I stepped on a long, dirty and rusty nail

  • Thread starter heartless
  • Start date
In summary: ER.In summary, someone stepped on a nail at work and now their foot hurts a lot. They are worried it will affect their income, but after consulting with others, they decide to go to the doctor.
  • #71
cyrusabdollahi said:
I think they lock the doors when they see Pengwuino coming.

And people wonder why the US doesn't have universal health care...
 
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  • #72
Because people like you abuse the system. Mr. 'I will google a fake ID and scam the hospital system"
 
  • #73
arildno said:
Yes, even if he doesn't need to amputate anything, I think a wound like that will leave some permanent weakness, at least.

How do they amputate a limb whithout the patient bleeding to death? i mean it must take ages to saw through the bone, then they would have to seal every thing up some how.
 
  • #74
pinch the leg above the cut. Stops the flow of blood past that point.
 
  • #75
wolram said:
How do they amputate a limb whithout the patient bleeding to death? i mean it must take ages to saw through the bone, then they would have to seal every thing up some how.
Napoleon's field surgeon could saw through a man's thigh in the course of 10 minutes, I believe. I think that was a record of sorts.
 
  • #76
arildno said:
Napoleon's field surgeon could saw through a man's thigh in the course of 10 minutes, I believe. I think that was a record of sorts.

How careful were they?
 
  • #77
arildno said:
Napoleon's field surgeon could saw through a man's thigh in the course of 10 minutes, I believe. I think that was a record of sorts.

I remember reading that, but 10 mins is still a bloody long time.
 
  • #78
I agree, a long time. Bloodily so, I imagine.
 
  • #79
Pengwuino said:
How careful were they?
Oh pretty careful. After four to six weeks of healing, they could wear a bikini and there wouldn't even be a visible incision line.
 
  • #80
DaveC426913 said:
Oh pretty careful. After four to six weeks of healing, they could wear a bikini and there wouldn't even be a visible incision line.

All in a battlefield eh? That Napolean...
 
  • #81
I read that ships surgeons were quite nifty with saw as well, about the same period.
 
  • #82
a katana could do it in less than a second =) they should have hired some "medical" samurai
 
  • #83
slugcountry said:
a katana could do it in less than a second =) they should have hired some "medical" samurai

That would make sence, but can one of those things cut through a leg with one hit?
 
  • #84
edit - just realized that story was irrelevant, anyhow for sure they can slice clean through a human torso from the shoulder to the opposing hip - don't know if a leg would be different though.
 
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  • #85
Thank you all for good words. I waited entire night and tried to meditate and pain has decreased and I can move my two little toes again. Let me check the look of a foot right now. BRB

Ok, the foot looks alright, as far no signs of any symptoms mentioned by arildno. Again thanks for listing them. The only place where it hurts me is the punctured wound. When I push my finger onto it, it hurts, and when I walk, it also hurts me when I tauten the tendons in right foot, so I must assume that they're a little domagad. Hopefully everything will go fine.
 
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  • #86
heartless said:
Thank you all for good words. I waited entire night and tried to meditate and pain has decreased and I can move my two little toes again. Let me check the look of a foot right now. BRB
It seems you have been damned lucky.
However, you need to see a doctor today.
 
  • #87
Ibuprofen would be appropriate for the pain and inflamation, and aspirin might work, although it tends to affect coagulation of the blood.

Do keep the wound site clean.

Also, these days, I use a triple antibiotic like Neosporin (Neomycin sulfate, Bacitracin zinc, Polymyxin B Sulfate) on such wounds. Equate's "triple antibiotic ointment" is the same. http://www.neosporin.com/firstaid/neosporin.asp?sec=4&page=12 [Broken]

Benzoyl peroxide (anti-acne) topical ointment is also good near the wound site. It is bacteriostatic and I prefer to use it rather than antibiotics.
 
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  • #88
Heartless, why don't you see a doctor.
Just to put it across clearly

GO SEE A DOCTOR

My mom's a doctor, and when I grew up, I've heard enough warnings on rusty nails, tetanus and DEATH.

Why don't you go see a doctor and take a booster shot. I don't think you've still understood how serious this is! Your life is at risk!
 
