Lagrangian for Applied Torque on a Hoop with Bead

In summary, the conversation discussed the difficulty in understanding how to account for the applied torque within the Lagrangian and Euler-Lagrange equations in order to determine the equations of motion for a bead on a hoop. The applied torque was defined as τ = I ψ''[t], and the Lagrangian was defined as L = T-V, where T is the total kinetic energy of the system and V is the potential energy. The conversation also questioned whether it is appropriate to set the Euler-Lagrange equation equal to the applied torque instead of 0. Overall, the conversation focused on clarifying the concepts and variables involved in solving the problem.
  • #1
DrChicken
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Homework Statement



I included the problem as an attachment. My difficulty lies within understanding how to account for the applied torque within the Lagrangian and subsequent Euler-Lagrange equations, which is what I want to use to determine the equations of motion of the bead on the hoop through ψ''[t] and θ''[t].


Homework Equations



My physical understanding of the system tells me that the torque induces an angular velocity about the z axis which contributes to the kinetic energy of the particle. In addition, the particle's velocity along the path of the hoop contributes to the kinetic energy of the particle.

The applied torque is:
τ = I ψ''[t]

The Lagrangian is naturally:
L = T-V = total kinetic energy of the system - potential energy
T = 1/2 m v2 = 1/2 m v12 + 1/2 m v22
v1 = Rθ'[t]
v2 = ψ'[t]Rcosθ
V = -mgRcosθ

Euler-Lagrange with q as the generalized displacement variable:
d/dt(∂L/∂q'[t]) - ∂L/∂q = τ?

I'm not sure if it is appropriate to set this equal to the applied torque, rather than 0 (which is what I've been used to with closed systems).

Am I on the right track here?
 
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  • #2

1. What is the Lagrangian for Applied Torque on a Hoop with Bead?

The Lagrangian for Applied Torque on a Hoop with Bead is a mathematical expression that describes the motion of a bead on a hoop when an external torque is applied. It takes into account the kinetic and potential energies of the system and is used to find the equations of motion.

2. How is the Lagrangian for Applied Torque derived?

The Lagrangian for Applied Torque is derived from the Lagrangian formalism, which is a mathematical approach for analyzing the dynamics of a system. It involves finding the difference between the kinetic and potential energies of the system, and then using this difference to find the equations of motion.

3. What are the variables in the Lagrangian for Applied Torque?

The variables in the Lagrangian for Applied Torque include the position and velocity of the bead on the hoop, the radius of the hoop, the mass of the bead, and the applied torque. These variables are used to calculate the kinetic and potential energies of the system.

4. How is the Lagrangian for Applied Torque used in practical applications?

The Lagrangian for Applied Torque is used in many practical applications, such as in the design of mechanical systems and in robotics. It is also used in physics and engineering research to understand the dynamics of rotating systems.

5. Are there any limitations to using the Lagrangian for Applied Torque?

While the Lagrangian for Applied Torque is a powerful tool for analyzing the motion of a bead on a hoop, it does have its limitations. It assumes that the hoop is a perfect circle and that the bead moves without any friction. These assumptions may not hold true in real-world situations, so the results obtained from the Lagrangian may not be entirely accurate.

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