly reside on the outer surface of a conductor because they are repelled from each other. Also, it is true that even when there is flow, the charge carriers on a superconductor still all move along the surface (but with a depth dependent on the max current density). That's why its perfectly fine to make a superconductor that is simply a coating of superconducting material on some non-superconducting substrate (as long as the maximum current density is not exceeded). However, for conductors that have even a slight resistance (copper at room temperature, etc.) when an external EMF is applied such that there will be flow, the carriers begin to take the paths of least resistance in order to carry the charge. That path includes paths within the conductor (not just on the surface). So the resistance of a copper wire is proportional to its length and its cross-sectional area. Additionally, multistrand wires do not exhibit any better conductivity than their solid counterpart. Multistrand wires are used mainly to allow more bending without damage.
 
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  • #6
fleem said:
So the resistance of a copper wire is proportional to its length and its cross-sectional area. Additionally, multistrand wires do not exhibit any better conductivity than their solid counterpart. Multistrand wires are used mainly to allow more bending without damage.

The poster may have been thinking of the use of Litz wire, which is a specialized kind of multi-stranded wire which does have a significantly lower inductance than solid wire:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Litz_wire
 
  • #7
berkeman said:
The poster may have been thinking of the use of Litz wire, which is a specialized kind of multi-stranded wire which does have a significantly lower inductance than solid wire:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Litz_wire

Well possibly. But then he should, of course, be alerted to the difference between inductance and resistance.
 
  • #8
SharpVI said:
Previous poster stated comparisions of conductivity by weight. This is highly erroneous.

Conductivity is controlled by a function of surface area and electon resistance. A 1-inch thick copper rod has far less conductivity than an equal mass of copper that has been spun into tiny threads. Electricity flows along the outside of materials...therefore the more surface area, the more capacity for electron movement (current or quantum vibration).

A measure of electrical conductivity by weight is quite nonsensical. It's result would end in an equation of convoluted functions of surface area, geometrical topography, and volumetric ratios (which would all be needed to effectively remove mass from the equation...and thus solvable).

Perhaps you were thinking of heat conducivity...but that would be a discussion about heat capacitance and transfer rates (for which materials could be compared with regard to mass)...not in the realm of conductive plastics.
This post is riddled with errors, one of which has been pointed out by berke and fleem. In addition, dc conductivity is a material property and is intensive. It is not a function of surface area. Even the conductance, which is geometry dependent is not explicitly dependent on surface area for mesoscopic/macroscopic systems, but instead on the geometric aspect ratio. Additionally, the phrase "quantum vibration" has no business showing up in that sentence or anywhere in the post. To say that conductance is a function of electron resistance is silly, because it is trivially true but completely undescriptive, since it is defined as the inverse of the resistance.
 
  • #9
berkeman said:
The poster may have been thinking of the use of Litz wire, which is a specialized kind of multi-stranded wire which does have a significantly lower inductance than solid wire:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Litz_wire
the man in the segment was the inventor of this conductive plastic, and said that, while he had patented it, he was still making deals with possible customers/buyers... so this is not a product that has yet seen commercial light by any means.

he claimed that this was literally a plastic conductor (no wires, no metal, etc.)... he claimed that thanks to this technology, incredibly light and cheap electronics could be manufactured (i.e: without the need of metals: if memory serves me right, one of his prototypes was a remote control car that is made entirely out of various forms of this plastic: from the antenna to all its parts).

I don't know much about electronics, so I hope someone who does saw the segment and might be able to explain it better. the show is usually reliable so I doubt it was a case of media misinterpreting science or something like that.
 
  • #10
moe darklight said:
the man in the segment was the inventor of this conductive plastic...
Was he a white-haired old man?
 
  • #11
moe darklight said:
if memory serves me right, one of his prototypes was a remote control car that is made entirely out of various forms of this plastic: from the antenna to all its parts).

Kind of hard to make an effective electric motor or solenoid without ferrous metals.
 
  • #12
Gokul43201 said:
Was he a white-haired old man?

he was rather young... maybe in his 40's, brown curly hair, somewhat chubby.

berkeman said:
Kind of hard to make an effective electric motor or solenoid without ferrous metals.

like I said, I don't know the first thing about electronics, so my interpretation of this segment is probably very poor :biggrin:. but the segment did make a point constantly of how groundbreaking this new material was. that's why I was hoping someone here had seen the segment or heard about this material.
 
  • #13
moe darklight said:
he claimed that this was literally a plastic conductor (no wires, no metal, etc.)... he claimed that thanks to this technology, incredibly light and cheap electronics could be manufactured (i.e: without the need of metals: if memory serves me right, one of his prototypes was a remote control car that is made entirely out of various forms of this plastic: from the antenna to all its parts).
Conductive plastics (polyaniline, et al) have been around for a couple decades now, I think. I don't see what's new about this.

I don't know much about electronics, so I hope someone who does saw the segment and might be able to explain it better. the show is usually reliable so I doubt it was a case of media misinterpreting science or something like that.
Daily Planet does not air in the US! I tried to dig up old episodes from their CTV website, but the archives go back only to september.
 
  • #14
it doesn't? O I figured it did, seeing as some of the bigger Canadian shows air in the US too.

Yea, I tried looking for the episode in their website too but it doesn't go that far back. O well... I guess it'll remain a mystery.— either that or the predictions of the guy in the segment will turn true and revolutionize electronics and we'll all know what it's all about :biggrin:
 
  • #15
Alan Heeger (one of 2 people that won the Nobel Prize for conductive plastics), in a talk he gave here a few years ago, promised us that the day when we will be printing circuit boards off an inkjet printer was just round the corner!
 
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1. What is the significance of the plastic conductor discovery?

The plastic conductor discovery has revolutionized the field of electronics by providing a new type of material that can conduct electricity. This has opened up the possibilities for more flexible and lightweight electronic devices, as well as reducing the reliance on traditional metal conductors that are more expensive and less environmentally friendly.

2. How does the plastic conductor work?

The plastic conductor is made up of a polymer material that has been doped with conductive particles, such as carbon nanotubes. When an electric field is applied, these particles align and create a pathway for electricity to flow through the plastic. This allows the plastic to conduct electricity just like a metal, but with the added benefit of flexibility.

3. What types of electronic devices can benefit from this discovery?

Any electronic device that requires a conductor can potentially benefit from this discovery. This includes smartphones, laptops, wearable technology, and even larger devices such as solar panels. The flexibility of the plastic conductor also makes it ideal for use in flexible or curved displays and touchscreens.

4. What are the potential drawbacks of using plastic conductors?

One potential drawback is that plastic conductors may not be as efficient at conducting electricity as traditional metal conductors. This means that they may not be suitable for high-power or high-speed applications. Additionally, the long-term durability and stability of plastic conductors are still being studied and may require further research and development.

5. How will this discovery impact the electronics industry?

The plastic conductor discovery has the potential to greatly impact the electronics industry by providing a more cost-effective and environmentally friendly alternative to traditional metal conductors. It also opens up new possibilities for design and functionality in electronic devices. However, it may also disrupt existing supply chains and manufacturing processes, requiring companies to adapt and invest in new technology.

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