  • #89
Astronuc said:
Also, these days, I use a triple antibiotic like Neosporin (Neomycin sulfate, Bacitracin zinc, Polymyxin B Sulfate) on such wounds. Equates "triple antibiotic ointment" is the same.

I doubt that will help him much - the label says quite clearly "In case of deep or puncture wounds... consult a doctor." Which is what everyone's been telling him since yesterday.
 
  • #90
Go to see a DOCTOR!

How can you be so ignorant of your health? Today 1 of my coworkers' 11 year old daughter passed away because of that sort of ignorance that some people have towards their health and their children's! It might seem fine now but how can you be sure that it wouldn't cause some problem for you in the future?
 
  • #91
Rach3 said:
I doubt that will help him much - the label says quite clearly "In case of deep or puncture wounds... consult a doctor." Which is what everyone's been telling him since yesterday.
Yes, I quite agree - and I think he got the message.
 
  • #92
heartless said:
Ok, the foot looks alright, as far no signs of any symptoms mentioned by arildno. Again thanks for listing them.

No, no, NO! Do NOT try to self-diagnose yourself like this! Having no symptoms does NOT mean you are safe!

The first symptoms of tetanus - which you very likely will get, by the way - won't appear for a few days or weeks. It's too late by then! You would have a one in four chance of DYING - EVEN WITH TREATMENT! Do you understand this?

Read: http://www.fda.gov/fdac/features/696_tet.html
 
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  • #93
I think the idea of DIEING seems to be lost on this kid.
 
  • #94
Ok people don't waste yor time with a dead person. well I mean a person that ignorance of his own health would die or threaten his health too soon!
 
  • #95
heartless said:
Thank you all for good words. I waited entire night and tried to meditate and pain has decreased and I can move my two little toes again. Let me check the look of a foot right now. BRB

Ok, the foot looks alright, as far no signs of any symptoms mentioned by arildno. Again thanks for listing them. The only place where it hurts me is the punctured wound. When I push my finger onto it, it hurts, and when I walk, it also hurts me when I tauten the tendons in right foot, so I must assume that they're a little domagad. Hopefully everything will go fine.
First, don't be sticking your finger inside the wound. You HAVE to be male. :rolleyes:

Just because there aren't any outwardly visible signs of infection doesn't mean an infection isn't starting deeper inside the wound. If you don't go to the doctor, I will ban you because I don't want someone dying in my forum. :grumpy:

Go to the doctor, you don't know what kind of damage the nail did. This is too risky to see if you're one of the very rare people that don't develop a serious infection.
 
  • #96
Rach3 said:
No, no, NO! Do NOT try to self-diagnose yourself like this! Having no symptoms does NOT mean you are safe!

The first symptoms of tetanus - which you very likely will get, by the way - won't appear for a few days or weeks. It's too late by then! You would have a one in four chance of DYING - EVEN WITH TREATMENT! Do you understand this?

Read: http://www.fda.gov/fdac/features/696_tet.html
Heartless READ THIS LINK!
 
  • #97
Kinda sad to think someones going to probably die on the forum.

This better not be some dipshoot joke like cyrus pulled on april fools.

Actually it BETTER be a dip**** joke like cyrus pulled on april fools
 
  • #98
Pengwuino said:
Kinda sad to think someones going to probably die on the forum.

This better not be some dipshoot joke like cyrus pulled on april fools.

...

If worst comes to worst, there is always amputation. Heartless, try to google "amputation" and take a look at the pictures that come up. That is your future if you do not take our advice.
 
  • #99
heartless, the problem is that whatever you do yourself is unlikely to get the wound cleaned all the way deep inside. Don't be fooled. Infection can take up to three days to really start setting in. Your topical antibiotics are not able to get all the way, deep inside the wound. You really should see a doctor today. If it's the cost, don't worry about it...that's your employer's responsibility since it was an on-the-job injury. Call your regular doctor. They might have Saturday hours, and this sort of injury is something they'll squeeze in an appointment for. If you get their answering service, leave a detailed message describing the injury...the answering service doesn't mean the doctor is completely unavailable, it means they screen the calls so the doctor is only disturbed by emergencies on his off hours...yours is still an emergency. If you can't get through to your doctor, and the hospital is too far for you to get to on your own, look in the phone book and see if there are urgent care clinics closer. Sometimes, in areas where there aren't nearby hospitals, or when they get really overcrowded often, smaller clinics open up for "urgent care" which means they can handle things that aren't likely to need hospitalization, such as wounds like yours (they can clean it properly, give you your tetanus booster, and a prescription for antibiotics that will make sure infection doesn't develop or spread, and can do an x-ray to see if you have any broken bones)...they're also good for things like broken bones (not compound fractures though, just simple fractures that can be easily reset and casted...if it needs surgery, they'll refer you on to the hospital anyway), and stitching up cuts that require stitches, and can treat minor illnesses, or determine if an illness is serious enough to require hospital treatment without having to sit in the ER for hours to be told you have the flu and go home and drink lots of fluids.

