Can a Wind Turbine Improve the Efficiency of a Moving Car?

In summary, the conversation discusses the possibility of attaching a wind turbine connected to a generator to a moving car in order to extract energy from the air flowing around the car. It is debated whether this is possible, economical, and practical. Some argue that it would create a loss in overall efficiency, while others suggest it could be used for small tasks such as recharging a cell phone. However, it is ultimately concluded that this idea is not practical as the energy given to the turbine would be greater than the output of the turbine.
  • #71
The_Thinker said:
If supposing we were to add a wind turbine connected to a generator to a moving car, would we be able to get the air flowing around the car to turn the turbine and therefore gain some energy? If it is possible, is it economical? if it is, is it practical? would there be a loss? would there be any gain in overall efficiency??

A friend of mine wants to do this project for collage and wants to implement this idea... I just want to know if it is practical or not...

So... what do you guys think?
i don't think it ia possible because there are factors to be considered
1. the place to place the turbine
2.the efficiency of converting the energy from the wind turbine for the car's use
 
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  • #72
i think it is possible. a paddlewheel behind the car in its wake can extract the energy. it will decrease the drag coefficient of the car aswell.
 
  • #73
lazypast said:
i think it is possible. a paddlewheel behind the car in its wake can extract the energy. it will decrease the drag coefficient of the car aswell.

<smacks forehead>...you just had 5 pages of explaining why you can't do this. Did you read any previous posts?
 
  • #74
AYANTAYO said:
i don't think it ia possible because there are factors to be considered
1. the place to place the turbine
2.the efficiency of converting the energy from the wind turbine for the car's use

Ditto for you. I really don't understand why anyone is posting what they *think* when you all have been given sufficient fact as to why this will not work. One should avoid "I think" or "I believe" when making engineering statements. Either it is or it isnt. This thread has probably reached the point of diminishing returns.
 
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  • #75
To think I just read 5 pages of this...

To put it in complete layman's terms. Hold your hand out the window of a moving car. Then hold your hand out the window while holding a fan. The drag caused by the fan pushes your hand back harder now. If you have a 100% efficient wind turbine and a 100% efficient car engine you get all the drag added back as energy, but why? It would be easier to just directly couple the car engine to a generator, and that assumes everything is 100% efficient which is impossible. There is no way you can win.

If you decide to reduce drag and place a turbine in it's place then it's the same result. 10Kw required to keep the car at highway speeds, you reduce the drag to save 3kw then add a turbine that generates 1kw at 30% efficiency. Yup you win it now takes 10 kw to drive the car minus the 1kw you now generate, so 9kw. But, if you can reduce power required by 3kw then why add the generator? You can now drive at highway speeds on 7kw vice 10.

Somebody lock this thread please.
 
  • #76
chayced said:
To think I just read 5 pages of this...

To put it in complete layman's terms. Hold your hand out the window of a moving car. Then hold your hand out the window while holding a fan. The drag caused by the fan pushes your hand back harder now. If you have a 100% efficient wind turbine and a 100% efficient car engine you get all the drag added back as energy, but why? It would be easier to just directly couple the car engine to a generator, and that assumes everything is 100% efficient which is impossible. There is no way you can win.

If you decide to reduce drag and place a turbine in it's place then it's the same result. 10Kw required to keep the car at highway speeds, you reduce the drag to save 3kw then add a turbine that generates 1kw at 30% efficiency. Yup you win it now takes 10 kw to drive the car minus the 1kw you now generate, so 9kw. But, if you can reduce power required by 3kw then why add the generator? You can now drive at highway speeds on 7kw vice 10.

Somebody lock this thread please.

I have no idea where or what these "made up" power values come from.
 
  • #77
It was clearly a hypothetical example.
 
  • #78
xxChrisxx said:
It was clearly a hypothetical example.

The example doesn't even make any sense, and neither do the numbers. A wind turbine at the back of the car will promote flow separation. You cannot reduce the drag and then add a wind turbine. This is a fallacious line of argument.
 
  • #79
Cyrus said:
I have no idea where or what these "made up" power values come from.

Just hypothetical. It really doesn't matter because any numbers you put in will give you the same result. I was just illustrating a point.

Also I don't see where my point gets confusing. Anything you do to generate electricity adds drag. If you reduce drag to add drag then you lose from the inefficiencies of your generator. Why not just reduce the drag in the first place if you already have this ability.
 
