American soldiers shooting American civilians

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In summary, the shooting at Kent State University occurred during a weekend of demonstrations and protests, resulting in the deaths of four students. The soldiers involved were charged and found innocent of any criminal charges, but the State of Ohio was sued and eventually settled with some of the injured. Two students pleaded guilty, while charges against others were dropped. The event sparked criticism of both the soldiers' actions and the university's handling of the situation. The shooter(s) were not identified due to the soldiers wearing gas masks and no one was ultimately charged for the deaths. The event marked the end of the Reserves supporting a ROTC program at Kent State.
  • #1
Adam
65
1
What ever became of that shooting at Kent State University? Were the soldiers charged and convicted? Was their CO?
 
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  • #2
They were charged and found innocent of any criminal charges. Finding them innocent doesn't mean anyone approved of the way they handled things. The way the university had handled the May 4 weekend and demonstrations in the past also took a lot of criticism - the 'norm' at Kent St was primed for a situation that would go out of control.

The State of Ohio was sued and found 'innocent' in '75, but eventually an appeal resulted in a new civil suit trial. The state settled with some of the injured for $675,000 rather than face another trial.

Two of the students pleaded guilty to rioting, one was found guilty of a misdemeanor 'interfering with a fireman' charge (the shooting was just a culmination of a weekend that included burning down the ROTC building). The charges against 20 some other students were dropped (the order of the cases had the state's strongest cases first, so they quit after they lost a couple cases). Ironically, the only one to serve any time was the student guilty of the misdemeanor charge - he was wanted on a drug charge at the time and wound up doing 10-20 on the drug charge.

I lived near there and in was junior high school when that happened. Nearly 30 years later, my daughter joined the Ohio National Guard. :uhh:
 
  • #3
If you are really interested (and I doubt you are) you should read James Michener's book Kent State.

Since the soldiers were wearing gas masks (they had used tear gas earlier on the crowd) no one knows who fired the shots. Simply put, one of the soldiers, after having to wear a hot gas mask all day and being continually taunted by a crowd of college students, lost his cool and fired a shot. (No one knows if he aimed at a student, or just fired a warning shot.) Somone else, having heard the shot, must have thought the order to fire had been given and opened fire as well.

If a man is carrying a fully loaded rifle, don't taunt him. I guess that's the lesson that should be learned.
 
  • #4
There was a movie made called 'Billy Jack' which sort of depicted the scenerio Jdubya portrayed.
 
  • #5
One of the worst movies ever made.
 
  • #6
My God, we actually agree on something.

That can't be right. Maybe I should watch Billy Jack again.
 
  • #7
four dead in O HI O

Here are the names of those who died at Kent State, so that they may not be forgotten:

ALISON KRAUSE

JEFFREY MILLER

SANDRA SCHEUER

WILLIAM SCHROEDER

it was murder plain and simple
whitewashed by the government in a BOGUS trial on civil rights charges
in federal court
no state charges were ever filed

THE PIGS GOT AWAY WITH MURDER THAT DAY
 
  • #8
Talk about government education !
 
  • #9
BoulderHead said:
Talk about government education !

Defines "oxymoron"!
 
  • #10
No one was charged because no one knew who did it!

To file charges, you have to have more than a suspect. You have to have evidence. All of the soldiers were wearing gas masks, and no one ever was able to make a positive id of the shooter(s).

The entire event was unfortunate. The ROTC building should not have been burned. The students should have dispersed as they were told. The students should not have thrown rocks at the Guardsmen. The Guardsmen should not have opened fire.

It's basic human nature. They have been wearing gas masks all day. It's hot. Students burned down their headquarters the night before. They are insulting them and throwing stuff at them. Sooner or later, someone is going to lose his cool. And it happened. No excuse, but certainly no surprise.
 
  • #11
JohnDubYa said:
No one was charged because no one knew who did it!

To file charges, you have to have more than a suspect. You have to have evidence. All of the soldiers were wearing gas masks, and no one ever was able to make a positive id of the shooter(s).

The entire event was unfortunate. The ROTC building should not have been burned. The students should have dispersed as they were told. The students should not have thrown rocks at the Guardsmen. The Guardsmen should not have opened fire.

