From Feynman diagrams to potential

In summary, the conversation is discussing the process of obtaining the potential V(r1,r2) from the amplitude Sfi, which involves various terms and operators such as the exponential term of the Yukawa potential, the propagator, and the spinors. The main idea is to take the non-relativistic limit of the matrix element and then perform a Fourier transform to get the desired potential. The conversation also mentions the two methods of transforming the relativistic potential to non-relativistic one and the need to consider the conservation principle in the process.
  • #1
Thor Shen
17
0
I met a problem when I read the textbook "Relativistic Quantum Mechanics" by J.D.Bjorken. He said we can get the potential
V(r_1,r_2)=[itex]\frac{f^{2}}{\mu^{2}}(1-P_{ex})(\tau_1\cdot\tau_2)(\sigma_1\cdot\nabla_1)(\sigma_2\cdot\nabla_1)\frac{e^{-\mu|r_1-r_{2}|}}{|r_1-r_{2}|}[/itex]
(10.51)
from the amplitude
[itex]S_{fi}=\frac{(-ig_0)^2M^2}{(2\pi)^2\sqrt{E_1E_2E'_1E'_2}}(2\pi)^4\delta^4(p_1+p_2-p'_1-p'_2){[\chi^{+}_1\bar{u}(p'_1)i\gamma^5\tau u(p_1)\chi_1]\frac{i}{(p'_1-p_1)^2-\mu^2}\cdot[\chi^{+}_2\bar{u}(p'_2)i\gamma^5\tau u(p_2)\chi_2]
-[\chi^{+}_2\bar{u}(p'_2)i\gamma^5\tau u(p_1)\chi_1]\frac{i}{(p'_2-p_1)^2-\mu^2}\cdot[\chi^{+}_1\bar{u}(p'_1)i\gamma^5\tau u(p_2)\chi_2]}[/itex]
(10.45)

I can get the formula 10.50
[itex] \bar{u}(p'_1,s_1)\gamma^5 u(p_1,s_1)=u^{+}(s'_1)\frac{\sigma\cdot(p_1-p'_1)}{2M}u(s_1)[/itex]
but I can't get the 10.51, please give me an idea or suggestion, or any information, thank you!
 
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  • #2
The basic idea is to take the non relativistic limit of the matrix element Mfi,the Fourier transform of the corresponding matrix element will give you the potential.you also have to write the four component spinor u in terms of two component spinor like ( x11.p/2m)x1)
 
  • #3
andrien said:
The basic idea is to take the non relativistic limit of the matrix element Mfi,the Fourier transform of the corresponding matrix element will give you the potential.you also have to write the four component spinor u in terms of two component spinors like ( x11.p/2m)x1)

Thank you for your advice. Actually, I know the exponential term (Yukawa potential [itex]\frac{e^{-\mu r}}{r}[/itex]) come from the Fourier transform of the propagator [itex]\frac{1}{(p'_1-p_1)^2-\mu^2}[/itex]. But I can understand how to get the term [itex](\sigma_1\cdot\nabla_1)(\sigma_2\cdot\nabla_1)[/itex]. I know there are two methods to transform the relativistic potential to non-relativistic one.
One is Foldy-Wouthuysen transform which need the complete Hamilton in Chapter 4, the other is 'big-small' components nonrelativistic limit in Chapter 1. I try to use the latter one to simplify the 10.51 and get the matrix element Mfi
[itex][\chi^+_1\bar{u}(p'_1)i\gamma^5\tau u_1(p_1)\chi_1]\frac{i}{(p'_1-p_1)^2-\mu^2}\cdot[\chi^+_2\bar{u}(p'_2)i\gamma^5\tau u_1(p_2)\chi_2][/itex]
=[itex](\tau_1\cdot\tau_2)\chi^+_1 \frac{\sigma_1\cdot(p_1-p'_1)}{2m}\chi_1
\chi^+_2 \frac{\sigma_2\cdot(p_2-p'_2)}{2m}\chi_2\frac{-1}{(p'_1-p_1)^2-\mu^2}[/itex]
Before Fourier transform, how to deal with the [itex]\chi[/itex]
 
