Measure (rings and algebras) question: smallest ring containing a set

In summary, the conversation discusses the existence of a unique smallest ring, R, containing a class of sets D in space X. The conversation explores different strategies for finding this smallest ring, including using set differences and unions, and considers the case of D being finite or infinite. The conversation also touches on the properties of rings in measure theory and the idea of finding the intersection of all possible rings containing D to determine the smallest set.
  • #1
VonWeber
52
0

Homework Statement



Let D be a class of sets of space X. There exists a unique smallest ring, R, containing D

The Attempt at a Solution



I'm working on the existence part.

If D were finite, I think that it would be possible to use set differences to find a set, D', of smaller sets from D (ones that could not be cut smaller using sets in D ).One could take all possible unions of sets in D'. I believe this would be one such set R.

However, if D were infinite or uncountable then I don't have any intuition. I'd prefer a hint rather then be given the solution...
 
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  • #2
You've either omitted a lot of important information, or your question is trivially false.

e.g. given any set of 4 objects, there are 24 different rings that contain exactly those 4 objects and nothing else, organized into two isomorphism classes of 12 each. (One class is isomorphic to [itex]\mathbb{Z} / 4[/itex], and the other to [itex]\mathbb{Z} / 2 \times \mathbb{Z} / 2[/itex]) And there may be more that I overlooked!
 
  • #3
Rings in measure theory, as in rings and algebras. I have that in the title of my post but forgot the word 'theory'... These rings are defined to be classes of sets

closed under unions,
closed under set differences (aka relative complement),
and containing the empty set.

I think I've made a little progress on this one though. The previous problem is to show that intersections of rings (algebras, sigma-rings and sigma-algebras) are also rings (algebras, sigma-rings and sigma-algebras).

I think that is relevant. If one could show that there must be at least one ring that contains all the sets in D then the intersection of all possible rings containing D must be the smallest such set. So I guess what I'm still missing is to show that there are such rings.
 
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  • #4
VonWeber said:
So I guess what I'm still missing is to show that there are such rings.
I assume earlier when you said "sets of space X" you were referring to subsets of (the set of points of) X? If so... isn't there a largest ring?

If one could show that there must be at least one ring that contains all the sets in D then the intersection of all possible rings containing D must be the smallest such set.
That sounds like a good approach.
 

1. What is a ring in mathematics?

A ring is an algebraic structure that consists of a set equipped with two binary operations, usually called addition and multiplication, that satisfy certain properties.

2. What is the smallest ring containing a set?

The smallest ring containing a set is the subring generated by the set, which is the intersection of all subrings that contain the set. It can also be thought of as the set of all possible combinations of elements from the original set using the ring operations.

3. How do you determine the smallest ring containing a set?

To determine the smallest ring containing a set, you can start by checking if the set itself is a ring. If it is not, you can take all possible combinations of elements from the set using addition and multiplication and see if they form a ring. If not, you can continue adding elements until you reach the smallest possible ring that contains the set.

4. What is the significance of the smallest ring containing a set?

The smallest ring containing a set is important in determining the structure and properties of the set. It can help identify patterns and relationships between elements in the set and provide a framework for further mathematical analysis and applications.

5. Can the smallest ring containing a set be unique?

Yes, the smallest ring containing a set can be unique. This is possible when the set itself is a ring or when the set has a special structure that uniquely determines the smallest ring containing it. However, in most cases, the smallest ring containing a set is not unique and can vary depending on the chosen operations and elements in the set.

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