heartless, the other reason to go now is to simply have it documented by a doctor. Since your boss didn't have the sense or decency to get you to a doctor him/herself, you want something that shows you needed medical care for an on-the-job injury in case it causes more problems later. For example, if you get lucky and don't have any infection, and the hole itself heals up okay, but you have damage to a tendon or have chipped a bone and that leaves a weakness that later requires surgery, without any documentation that this was the result of a work-related injury, you'll be the one stuck with the bills later on, and may have problems getting insurance to pay because it's a "pre-existing condition" by then. But, if you have medical records that show you were treated now, and it was a job-related injury, even if you stop working for this employer, if this injury causes problems down the road, this employer is still the one responsible for your treatment. I know when you're 16, you really don't think about these things. Heck, people in their 20s and 30s often don't think of these things, but when you're still limping every time it rains when you're 40 or 50, you'll be thinking back to how foolish it was to not get that treated properly when you had the chance. I currently work with someone who is about 60 who has a lot of pain almost daily from old injuries he never got treated. He often comments, "When you're young and strong, you're not so careful. You don't think about when you get old."
 
  • #100
Well maybe if no ones taking the common sense approcah around him... maybe it wasnt even a penetrating wound and maybe just a ton of blunt trauma... somehow... hopefully.
 
  • #101
Mattara said:
...

If worst comes to worst, there is always amputation. Heartless, try to google "amputation" and take a look at the pictures that come up. That is your future if you do not take our advice.
Amputation isn't the worst-case-scenario. Death is. Tetanus is a horrible disease to die from, and completely preventable if you just get the booster shot in time. You don't hear about people dying from tetanus much anymore, and that's because we have vaccines and antibiotics available, and people get booster shots when they get injuries that put them at risk for it. There's just no reason to gamble with it.

WHEN TO CALL YOUR DOCTOR FOR PUNCTURE WOUND
Call 911 Now (your child may need an ambulance) If
Puncture on the head, neck, chest or abdomen that may go deep.

Call Your Doctor Now (night or day) If
You think your child has a serious injury.
Puncture on the head, neck, chest, abdomen that isn't deep.
Puncture overlying a joint.
Tip of the object is broken off and missing.
Feels like something still in the wound.
Won't stand (bear weight or walk) on punctured foot.
Needle stick from used or discarded injection needle.
Sharp object or setting was very dirty (e.g., a barnyard).
No previous tetanus shots.
Dirt (debris) or pencil lead pigment is not gone after 15 minutes of scrubbing.
Severe pain.
Wound looks infected (redness, red streaks, swollen, tenderness).
Fever occurs.
Call Your Doctor Within 24 Hours (between 9am and 4pm) If
You think your child needs to be seen.
Last tetanus booster was over 5 years ago.

http://www.lpch.org/HealthLibrary/ParentCareTopics/SkinLocalizedSymptoms/PunctureWound.html [Broken]

Tetanus

Tetanus (lockjaw) is a preventable but life-threatening bacterial infection that causes muscle spasms, difficulty opening the mouth (lockjaw), difficulty swallowing, and seizures. Tetanus bacteria are usually found in dirt and soil; they typically enter the body through a wound or cut.

Tetanus bacteria thrive only in the absence of oxygen. The deeper and narrower the wound, the less oxygen is around it, and the greater the possibility of tetanus. For example, tetanus bacteria can thrive in a puncture wound from a dirty nail.

Proper vaccination prevents tetanus. Before age 6, children receive a tetanus vaccination along with other regularly scheduled immunizations. People older than 6 years should have a tetanus booster shot every 10 years; in people age 7 and older, the tetanus booster is often combined with the diphtheria booster in a single shot (the Td booster).

