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Loren Booda
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Their etymology seems similar, but how would you differentiate between their meanings? Is their disparity that the former applies mostly to philosophy, and the latter mostly to religion?
Sure. Take the notions of dreams and death. It is entirely likely that people will dream of loved ones after they have passed away. Losing them was already a powerful emotional experience so seeing them in a dream is also powerful. One could be tempted to think that they are still alive in a "supernatural" state, meaning a state that cannot be observed in nature, but only in dreams.Outlandish_Existence said:Someone explain how supernatural was ever conceived to be a conception of merit.
Yeah, definitely. Metaphysical objects seem to be in a class of unobservables and supernatural phenomena seem to be in a class of unreasonables. The natural philosopher combines both observation and reason. Perhaps this is where confusion on the two terms originates!Loren Booda said:Do you think the traditional name for a physical scientist, "natural philosopher," has any bearing on the possible similarity of the definitions for metaphysical and supernatural?
Masayasu said:selfAdjoint:
Well noted. Science must have seemed like wizardry to those who lived in times when the old languages were also alive. Perhaps those that couldn't part with concept of supernatural existence ultimately defined the character of the wizard as it is seen to day, a conqueror of magical or spiritual elements. I suppose those that finally accepted the exploration of metaphysical or supernatural phenomena as science would then call the wizard a scientist. A very interesting connection.
Loren Booda said:Please give some examples, Royce.
Canute said:I prefer to think that metaphysics is concerned with first principles, not with supernatural phenomena, even if there are such things. Thus metaphysics would be before physics and not just beyond it, whereas the supernatural would be beyond physics but not before it. (Where 'before' means something like epistemologically prior).
TokoloshesMasayasu said:I don't know much about cosmology or atoms, etc.., but I am under the impression that we are all made of of several different kinds of atoms. I wonder if ghosts are made up of atoms as well, and how they would be tied to the original host. I'm reaching, I know, and probably way off, but there must be some explanation for this phenomena.
When I was in indonesia recently I experienced something strange in a room I was staying in. The first night, nothing happened, except that I woke up around 3:00 am. The next night I had trouble sleeping. I kept feeling like I was being watched the whole time. I tried to close my eyes, but kept feeling something wierd. My wife was with me too. She felt the same thing. She finally fell asleep though, and I stayed awake for awhile until sleep overtook me as well. We then both woke up at 3:00 again. I couldn't get back to sleep after that. The next day again, no sleep, my wife fell a sleep, and the I was finally so tired that I had too. Note that all the lights were on. I was having weird dreams, very weird and disturbing. All of a sudden I woke up, and guess what time it was. So, at the same time, my wife woke up too. I asked her, did she turn off all of the lights. There was the bathroom light, and two others. As sat up for a moment and put my foot on the floor, all of the lights just flickered on. The next day, I asked if there was some kind of motion sensor or something, and there was not. We switched rooms. I slept just fine after that, and through the night as well. How does one explain it.
Mickey said:Yeah, definitely. Metaphysical objects seem to be in a class of unobservables and supernatural phenomena seem to be in a class of unreasonables. The natural philosopher combines both observation and reason. Perhaps this is where confusion on the two terms originates!
Royce said:There is not and cannot be "supernatural" if we take the term to mean outside of nature.
Galahad said:Sorry to walk into this discussion late, but could we not consider "supernatural" to mean anything real that cannot be described with mathematics? If something cannot be quantified or reduced to mathematics, does that mean it must be considered unreasonable or impossible?
selfAdjoint said:I don't think mathematical description is a good test. It is more or less a historical accident (driven by Galilieo, Descartes and Newton) that physics came to be identified with mathematical description, and physicists have come up with things that eluded mathematical description for a while (e.g. the Dirac Delta "function").
selfAdjoint said:I'd say beyond objective checkable empirical study.
Evo said:No one has posted in this thread for 4 years and the majority of them are no longer here.
Now that made me think. I have metaphysical question. Why we say "traveling near the speed of light"? If something is not traveling at speed of light there is a frame of reference in which this object is in rest. (Well that frame can change if the object is accelerating or worse)aristarkos said:...or maybe he hoped that one of them had been traveling near the speed of light.
Upisoft said:Now that made me think. I have metaphysical question. Why we say "traveling near the speed of light"? If something is not traveling at speed of light there is a frame of reference in which this object is in rest. (Well that frame can change if the object is accelerating or worse)
So either an object is traveling at speed of light (and therefore has rest mass 0) or it is at rest (with something).
Upisoft said:Now that made me think. I have metaphysical question. Why we say "traveling near the speed of light"? If something is not traveling at speed of light there is a frame of reference in which this object is in rest. (Well that frame can change if the object is accelerating or worse)
So either an object is traveling at speed of light (and therefore has rest mass 0) or it is at rest (with something).
Metaphysics is a branch of philosophy that deals with the fundamental nature of reality and existence. It explores questions about the nature of being, time, space, causality, and the relationship between mind and matter.
The supernatural refers to phenomena that are beyond the laws of nature and cannot be explained by science. This includes things like ghosts, spirits, and psychic abilities.
Science does not typically consider metaphysics and the supernatural to be valid areas of study. This is because these concepts cannot be tested or proven through scientific methods.
No, metaphysical and supernatural phenomena cannot be explained by science because they are not subject to the laws of nature and cannot be observed or measured in a scientific manner.
No, there is currently no scientific evidence or theories that support the existence of metaphysics or the supernatural. These concepts are considered to be outside the realm of scientific inquiry.