The size of the orbits of a finite normal subgroup

In summary, the conversation discusses verifying the formula (h,h')(x)=hxh'-1 as an action of H x H on G. The first part is solved and the second part requires the hint that (1,1)x=x be checked to confirm a group action. The orbit of g is HgH and if H is normal, then HgH = g^{-1}HH = g^{-1}H. In general, gH \subseteq HgH and Hg \subseteq HgH. If |HgH| = |H| = |gH| = |Hg|, then it can be concluded that gH = HgH = Hg.
  • #1
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Homework Statement


Let H be a finite subgroup of a group G. Verify that the formula (h,h')(x)=hxh'-1 defines an action of H x H on G. Prove that H is a normal subgroup of G if and only if every orbit of this action contains precisely |H| points.

The Attempt at a Solution


I solved the first part of the question:
[tex]\left(\left(h,h'\right)\left(k,k'\right)\right)\left(x\right)=\left(hk,h'k'\right)\left(x\right)=hkx\left(h'k'\right)^{-1}=hkxk'^{-1}h'^{-1}=\left(h,h'\right)\left(\left(k,k'\right)\left(x\right)\right)[/tex]
This shows that the formula is a group homomorphism from H x H to G, and therefore it defines an action. But for the second part of the question I need a hint.
 
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  • #2
You may have omitted it intentionally because it's simple, but if not remember also to check (1,1)x = x to confirm that we have a group action.

The orbit of g is HgH.

If H is normal, then [itex]HgH = g^{-1}HH=g^{-1}H[/itex].

In general we have [itex]gH \subseteq HgH[/itex] and [itex]Hg \subseteq HgH [/itex]. Now if [itex]|HgH| = |H| = |gH| = |Hg|[/itex] can you conclude gH=HgH=Hg?
 
  • #3
rasmhop said:
You may have omitted it intentionally because it's simple, but if not remember also to check (1,1)x = x to confirm that we have a group action.

The orbit of g is HgH.

If H is normal, then [itex]HgH = g^{-1}HH=g^{-1}H[/itex].

In general we have [itex]gH \subseteq HgH[/itex] and [itex]Hg \subseteq HgH [/itex]. Now if [itex]|HgH| = |H| = |gH| = |Hg|[/itex] can you conclude gH=HgH=Hg?

I understand the line of reasoning, only one point is unclear to me. You say that [itex]HgH = g^{-1}HH=g^{-1}H[/itex]. But shouldn't this be [itex]HgH = gHH=gH[/itex]? Because for a normal subgroup H gH=Hg for all g in G?
 
  • #4
3029298 said:
I understand the line of reasoning, only one point is unclear to me. You say that [itex]HgH = g^{-1}HH=g^{-1}H[/itex]. But shouldn't this be [itex]HgH = gHH=gH[/itex]? Because for a normal subgroup H gH=Hg for all g in G?

Yes you're right.
 
  • #5
Thanks! Then I understand :)
 

1. What is a finite normal subgroup?

A finite normal subgroup is a subgroup of a group that is closed under conjugation, meaning that when an element of the subgroup is conjugated by any element of the original group, the result is still in the subgroup. Additionally, a finite normal subgroup has a finite number of elements.

2. How do you determine the size of the orbits of a finite normal subgroup?

The size of the orbits of a finite normal subgroup can be determined by using the orbit-stabilizer theorem. This theorem states that the size of an orbit is equal to the index of the stabilizer subgroup, which is the subgroup of elements that leave a specific element unchanged under conjugation. By calculating the index of the stabilizer subgroup, the size of the orbit can be determined.

3. What is the significance of the size of the orbits of a finite normal subgroup?

The size of the orbits of a finite normal subgroup can provide information about the structure of the group. For example, if the size of the orbits is relatively small, it may indicate that the group has a simpler structure and is easier to study. On the other hand, larger orbit sizes may suggest a more complex group structure.

4. Can the size of the orbits of a finite normal subgroup change?

Yes, the size of the orbits of a finite normal subgroup can change depending on the group and the subgroup chosen. For example, if the chosen subgroup is not normal, the size of the orbits may be different compared to a normal subgroup. Additionally, if the group is finite, the size of the orbits may change if the subgroup is changed.

5. How is the size of the orbits of a finite normal subgroup related to the order of the group?

The size of the orbits of a finite normal subgroup is related to the order of the group through the orbit-stabilizer theorem. The theorem states that the order of the group is equal to the product of the size of the orbit and the index of the stabilizer subgroup. So, if the order of the group and the size of the orbit are known, the index of the stabilizer subgroup can be calculated.

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