Differentiating the american goverment from americans

[bjon-07]

After scanning these post, it is obvious that much of the world is (rightfully) against the war in Iraq and are also anti-american.

In your person experience to most people differentiate the actions of the american government from americans in general?

I myself being an american am often embarssed by the actions and attiude of of certian people in my government (not to meantion any names ).

Do you think that the anti-american attiude that has spread across the world is caused by action by our goverment, or is it caused by the actions/attuides of the american public (I will be the first to admit that the major of our nation are morons (look at the c@#P that passes for intertainment)).

 

[Kerrie]

great thread! yes, there is a big difference in the american people and the american government. there are, however, many american people who want to believe that our government can do no wrong, and will stand by the choices of those in power of our country (and in power of a lot in this world). these people perhaps still remember the times when the american government was a little more pure in it's intentions. i too am embarrassed at the ignorance of many american people who are spoon fed "facts" from the mass media then will talk about it with their coworkers/friends/families and go about eating their mcdonalds and starbucks as if the tradegies of other countries is merely a reality tv show. as americans, we do have it good, but many of us take this luxury of living in a sheltered nation for granted. many of us are wasteful, then complain that we don't have enough.

if we had a revolutionary war against our government like we did over 200 years ago, we would be labeled as terrorists rather then american who want their country back.

 

[Loren Booda]

The present U. S. government was installed by a minority of the American electorate, and presently is opposed by a majority of those polled nationally. The "ignorant minority" has effectively suppressed the "silent majority."

Unfortunately, some Christian denominations seem hellbent on instigating Armageddon. I pray that our president has the wisdom to refuse that malevolence.

Personally, I see my countrymen as equal to most others. In my opinion, the present is more appropriate for globalism rather than nationalism.

 

[Adam]

After scanning these post, it is obvious that much of the world is (rightfully) against the war in Iraq and are also anti-american.

I think you make assumptions. As do most people. I'm not anti-American, although I thoroughly dislike the USA government. Most idiots can't tell the difference, and make stupid assumptions from my posts.

 

[bjon-07]

ahh... So anyone who thinks americans means americans is an idoit while those who "know" that americans really means american government is an genius. Just like the members of the baath party are equivalent to iraqi.

 

[Adam]

ahh... So anyone who thinks americans means americans is an idoit while those who "know" that americans really means american government is an genius. Just like the members of the baath party are equivalent to iraqi.

The word is "idiot".

 

[kat]

Sorry, but there is no "big difference" between the American People and the American government. The government reflects the populace, if there is enough grievances of the populace against the government or the laws there are plenty of "checks and balances" to insure change. That line, is the biggest cop-out I know of.

 

[mooberrymarz]

I wouldn't consider my self-anti american. i just think that u guys are governed by people obessed with money power and who are very much EVIL.but u guyz did vote those idiots into power...

 

[jammieg]

The desire for money and power voted itself in.

 

[revelator]

I wouldn't definitely not refer to myself as Anti-American. Generally all the Americans I've met and/or dealt with have been good people. I would however consider myself anti-America (in that I disagree with the actions of the US Adiministration). I do my hardest to not let my displeasure with the Admin spill over onto the American people (especially considering the dubious circumstances under which Georgie was elected).

However let's say that in the upcoming election, Georgie were to win by a landslide and have the support of an overwhleming number of Americans, in this event I think the line between anti-America and anti-American will start to blur.

 

[Dissident Dan]

great thread! yes, there is a big difference in the american people and the american government. there are, however, many american people who want to believe that our government can do no wrong, and will stand by the choices of those in power of our country (and in power of a lot in this world). these people perhaps still remember the times when the american government was a little more pure in it's intentions.

When was the government pure in its intentions? When the government was committing genocide against the natives? When a black was 3/5 of a person? I think that our schooling and our culture, in general, put the USA in too positive a light. Too much confidence in one's (or one's country's) righteousness is dangerous. A healthy dose of skepticism and cynicism can go a long way.

if we had a revolutionary war against our government like we did over 200 years ago, we would be labeled as terrorists rather then american who want their country back.

Most likely.
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I think that most foreigners differentiate rather well between USAmericans and the US government. However, I do think that, out of all the developed, Western nations, the population of the USA seems to be the most 19th century.

 

[Simon666]

In your person experience to most people differentiate the actions of the american government from americans in general?

