Where Does the Equation E=p_x+\frac{p_y^2}{2m}+\frac{p_z^2}{2m} Come From?

  • Thread starter Piano man
  • Start date
In summary, the conversation is discussing how to use the Hamilton-Jacobi equation to find the trajectory and motion of a particle in a potential. The conversation mentions the Hamiltonian and the time-independent HJ equation, as well as the concept of conserved momenta and the method of separation of variables. The conversation ends with confusion about the value of E and how it is related to the Hamiltonian.
  • #1
Piano man
75
0
I'm having a bit of difficulty understanding part of this problem:

Using the Hamilton-Jacobi equation find the trajectory and the motion of a particle in the
potential [tex]U(r)=-Fx [/tex]

The Hamilton-Jacobi Equation: [tex]\frac{\partial S}{\partial t}+H(q_1,...,q_s;\frac{\partial S}{\partial q_1},...,\frac{\partial S}{\partial q_s};t)=0[/tex]

Starting off with the Hamiltonian:
[tex]
H(p_x,p_y,p_z,x,y,z)=\frac{p_x^2}{2m}-Fx+\frac{p_y^2}{2m}+\frac{p_z^2}{2m}[/tex]

From HJE, since y and z are cyclic,
[tex]
S(x,y,z;p_x,p_y,p_z;t)=-Et+p_yy+p_zz+S(x,p_x)[/tex]

All this is grand, but the next step in the solutions I have say that we can now say that [tex]
E=p_x+\frac{p_y^2}{2m}+\frac{p_z^2}{2m}[/tex]

I don't see where this comes from.

Any ideas?
Thanks
 
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  • #2
The action is not a function of the momenta explicitly. The conserved momenta (those that are conjugate to the cyclic coordinates, i.e. the coordinates that do not enter in the Hamiltonian explicitly) take the role of the arbitrary constants in finding the complete integral of the HJ eqn by the method of separation of variables.
 
  • #3
Ok, but how does that explain where E comes from?
 
  • #4
If the Hamiltonian is time-indpendent, then energy is a sonserved quantity and [itex]-E[/itex] is the corresponding "conjugate variable". By writing the action as:

[tex]
S(q, t) = S_{0}(q) - E \, t
[/tex]

the time-dependent HJ eqn:

[tex]
\frac{\partial S}{\partial t} + H(q, \frac{\partial S}{\partial q}) = 0
[/tex]

becomes:

[tex]
\frac{\partial S}{\partial t} = -E, \; \frac{\partial S}{\partial q_{j}} = \frac{\partial S_{0}}{\partial q_{j}}
[/tex]

[tex]
H(q, \frac{\partial S_{0}}{\partial q}) = E
[/tex]

This is the time-independent HJ eqn.
 
  • #5
Right, but surely then, in the example above, E should equal H, since the Hamiltonian is time independent anyway.

But the Hamiltonian is [tex]
H(p_x,p_y,p_z,x,y,z)=\frac{p_x^2}{2m}-Fx+\frac{p_y^2}{2m}+\frac{p_z^2}{2m}[/tex]

and the required value for E is
[tex]
E=p_x+\frac{p_y^2}{2m}+\frac{p_z^2}{2m}[/tex]

Why is that?
 
  • #6
I don't know what you are talking about. After you had substituted:

[tex]
S_{0}(x, y, z) = f(x) + p_{y} \, y + p_{z} \, z
[/tex]

into the time independent HJ eqn, you should get:

[tex]
f'(x) = \left(2 m \, E - p^{2}_{y} - p^{2}_{z} + 2 m \, F \, x\right)^{\frac{1}{2}}
[/tex]

Then, you should integrate this and you will get the complete integral. The arbitrary constants are [itex]p_{y}, p_{z} and E[/itex].
 

1. What is the Hamilton-Jacobi equation?

The Hamilton-Jacobi equation is a mathematical formula that describes the evolution of a physical system over time. It is a partial differential equation that is used to calculate the state of a system at a specific time, based on its initial state and the forces acting on it.

2. Who developed the Hamilton-Jacobi equation?

The Hamilton-Jacobi equation was developed by the Irish mathematician William Rowan Hamilton and the Swiss mathematician Carl Gustav Jacob Jacobi in the early 19th century.

3. What is the significance of the Hamilton-Jacobi equation?

The Hamilton-Jacobi equation is a fundamental tool in classical mechanics and is used to solve problems related to the motion of particles, such as finding the optimal path for a particle to travel from one point to another. It is also used in other fields, including quantum mechanics, optics, and control theory.

4. How does the Hamilton-Jacobi equation relate to other equations in physics?

The Hamilton-Jacobi equation is closely related to other important equations in physics, such as the Schrödinger equation and the Lagrange equations. In fact, the Schrödinger equation can be derived from the Hamilton-Jacobi equation in quantum mechanics.

5. What are some practical applications of the Hamilton-Jacobi equation?

The Hamilton-Jacobi equation has many practical applications in physics and engineering. It is used in celestial mechanics to predict the orbits of planets and satellites, in aerospace engineering to design optimal trajectories for spacecraft, and in economics to study optimal decision-making processes. It is also used in computer graphics and video game development to simulate the motion of objects.

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