Is my country's biology low standard?

In summary, the conversation discusses the varying science education standards among different countries, as seen through the TIMSS data from 2003. The conversation also touches upon the role of factors such as national IQ, teaching methods, and social influences on academic achievement. Additionally, the conversation raises questions about the correlation between market economy and educational success.
  • #1
Mafer
15
0
Well, I am in secondary school. But now, I am just learning about bones, vertebrae, and all that, is that slow? Where can I get more information?
 
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  • #2
Well it depends what you're actually learning (people at university learn about bones, and so do people at nursery). I suppose it also depends at what age you start secondary school, and by what you're comparing your country to.
 
  • #3
In addition to what brewnog mentioned, it also would depend on what else you've been learning about. One topic out of a biology curriculum isn't going to say much about what you'll be learning overall. There's quite a bit of flexibility about what order things are taught in biology, so you can't always compare what you're class is covering to what someone else is covering until you're completely done with the class.
 
  • #4
TIMMS data, 2003

Mafer said:
Is my country's biology low standard?
Your nation's 2003 TIMSS science attainment score might tell you something. Is your nation listed here?:
http://nces.ed.gov/timss/TIMSS03Tables.asp?figure=6&Quest=3


  • Singapore 578
    Chinese Taipei 571
    South Korea 558
    Hong Kong 556
    Estonia 552
    Japan 552
    Hungary 543
    Netherlands 536
    United States 527
    Australia 527
    Sweden 524
    Slovenia 520
    New Zealand 520
    Lithuania 519
    Slovak Republic 517
    Belgium (Flemish) 516
    Russian Federation 514
    Latvia 512
    Scotland 512
    Malaysia 510
    Norway 494
    Italy 491
    Israel 488
    Bulgaria 479
    Jordan 475

    Average Score 473

    Moldova 472
    Romania 470
    Serbia 468
    Armenia 461
    Iran 453
    Macedonia 449
    Cyprus 441
    Bahrain 438
    Palestinian Authority 435
    Egypt 421
    Indonesia 420
    Chile 413
    Tunisia 404
    Saudi Arabia 398
    Morocco 396
    Lebanon 393
    Philippines 377
    Botswana 365
    Ghana 255
    South Africa 244
 
  • #5
That's interesting, these countries have better scores than the US?

Singapore 578
Chinese Taipei 571
South Korea 558
Hong Kong 556
Estonia 552
Japan 552
Hungary 543
Netherlands 536
 
  • #6
All of those I can believe, Hungary is a surprise though...
 
  • #7
Monique, all of those countries have higher British-relative national IQs than does the U.S. (except possibly Estonia which I don't have IQ data for):
http://www.childrenofmillennium.org/science.htm


  • Singapore 103
  • Chinese Taipei 100
  • South Korea 106
  • Hong Kong 107
  • Estonia ?
  • Japan 105
  • Hungary 99
  • Netherlands 102
  • United States 98
 
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  • #8
brewnog said:
All of those I can believe, Hungary is a surprise though...

Are you kidding? von Neumann, Erdos, many others?...
 
  • #9
hitssquad said:
Monique, all of those countries have higher British-relative national IQs than does the U.S. (except possibly Estonia which I don't have IQ data for):
http://www.childrenofmillennium.org/science.htm


  • Singapore 103
  • Chinese Taipei 100
  • South Korea 106
  • Hong Kong 107
  • Estonia ?
  • Japan 105
  • Hungary 99
  • Netherlands 102
  • United States 98

Among children in Estonia, it's 99 for 7-11 year olds and 100.2 for 12-18 year olds. Sources: 1
and 2 .

- Kamataat
 
  • #10
selfAdjoint said:
Are you kidding? von Neumann, Erdos, many others?...


What, a couple of dead mathematicians are supposed to influence a country's teaching ability?
 
  • #11
Since Hungary only recently adopted a market economy, selfAdjoint, and its per-cap GDP-PPP http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/geos/hu.html#Econ, the high science-educational attainment being achieved by its 8th-graders might indeed reasonably be considered surprising.
 
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  • #12
Hungarian mathematical brilliance

brewnog said:
What, a couple of dead mathematicians are supposed to influence a country's teaching ability?

They came from Hungary, and many others with them. When this clutch of Hungarian geniuses (not including Erdos) landed in the US during WWII, they were called "The Martians" because they were so eerily special. Now, these folks were all Jewish, so the Jewish Hungarian community is where to look, but during the 20th century before the nazis, there was considerable intermarriage as the smarter Jews moved out of their rural shtels and into the cities.

hitssquad said:
Since Hungary only recently adopted a market economy, selfAdjoint, and its per-cap GDP-PPP is only $13,900, the high science-educational attainment being achieved by its 8th-graders might indeed reasonably be considered surprising.

The notion that student brilliance and achievement is a function of market capitalism is just ludicrous, when you look at the very statistics hitssquad exhibited. Why isn't the most market-intensive country in the world at the top of the list? When do you stop with special pleading and look at the actual forces in play?
 