Depends on what place in the world you ask I suppose. I'm from Belgium. I differentiate between the US admin and the US public, but I have a hard time when I read things like that an enormous amount of people believe Saddam was directly responsible for 9-11 or that weapons of mass destruction have been found (poll before that silly single shell recently).

 

[jammieg]

In retrospect the Mexicans will probably be known as slaves is my prediction, I mean so many companies turn a blind eye to make a profit and so many people because everyone knows it's too costly to keep them out and too productive not to let them in as long as they are second class citizens and keep to themselves we all stand to benefit right, and surely they can't complain because it's the best they can get just like the asians and the blacks before that and of course the famined irish. Money has a mind of it's own I hope it finds it's way into the right hands because a lot of the world starves due to excessive greed and corruption.
Lol "worship satan" that can't be too fun.

 

[Kerrie]

When was the government pure in its intentions? When the government was committing genocide against the natives? When a black was 3/5 of a person? I think that our schooling and our culture, in general, put the USA in too positive a light. Too much confidence in one's (or one's country's) righteousness is dangerous. A healthy dose of skepticism and cynicism can go a long way.

if you are referring to our governments intentions of the 20th century and forward, then yes i have to agree. but i should have been more clearer in saying that our country's intentions were for the people when we first became a country (1776).

 

[Kerrie]

Sorry, but there is no "big difference" between the American People and the American government. The government reflects the populace, if there is enough grievances of the populace against the government or the laws there are plenty of "checks and balances" to insure change. That line, is the biggest cop-out I know of.

the government reflects the populace?? dear kat, you are living in the backwoods of maine! :tongue2: from my perspective, the government tends to do what is best for those in power as of recently (2000-present) and those who want to maintain loyalty to our "great" government go along for the sake of pride in the USA. maybe my perspective stems from living in ultra liberal land of oregon? many here (in OR) are quite fed up with what our country has turned into and are ashamed of it.

 

[Njorl]

In a democratic nation, the government either reflects the genuine beliefs of the people, or the ignorance and apathy of the people. Ususally it is a combination of both. Still, no democratic nation can reflect the views of its people perfectly.

My brief stint in foreign lands was during the height of the unilateral freeze movement in Europe. Even then, I was never treated badly for being an American. I hear that in Iran, ordinary people are eager to meet Americans and get to know them. In all but the most troubled places, I think an American is just another person, more interesting because they may be exotic. A hundred Americans though, is a different story.

Njorl

 

[Adam]

In a democratic nation, the government either reflects the genuine beliefs of the people, or the ignorance and apathy of the people.

I think you just summed it up very nicely.

 

[olde drunk]

the government reflects the populace?? dear kat, you are living in the backwoods of maine! :tongue2: from my perspective, the government tends to do what is best for those in power as of recently (2000-present) and those who want to maintain loyalty to our "great" government go along for the sake of pride in the USA. maybe my perspective stems from living in ultra liberal land of oregon? many here (in OR) are quite fed up with what our country has turned into and are ashamed of it.

ah, sweet kerrie, i am deeply pained to disagree with you. our current state of affairs could not have happened if we had not allowed it to.

we can not distance ourselves from our government. whether we like it or not, the government is a reflection of the people. even if only through appathy or disinterest.

all the dirty tricks of politics and business are being allowed because we have been comfortable (fed, clothed, sheltered, 2 cars, 2 TVs, 2 children, etc). this re-examination of our values may be the only good thing to come out of this war. sooner or later we will learn that bigger ain't better - government or business. it may be time to have some trust busting and decenteralization of power.

love and peace,
olde drunk

 

[kat]

Aaah! Contraire!

the government reflects the populace?? dear kat, you are living in the backwoods of maine! :tongue2: from my perspective, the government tends to do what is best for those in power as of recently (2000-present) and those who want to maintain loyalty to our "great" government go along for the sake of pride in the USA. maybe my perspective stems from living in ultra liberal land of oregon? many here (in OR) are quite fed up with what our country has turned into and are ashamed of it.

Dear Kerrie, I've lived in the backwoods of Maine since 1996. Mainly because of the lack of crime and the strong values. Nonetheless, Maine is a very "left" state (you can check the blue/red map if you don't believe me) and I, at the age of 42, have been in every state in this country except Alaska and have lived in midwestern, western and east coast states. I have also lived in several foriegn countries. So, I think I have a fairely good perspective on the country as a whole.
BUT, that is not really relevant as phsycological studies show that the majority of people vote for exactly those characteristics that powerful men who are voted into office in the unitedstates appear to have. These are the characteristics, albeit perhaps subconsicously, we expect to have the capability to lead our country. Otherwise we would be overwhelmingly voting for men, in both local and national votes, who displayed other characteristics.