A person who has a dirty cut or wound should get a tetanus shot within 48 hours if at least 5 years have passed since his or her last tetanus immunization.
http://www.bchealthguide.org/kbase/topic/symptom/pntwd/overview.htm

An additional medicine to prevent tetanus (hyperimmune globulin) may be needed when a wound is very dirty or at high risk of a tetanus infection and when the tetanus immunization schedule:

Is not known.
Is uncertain.
Has not been completed.
Tetanus immunization protects against tetanus (lockjaw), a bacterial infection that can occur when tetanus bacteria get in a wound (break in the skin or mucous membrane). Tetanus bacteria usually are found in the soil, especially dirty areas, such as areas with animal feces. The dirtier the wound, the higher the risk of tetanus. However, tetanus can also develop in a clean wound.

Tetanus bacteria enter the body through skin wounds and thrive only in the absence of oxygen. So, the deeper and narrower the wound and the less oxygen around the wound, the greater the possibility of tetanus. Preventing tetanus infection is important, because tetanus is often fatal.
http://www.bchealthguide.org/kbase/frame/sig30/sig3065/frame.htm

If the puncture is deep, is in your foot, is contaminated or is the result of an animal or human bite, see your doctor. He or she will evaluate the wound, clean it and, if necessary, close it. If you haven't had a tetanus shot within five years, your doctor may recommend a booster within 48 hours of the injury.
http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/first-aid-puncture-wounds/FA00014

Presentation

Most commonly, the patient will have stepped or jumped onto a nail. There may be pain and swelling but often the patient is only asking for a tetanus shot and can be found in the emergency department with his foot soaking in a basin of iodine solution. The wound entrance usually appears as a linear or stellate tear in the cornified epithelium on the plantar surface of the foot.

...

Clean the surrounding skin and carefully inspect the wound with the patient lying prone, with good light and adequate time. Examine the foot for signs of deep injury such as swelling and pain with motion of the toes. Although unlikely, test for loss of sensory or motor function.

...

Most puncture wounds only require simple debridement and irrigation, but with deep, highly contaminated wounds, seek orthopedic consultation to consider a wide debridement in the operating room to prevent the catastrophic complication of osteomyelitis.
http://www.ncemi.org/cse/cse1015.htm

Background: Osteomyelitis is an acute or chronic inflammatory process of the bone and its structures secondary to infection with pyogenic organisms.

...

Direct or contiguous inoculation osteomyelitis is caused by direct contact of the tissue and bacteria during trauma or surgery. Direct inoculation (contiguous-focus) osteomyelitis is an infection in the bone secondary to the inoculation of organisms from direct trauma, spread from a contiguous focus of infection, or sepsis after a surgical procedure. Clinical manifestations of direct inoculation osteomyelitis are more localized than those of hematogenous osteomyelitis and tend to involve multiple organisms.

...

In the US: The overall prevalence is 1 per 5,000 children. Neonatal prevalence is approximately 1 per 1,000. The annual incidence in sickle cell patients is approximately 0.36%. The prevalence of osteomyelitis after foot puncture may be as high as 16% (30-40% in patients with diabetes).

...

Morbidity can be significant and can include localized spread of infection to associated soft tissues or joints; evolution to chronic infection, with pain and disability; amputation of the involved extremity; generalized infection; or sepsis. Up to 10-15% of patients with vertebral osteomyelitis will develop neurologic findings or frank spinal-cord compression.

http://www.emedicine.com/emerg/topic349.htm

I don't know how to get it through to you...you need to see a doctor...NOW!
 
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  • #102
heartless - if it's a matter of money, I'll pay for you to see the doctor or ER! Seriously, don't risk your health. I'm not too far from you - and you can PM me with the doctor's phone number.
 
  • #103
H/L, just wait till you get to cold climates, every one of your past injuries will add up to mysery if they were not treated correctly.
 
  • #104
I think I have just won a lift to a hospital. We'll see in 5 minutes.
 
  • #105
heartless said:
I think I have just won a lift to a hospital. We'll see in 5 minutes.
Oh, I really hope you went. If you did, please let us know when you get back so we can stop worrying about you so much.
 

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