  • #13
Kamataat said:
Among children in Estonia, it's 99 for 7-11 year olds and 100.2 for 12-18 year olds. Sources: 1
and 2 .
That's 98 and 100.2. The figure of 99 is the result of an averaging of the later (2003) 98 result and the earlier (2002) 100.2 result ("...and 99 based on the combined results for two studies;" from your first reference).

Anyway, thank you for the data.
 
  • #14
selfAdjoint said:
The notion that student brilliance and achievement is a function of market capitalism is just ludicrous, when you look at the very statistics hitssquad exhibited.
Which of those countries has not adopted a market economy?



selfAdjoint said:
Why isn't the most market-intensive country in the world at the top of the list?
And why doesn't SAT score predict grade-point average among Harvard students? The answer for both is, "That list is the top of the list, and there is more than one factor involved."
 
  • #15
i wonder why is India not on that list...

didnt know Slovenia had citizens with such a high IQ...


thanks for the data... interesting to see how the countries rank..
 
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  • #16
selfAdjoint said:
They came from Hungary, and many others with them. When this clutch of Hungarian geniuses (not including Erdos) landed in the US during WWII, they were called "The Martians" because they were so eerily special. Now, these folks were all Jewish, so the Jewish Hungarian community is where to look, but during the 20th century before the nazis, there was considerable intermarriage as the smarter Jews moved out of their rural shtels and into the cities.

But what's all this got to do with teaching?
 
  • #17
brewnog said:
But what's all this got to do with teaching?

Rolemodels and values, perhaps?

Here in Finland we have this huge IT company, Nokia. Sure, they are pouring money into pure research, but non the less I'd say they also influence socially.
 
  • #18
Joel said:
Rolemodels and values, perhaps?

I'd say they also influence socially.

how...?
 
  • #19
jai6638 said:
how...?

Well, in many ways, for example: by providing sources of aspiration for students, maybe special founds and chairs for researchers, a respect from the general population towards the field and maybe students therefore get more support from their parents, etc. All this may lead to more competition and better average results.
 
  • #20
well, mine is MAlaysia
very low isn't it
 
  • #21
hitssquad said:
Monique, all of those countries have higher British-relative national IQs than does the U.S. (except possibly Estonia which I don't have IQ data for):
http://www.childrenofmillennium.org/science.htm


  • Singapore 103
  • Chinese Taipei 100
  • South Korea 106
  • Hong Kong 107
  • Estonia ?
  • Japan 105
  • Hungary 99
  • Netherlands 102
  • United States 98

The US is behind because:
1. Parents don't care
2. Students dont' care
3. Tenure is stupid (if you are a good teacher, you need not worry about being fired)
4. Dumbing down stuff to make dumb kids feel good about themselves
5. Politics
6. "new" math
and the list goes on.
:mad: :grumpy: :mad: :grumpy: :mad: :grumpy:

while some schools are good, innercity sucks for the most part, and while some parents care about their childerns success, some don't. for example, one classmate of mine received 100 dollars for getting all his grades in the 70% range. If i dropped below 90%, i would not get anything, rather i would be punished. I could on and on.

I kinda got off topic, i didn't even mention bio, and i don't even know what country you are from, but i don't care, because off-topicness is a habit of mine. People take sciences a lot less seriously than they should, i don't understand how my school puts more into reading (the elementry part, i am in high), while most kids know how to read by the 4th or 5th grade, so why can't somethig else take that time? if you can't read well by 5th grade, that is your problim, not everyone elses. besides, the only people who are going to use classes like 'reading' are future reading teachers.

Amazing how i turn a simple question into politics, isn't it

Fibonacci
 
  • #22
I wonder what happened to Canada on that list :frown:
 

1. What factors contribute to a country's low standard of biology?

There are several factors that can contribute to a country's low standard of biology, including inadequate funding for research and education, lack of access to resources and technology, and political and social factors that may hinder scientific progress.

2. How does a country's low standard of biology affect its citizens?

A low standard of biology can have a significant impact on a country's citizens. It can lead to a lack of understanding and awareness about important health and environmental issues, limit opportunities for scientific and medical advancements, and ultimately impact the overall well-being and quality of life for individuals living in that country.

3. Can a country's low standard of biology be improved?

Yes, a country's low standard of biology can be improved through various efforts such as increasing funding for scientific research and education, promoting international collaborations, and addressing social and political barriers that may hinder scientific progress.

4. What can individuals do to support and improve their country's biology standard?

Individuals can support and improve their country's biology standard by staying informed about current scientific developments and issues, advocating for increased funding and resources for scientific research and education, and participating in volunteer opportunities or citizen science projects.

5. How can a country measure its biology standard?

A country's biology standard can be measured through various indicators such as the number of publications and patents in the field of biology, investment in research and development, and the quality of education and training programs in biological sciences. Other factors such as environmental sustainability and public health also contribute to a country's overall biology standard.

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