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  • #80
Cyrus said:
The example doesn't even make any sense, and neither do the numbers. A wind turbine at the back of the car will promote flow separation. You cannot reduce the drag and then add a wind turbine. This is a fallacious line of argument.

It doesn't matter.

It illustrated the point that it adds another layer on efficiency to factor in (the numbers used not being mega accurate is irrelevent). It also demonstrated the extra steps the energy takes from engine to motion.

In the case above even though you think you are winning as you are recovering 1kw from the original 10. You still lose as you could only be using 7.It's a case of spending a pound to save a penny.
 
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  • #81
Precisely.
 
  • #82
The_Thinker said:
If supposing we were to add a wind turbine connected to a generator to a moving car, would we be able to get the air flowing around the car to turn the turbine and therefore gain some energy? If it is possible, is it economical? if it is, is it practical? would there be a loss? would there be any gain in overall efficiency??

A friend of mine wants to do this project for collage and wants to implement this idea... I just want to know if it is practical or not...

So... what do you guys think?
Of course it is possible to add a wind turbine. and this would produce energy in the form of electricity. Not practical or economic...It would take MORE gasoline to do this. anytime you add drag you need at add gas to overcome the drag. you can not get something for nothing. the fact you are adding drag is proven by wind tunnel drag tests. period..case closed.
now what you can do is to recover waste HEAT produced by the internal COMBUSTION engine. combustion being the key here.
 
  • #83
Perhaps if we build a large, wooden Badger...
 
  • #84
This thread has run its course.

[Hey Fred, congrats, you've invented a new counterpart to Goodwin's law...we'll call it the Monty Python law. It states: "As an online engineering discussion grows longer, the probability of a reference to Monty Python approaches 1."]
 
<h2>1. Can a wind turbine really improve the efficiency of a moving car?</h2><p>Yes, a wind turbine can improve the efficiency of a moving car by generating electricity that can be used to power the car's electrical systems, reducing the load on the engine and improving fuel efficiency.</p><h2>2. How does a wind turbine on a car work?</h2><p>A wind turbine on a car works by harnessing the kinetic energy of the moving air and converting it into electricity. The turbine is usually mounted on the roof or hood of the car and is connected to a generator that produces electricity.</p><h2>3. What are the potential benefits of using a wind turbine on a car?</h2><p>The potential benefits of using a wind turbine on a car include improved fuel efficiency, reduced emissions, and cost savings on fuel. It can also provide a backup power source in case of a battery failure or emergency.</p><h2>4. Are there any limitations to using a wind turbine on a car?</h2><p>Yes, there are some limitations to using a wind turbine on a car. The size and design of the car can affect the efficiency of the turbine, and it may not be suitable for all types of vehicles. Additionally, the added weight and drag of the turbine may slightly decrease the car's overall performance.</p><h2>5. Is it possible to install a wind turbine on an existing car?</h2><p>Yes, it is possible to install a wind turbine on an existing car, but it may require some modifications and professional installation. It is important to consult with a mechanic or engineer to ensure the turbine is installed properly and does not cause any damage to the car.</p>

1. Can a wind turbine really improve the efficiency of a moving car?

Yes, a wind turbine can improve the efficiency of a moving car by generating electricity that can be used to power the car's electrical systems, reducing the load on the engine and improving fuel efficiency.

2. How does a wind turbine on a car work?

A wind turbine on a car works by harnessing the kinetic energy of the moving air and converting it into electricity. The turbine is usually mounted on the roof or hood of the car and is connected to a generator that produces electricity.

3. What are the potential benefits of using a wind turbine on a car?

The potential benefits of using a wind turbine on a car include improved fuel efficiency, reduced emissions, and cost savings on fuel. It can also provide a backup power source in case of a battery failure or emergency.

4. Are there any limitations to using a wind turbine on a car?

Yes, there are some limitations to using a wind turbine on a car. The size and design of the car can affect the efficiency of the turbine, and it may not be suitable for all types of vehicles. Additionally, the added weight and drag of the turbine may slightly decrease the car's overall performance.

5. Is it possible to install a wind turbine on an existing car?

Yes, it is possible to install a wind turbine on an existing car, but it may require some modifications and professional installation. It is important to consult with a mechanic or engineer to ensure the turbine is installed properly and does not cause any damage to the car.

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