Limits of infinity , The simulaion of human brain

In summary, the conversation discusses the concept of the human brain as an observer and the potential problem of this idea leading to an infinite loop of observing oneself. The conversation also touches on the limitations of computational simulation of the brain and the question of whether this cycle has any limits. Additionally, there is a discussion about self-awareness and how a computer cannot truly know what it is doing due to the infinite loop of self-awareness. Finally, the conversation ends with a comment about the relevance of the discussion to quantum mechanics.
  • #1
chemistryknight
6
0
Human brain is an observer , and the problem of this idea is observing himself
the brain will observe an observer observe an observer observe an observer ... to infinity.
the real problem appears to people who work in computional simulation of brain ( infinite loop )
can this cycle have any limits ?
and what is the main rule control such cycles ?

and can such observation be represented in number with uncertainty principle ?
 
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  • #2
what the hack are you talking about?
 
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  • #3
A brain knows an object, and a computer behaves as though it knows an object, when a representation of that object exists in its memory (we are used to saying the computer knows, it does not know, etc.) although the computer does not 'really understand' its memory contents.
(However, unlike a computer, it is our experience that we know what we are doing at least when awake. For example, if I am lifting my hand, I know my hand, I also know that I know my hand, and also know that I am lifting my hand throughout the action of lifting.)

A computer cannot know what it is doing, for the
following reason: Suppose a computer knows a particular object A. To be self-aware, the computer must also know that it knows A, it must also know that it knows that it knows A, and so on. It is an infinite loop. According our definition of “computer knows”, to be self-aware, the computer must have a mechanism that can write all the sentences of the "I know that I know" loop into its memory, once a representation of A is entered into the memory. Since the machine has only a finite storage,
and takes a finite time no matter how small, to write each of the sentences, the machine can only complete a finite loop but not an infinite loop. Clearly, by executing the loop a finite number of times, the machine in fact, would not “really know” what it is doing; in other words, the loop has to be infinite and therefore a machine cannot be made to know what it is doing.
Completion of this infinite loop is in my opinion, must be happening in the brain because it necessarily follows from our observation that we know what we are doing unless that observation is wrong.
 
  • #4
Well, this is an annoying thread to read, mainly due to the second post!

I realize this is a very old thread, but I'm not sure I totally understand what you're saying. There is a problem with the whole "observer" point of quantum mechanics-- what lee smolin describes as the foundational problems of quantum mechanics, in his latest book. However, I'm not sure whether this is what you're talking about or not. From your original post, it seems not.
 
  • #5
There's really no need to resurrect such an old thread, especially when the original post was so nonsensical. Thread locked.
 

1. What is the concept of "limits of infinity" in science?

The concept of "limits of infinity" refers to the idea that there are certain phenomena or processes in the natural world that have no upper or lower bound. In other words, they have the potential to continue without an end or to become infinitely small. This concept is often used in mathematics, physics, and other scientific fields to describe phenomena such as the expansion of the universe or the behavior of particles at the quantum level.

2. How is the simulation of the human brain being studied and researched?

The simulation of the human brain is currently being studied and researched through a combination of approaches, including computational modeling, neuroimaging techniques, and data analysis. Scientists are also working on creating artificial neural networks that mimic the structure and function of the human brain in order to better understand its complex processes.

3. What are some potential benefits of simulating the human brain?

The simulation of the human brain has the potential to provide valuable insights into the functioning of the brain and its role in various cognitive processes, such as decision making, learning, and memory. It could also help in the development of new treatments for neurological disorders and diseases, as well as advancements in artificial intelligence and robotics.

4. Are there any ethical concerns surrounding the simulation of the human brain?

Yes, there are ethical concerns surrounding the simulation of the human brain, particularly when it comes to the potential creation of conscious or self-aware artificial intelligence. There are also concerns about the potential misuse of this technology, as well as issues of privacy and control over personal data.

5. How close are we to achieving a complete simulation of the human brain?

While significant progress has been made in simulating certain aspects of the human brain, such as specific cognitive processes or regions, a complete simulation of the entire human brain is still a long way off. The complexity and intricacy of the brain make it a challenging task, and there is still much research and development needed before such a feat can be achieved.

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