I also am referring to men solely as I have not seen any phsycological studies on the type of women that Americans vote for.

 

[Kerrie]

Dear Kerrie, I've lived in the backwoods of Maine since 1996. Mainly because of the lack of crime and the strong values. Nonetheless, Maine is a very "left" state (you can check the blue/red map if you don't believe me) and I, at the age of 42, have been in every state in this country except Alaska and have lived in midwestern, western and east coast states. I have also lived in several foriegn countries. So, I think I have a fairely good perspective on the country as a whole.
BUT, that is not really relevant as phsycological studies show that the majority of people vote for exactly those characteristics that powerful men who are voted into office in the unitedstates appear to have. These are the characteristics, albeit perhaps subconsicously, we expect to have the capability to lead our country. Otherwise we would be overwhelmingly voting for men, in both local and national votes, who displayed other characteristics.

I also am referring to men solely as I have not seen any phsycological studies on the type of women that Americans vote for.

ok kat, i would have to respect your perspective as a broader one then my own due to your experiences and travels but i do feel it is a little "unfair" that we americans who do not support those decisions of our government (many of us here in this forum for example) are lumped as the same stereotype as our government's intentions point to. :shy:

 

[Dissident Dan]

if you are referring to our governments intentions of the 20th century and forward, then yes i have to agree. but i should have been more clearer in saying that our country's intentions were for the people when we first became a country (1776).

The native exterminations were in the 19th century, and the 3/5 of a person for slaves is a part of the 3/5 compromise that was incorporated into the Constitution. Of course, a lot of the movers and shakers during the founding of this country were more progressive than that, but had to compromise in order to get things done.

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Most people are too ignorant to know what people are doing in Washington. They rely on their societal prejudices and rhetoric to decide upon politicians. I believe that our current president does not have many of the perceived-as-good qualities that his supporters see in him. Most politicians seem to be pretty ridiculous in a lot of senses. To most people who care, though, it's only the other side that has the ridiculous politicians. There are also many to don't even pay attention.

There are some things that represent the will of the people, such as the Iraq War, although, in this case, that will was instigated in the first place by the administration manipulating them.

Most people have no idea about our Middle East policy, in general. "What's Gaza?" It's hard to say whatever policy we have over there is a result of the will of a large portion of the population.

 

[Kerrie]

The native exterminations were in the 19th century, and the 3/5 of a person for slaves is a part of the 3/5 compromise that was incorporated into the Constitution. Of course, a lot of the movers and shakers during the founding of this country were more progressive than that, but had to compromise in order to get things done.

Our country is far from perfect, but I do believe we are-in the general scope of the last 200+ years-are progressing. Our country is like a child learning to be a young adult perhaps. While looking at what is wrong with it, let's also look at what is right and what we have learned in the process of becoming better.

 

[bjon-07]

Sorry for the late reply...

The government does not represent the people... In the last election Bush LOST the popular vote!

Any ways, the political candidates that run for office do not represent the people, I do not vote for the candidate I 'like', I vote for the candidate I dislike the least. The thought of Kerry or Bush being present makes me sick. I am only 19 yrs old and have not had to power to vote for long.

It is true that my country has committed many atrocities, but if you look at history we are not alone in evil deeds. Any country that has power always tends to abuse it; it’s a sad fact of life (which should be changed). I can give you examples if you like, but I believe that history speaks for its self.

I think that the reason why Americans are apathetic to corruption in their government has to do with TV. Sadly many Americans live their life around TV and blindly believe what ever it tells them. TV has transformed many into mindless zombies. But there are still many Americans that have not sub-come to it. I honestly think the world would be a better place if someone where kill every celebrity in Hollywood and major corporations like Fox. Honestly who give a rats @#@ if who Brittney Spears is dating,…ect.

(Question to people in other countries) How does TV/movies/entertainment affect the mass of your nation?

bye the way it was good think that slaves where represented 3/5 of person as aposed to a whole person. This gave the inbreed southerns LESS POWER(remember african americans where not aloud to vote at this time), thus African Americans had more power.