Determining groups not sure how to prove it.

  • Thread starter lostNfound
  • Start date
  • Tags
    Groups
In summary, the conversation is about trying to prove that the set G={a+b*sqrt(2) | a,b E R; a,b not both 0} is a group under ordinary multiplication. The main difficulties lie in proving closure and finding the inverse of an element. The conversation also touches on the concept of associativity and the use of a common trick to find the inverse. Ultimately, the conversation ends with the suggestion to rationalize the denominator in order to prove the inverse.
  • #1
lostNfound
12
0
I'm going through a abstract algebra book I found and am trying to learn more about group theory by going through some of the proofs and practice sets, but am having trouble with the following:

Prove that G={a+b*sqrt(2) | a,b E R; a,b not both 0} is a group under ordinary multiplication.

Any help would be awesome!
 
Physics news on Phys.org
  • #2
lostNfound said:
I'm going through a abstract algebra book I found and am trying to learn more about group theory by going through some of the proofs and practice sets, but am having trouble with the following:

Prove that G={a+b*sqrt(2) | a,b E R; a,b not both 0} is a group under ordinary multiplication.

Any help would be awesome!

Where are you stuck? You know that you need to verify each of the group axioms. Is your set closed under the given binary operation? Is there an identity? etc.
 
  • #3
lostNfound said:
So I know that in order to prove it is a group, there are several things that have to be confirmed, including associativity, closure, inverses, and identity. Associativity seems like it can be assumed, but the others till have to be proved. I'm having most of my trouble with the closure and inverse proofs, especially that for closure.

Closure is easy, you just take two arbirtrary elements a+b sqrt(2) and c + d sqrt(2), compute the product and show that it also is a member of G.

Inverses are a little harder, altough a very common trick that you should definitely know can be used to get

[tex] \frac { 1 } { a + b \sqrt(2) } [/tex] in the form: c + d sqrt(2)
 
  • #4
So I know that in order to prove it is a group, there are several things that have to be confirmed, including associativity, closure, inverses, and identity. Associativity seems like it can be assumed, but the others till have to be proved. I'm having most of my trouble with the closure and inverse proofs, especially that for closure.
Why did you delete this? I wouldn't say you should assume associativity but certainly you can just note that multiplication of real numbers is associative and this is just a subset of the real numbers. To show closure write the product of two such numbers as [itex](a+ b\sqrt{2})(c+ d\sqrt{2})[/itex] and actually do the multiplication. What do you get? Show that it can be written as [itex]u+ v\sqrt{2}[/itex] by showing what u and v must be. The identity is [itex]1= 1+ 0\sqrt{2}[/itex], of course.

And the multiplicative inverse of [itex]a+ b\sqrt{2}[/itex] is [itex]1/(a+ b\sqrt{2})[/itex]. Rationalize the denominator to show how that can be written in the form [itex]u+ v\sqrt{2}[/itex].
 
  • #5
Sorry I deleted that. I was trying to delete the post so people didn't feel like they needed to keep answering it. I was able to work out the answer on my own earlier. Thanks for the help though. I think we are on the same page.
 

1. How do you determine which groups to study?

There are several factors to consider when determining which groups to study. One important factor is the research question or hypothesis being investigated. Other factors may include the availability of participants, the feasibility of studying certain groups, and the potential impact of the research on the selected groups.

2. What methods can be used to determine group differences?

There are various statistical methods that can be used to determine group differences, such as t-tests, ANOVA, and regression analysis. These methods involve comparing the means or proportions of different groups and determining if the differences are statistically significant.

3. How do you control for confounding variables when determining group differences?

Controlling for confounding variables is essential in determining group differences. This can be done through random assignment, matching participants on relevant variables, or statistically controlling for these variables in the analysis.

4. How do you ensure the validity and reliability of your findings when determining group differences?

To ensure the validity and reliability of findings, it is important to use appropriate research methods and measures. This may include using validated instruments, conducting pilot studies, and using appropriate statistical analyses to minimize bias and error.

5. How can you ethically study different groups?

When studying different groups, it is important to adhere to ethical guidelines and principles. This may involve obtaining informed consent from participants, protecting their privacy and confidentiality, and ensuring that the research does not cause harm to the participants or their communities.

Similar threads

  • Linear and Abstract Algebra
Replies
2
Views
1K
  • Linear and Abstract Algebra
Replies
2
Views
2K
Replies
2
Views
965
  • Linear and Abstract Algebra
Replies
2
Views
1K
  • Linear and Abstract Algebra
Replies
2
Views
1K
  • Linear and Abstract Algebra
Replies
4
Views
1K
  • Linear and Abstract Algebra
Replies
1
Views
1K
  • Linear and Abstract Algebra
Replies
2
Views
1K
  • Linear and Abstract Algebra
Replies
8
Views
2K
  • Linear and Abstract Algebra
Replies
9
Views
2K
Back
Top