It's basic human nature. They have been wearing gas masks all day. It's hot. Students burned down their headquarters the night before. They are insulting them and throwing stuff at them. Sooner or later, someone is going to lose his cool. And it happened. No excuse, but certainly no surprise.

Only one correction - the National Guard unit wasn't headquartered on campus. The ROTC building contained classrooms for students training to become officers in the reserves or possibly as active duty officers.
Demonstrators had also harassed students that were participating in the ROTC program, sometimes physically, resulting in superficial scrapes and bumps. (ROTC stands for Reserve Officer Training Course and provides a pretty good tuition assistance program starting with a student's second year in the program).

That weekend marked the end of the Reserves supporting a ROTC program at Kent St. It took a long time before the Reserves were interested in starting a ROTC program back up at Kent St.
 
  • #12
Adam, I don't understand why nearly every thread you start has the purpose of bashing the USA. Sure, we have our share of problems, but so do all countries. There are many much worse human rights records.
 
  • #13
I think the C in ROTC stands for Corps.
 
  • #14
Dissident Dan said:
Adam, I don't understand why nearly every thread you start has the purpose of bashing the USA. Sure, we have our share of problems, but so do all countries. There are many much worse human rights records.

WTF are you talking about?
 
  • #15
WTF are you talking about?

He's probably talking about the fact that nearly every thread you start in this forum has the apparent purpose of bashing the USA.
 
  • #16
Ah, assumptions. Very clever. I'm accustomed to it though.
 
  • #17
Adam said:
Ah, assumptions. Very clever. I'm accustomed to it though.
So what was the purpose of this thread then? You were curious and didn't feel like googling? Do you honestly think anyone believes that? This incident happened 30 years ago. Why bring it up? What is the relevance?
 
  • #18
JohnDubYa said:
I think the C in ROTC stands for Corps.

Thanks. Twenty years in the military and I never could get the hang of all the acronyms.

Granted, neither did the military. I remember when I first joined I had to look up TBD in the glossary and all it said was "To be determined". Twenty years of eager anticipation to no avail - twenty years later, they still hadn't determined what it meant. :confused:
 
  • #19
BOBG- HAHA Thanks!
 
  • #20
russ_watters said:
So what was the purpose of this thread then? You were curious and didn't feel like googling? Do you honestly think anyone believes that? This incident happened 30 years ago. Why bring it up? What is the relevance?

I usually don't sit here searching through the internet using search engines. I generally post what I know or already have bookmarked or such. So, as you suggested, I didn't feel like "googling".

Why bring it up? Since it was raised in another thread, I was curious. I did not know what happened after the incident.

Now perhaps you could leave off your obsesssion with me (although I'm flattered, certainly) and focus on the topic?
 

1. Why would American soldiers shoot American civilians?

There could be a variety of reasons for this, such as a breakdown of military discipline, confusion or miscommunication during a chaotic situation, or even intentional acts of violence by individual soldiers. It is important to thoroughly investigate each incident to determine the specific cause.

2. Is this a common occurrence in the United States?

No, it is not a common occurrence. Incidents of American soldiers shooting American civilians are rare and isolated events. The vast majority of military personnel are well-trained and committed to upholding the law and protecting civilians.

3. What measures are in place to prevent this from happening?

The military has strict rules and regulations in place to ensure the safety of civilians and to prevent any use of excessive force. Soldiers also undergo extensive training on the rules of engagement and proper use of weapons. Any incidents are thoroughly investigated and appropriate disciplinary action is taken.

4. Are there any consequences for soldiers who shoot civilians?

Yes, there are consequences for any soldier who shoots a civilian without justification. This could include legal repercussions, as well as disciplinary action within the military. The severity of the consequences will depend on the specific circumstances and the outcome of the investigation.

5. How can the military improve to prevent these incidents in the future?

The military is constantly reviewing and updating their protocols and training to prevent any incidents of American soldiers shooting American civilians. This includes ongoing education and training on the rules of engagement, as well as implementing stricter accountability measures for soldiers. Additionally, open communication and transparency between the military and civilian communities can help to prevent misunderstandings and promote trust and understanding.

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