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  • #4
Yes,this is what I have said you to do.Those [itex]\chi [/itex] are not problem because they are spinors like (1 0) or (0 1),so you can forget them for the moment.you have to Fourier transform
[itex](\tau_1\cdot\tau_2) \frac{\sigma_1\cdot(p_1-p'_1)}{2m} \frac{\sigma_2\cdot(p_2-p'_2)}{2m}\frac{-1}{(p'_1-p_1)^2-\mu^2}[/itex]
 
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  • #5
andrien said:
Yes,this is what I have said you to do.Those [itex]\chi [/itex] are not problem because they are spinors like (1 0) or (0 1),so you can forget them for the moment.you have to Fourier transform
[itex](\tau_1\cdot\tau_2) \frac{\sigma_1\cdot(p_1-p'_1)}{2m} \frac{\sigma_2\cdot(p_2-p'_2)}{2m}\frac{-1}{(p'_1-p_1)^2-\mu^2}[/itex]

if we define the [itex]\vec{p}'_1-\vec{p}_1[/itex]=[itex]\vec{p}[/itex]and [itex]\vec{r}_1-\vec{r}_2[/itex]=[itex]\vec{r}[/itex]
then
[itex]\int^{\infty}_{-\infty}d^3p\frac{1}{\vec{p}^2+\mu^2}e^{-i\vec{p}\cdot\vec{r}}[/itex]
=[itex]\int^{2\pi}_{0}d\phi\int^{1}_{-1}dcos\theta\int^{\infty}_{0}dp\frac{p^2}{p^2+\mu^2}e^{-ipcos\vartheta r}[/itex]
=4[itex]\pi^2\frac{e^{-\mu r}}{r}[/itex]
so,
[itex]\sigma_1\cdot(p_1-p'_1)[/itex]and[itex]\sigma_2\cdot(p_2-p'_2)[/itex] don't involved in integration, instead of being the operator [itex]p=-i\hbar \nabla[/itex]. Although, the [itex]p_2-p'_2[/itex] is replaced by [itex]p_1-p'_1[/itex] for the delta funtion. But the formula of the integrate should be
[itex](\tau_1\cdot\tau_2) \sigma_1\cdot(\nabla_1-\nabla'_1) \sigma_2\cdot(\nabla_1-\nabla'_1) \frac{e^{-\mu|r_1-r_2|}}{|r_1-r_2|}[/itex]
 
  • #6
Hey,sorry for being late but the point is that you have to take the conservation principle also into account from p1+p2=p1'+p2' which gives p1-p1'=p2'-p2=q say,when you put it into your expression it only depends on q,now you have to just take the Fourier transform with respect to q and the answer falls in it place.
 

1. How are Feynman diagrams used to calculate potential?

Feynman diagrams are graphical representations of the interactions between particles in a quantum field theory. By analyzing the diagrams, physicists can determine the probability of different particle interactions and use this information to calculate the potential energy between particles.

2. What is the significance of the arrows in Feynman diagrams?

The arrows in Feynman diagrams represent the direction of time in which the particles are interacting. Time in Feynman diagrams flows from left to right, with the initial state on the left and the final state on the right.

3. How do virtual particles contribute to the potential between particles?

Virtual particles, which are particles that do not exist in reality but are temporarily created and then annihilated, contribute to the potential between particles by mediating their interactions. These virtual particles exchange energy and momentum between the interacting particles, leading to the potential energy between them.

4. Can Feynman diagrams be used to calculate potentials in all types of interactions?

Yes, Feynman diagrams can be used to calculate potentials in all types of interactions, including electromagnetic, weak, and strong interactions. However, the complexity of the diagrams may vary depending on the type of interaction.

5. How accurate are potential calculations using Feynman diagrams?

Feynman diagrams provide a very accurate way to calculate potentials between particles. However, they are based on quantum field theory and do not take into account the effects of gravity, which is described by general relativity. Therefore, for interactions involving gravity, the potential calculations may not be as accurate.

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