Crude Prices Skyrocket: $11 Rise in One Day

  • Thread starter Ivan Seeking
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In summary, analysts are predicting that the current trend of gas prices rising 10 cents every day will lead to an $11 dollar rise in one day. If this trend continues, it is predicted that the price of gas will reach $150 by the end of the year.
  • #71
So,
We solve the oil problem once and for all. We will have more than enough here.

We eliminate much of the need for our military to protect the energy supply globally, so, with proper management, this will result in dramatic reductions in spending.

We create an entirely new geopolitical and geoeconomic dynamic where we don't need the ME, or Venezuela, or any of the OPEC members for that matter, for their oil supplies. Nor do we make enemies all over the world.

We have a nearly CO2-neutral energy base. Global warming or not, done.

We create 500 Billion+ dollars worth of new jobs and commerce

We reduce the trade deficit by about 60%

We avoid a complete melt-down of the US economy, which WILL come sooner or later, and likely sooner, if we don't solve the problem.

All opposed?
 
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  • #72
Oh yes, and potentially we avoid an energy war or wars with China and India..maybe worth mentioning.
 
  • #73
Okay and one last point: If we commit to spend as much and as fast on a national project for energy as we have the war in Iraq, the payback time would be about 1 year nationally, so for tax revenues, what, a few years, maybe five?

Hell, I'd borrow money from China for that one!
 
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  • #74
I should have listened to Warren in that "[url[/URL]:

[QUOTE=Om]
I'm hoping to develop the worlds most efficient, practical vehicle of course. (bicycles do not count)

[QUOTE=chroot]
It sure would be cool if people finally realized that bicycles should count, but I guess that's not relevant here.

- Warren
[/QUOTE][/QUOTE]

I think I'll buy a bike tomorrow.
 
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  • #75
Good luck shipping your food by bike. The price and supply of diesel and heating oil, and oil for power production, and for manufacturing, are probably far more signficant than gasoline.

The commercial transportation infrastructure depends primarily on diesel... as do activities like farming, and construction.
 
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  • #76
On the up side, the price of fuel is helping to revive the manufacturing base in the US. Some Chinese-made products cannot compete with domestic production due to the increased shipping costs. One of the benefactors is the US steel industry.
 
  • #77
Ivan Seeking said:
Good luck shipping your food by bike. The price and supply of diesel and heating oil, and oil for power production, and for manufacturing, are probably far more signficant than gasoline.

The commercial transportation infrastructure depends primarily on diesel... as do activities like farming, and construction.

My girlfriend's dad is a farmer in Pennsylvania and he runs his entire operation, including the heating of his house, the year-round heating of soil, running greenhouses, his two trucks that he ships food in, and his personal vehicles, on waste vegetable oil collected for free from the same restaurants he sells food to. The possibility is definitely there for people to ween themselves off of fossil fuels.
 
  • #78
Ivan Seeking said:
Good luck shipping your food by bike. The price and supply of diesel and heating oil, and oil for power production, and for manufacturing, are probably far more signficant than gasoline.

The commercial transportation infrastructure depends primarily on diesel... as do activities like farming, and construction.

I was discussing this with my acquaintance from India the other day. I asked him how his country could feed so many people with so few problems. He stated that India has no large farms like we have in America. Virtually all the cities in India are supplied with food from small farms within 100 km. Almost no one has refrigerators, so they only eat fresh foods.

I told my acquaintance that perhaps India would be a better role model for the world. He just laughed.

Of course this idea is a bit impractical in a lot of places as we've migrated into less and less arable regions, driven by our diesel delivered delectables.

I think I'm going to miss eating cherries from South America.
Even though they look and taste just like the ones from the trees in my yard, there is something exotic about eating something that was grown 6000 miles away.
 
  • #79
I live in an apartment and I still grow everything I possibly can myself, keeping herb and vegetable gardens on my deck in pots and troughs. There's definitely a trend, at least in the places I've lived most recently, toward eating locally grown food.
 
  • #80
loseyourname said:
I live in an apartment and I still grow everything I possibly can myself, keeping herb and vegetable gardens on my deck in pots and troughs. There's definitely a trend, at least in the places I've lived most recently, toward eating locally grown food.

For the second year now, we're buy a subscription to a local CSA - community supported agriculture. We find a local farm and pay them, monthly or for the season, to grow our fruits and veggies. We drop by every week to pick up our load of fresh, local produce.

The one we were in last week grew way, way too many beets for our taste - I'm hoping this one will grow lots of spinach!

There are many web sites about CSA - here's one:

http://www.localharvest.org/csa/
 
  • #81
loseyourname said:
My girlfriend's dad is a farmer in Pennsylvania and he runs his entire operation, including the heating of his house, the year-round heating of soil, running greenhouses, his two trucks that he ships food in, and his personal vehicles, on waste vegetable oil collected for free from the same restaurants he sells food to. The possibility is definitely there for people to ween themselves off of fossil fuels.

McDonalds has a fleet of trucks in Germany running on, can you guess...? McDiesel. Turns out that they use enough oil to run the trucks that supply the restaurants. But they would have to collect the oil and make biodiesel, which is an approved fuel; at least here they would. Raw used or new oil is not a quality or approved fuel. And we don't use enough oil to power the country. But algae appears to be capable of providing the yields required to be practical as a fuel option - all in all at least 20 or 30 times better than corn-ethanol - and clean diesel cars are ready and hitting the markets now. Also, you can make Biodiesel, Ethanol, and Hydrogen from it, so it is the ultimate flex-source, so to speak.
 
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  • #82
lisab said:
For the second year now, we're buy a subscription to a local CSA - community supported agriculture. We find a local farm and pay them, monthly or for the season, to grow our fruits and veggies. We drop by every week to pick up our load of fresh, local produce.

The one we were in last week grew way, way too many beets for our taste - I'm hoping this one will grow lots of spinach!

There are many web sites about CSA - here's one:

http://www.localharvest.org/csa/

Ack! Beets... My mother used to try and force feed us those awful things. They are the only food I can truly claim that I hate. I say we make methanol out of them all. Better yet, send them all to 'Tiger Ethanol' in China. Just the thought of the smell of billions of gallons of fermenting beets makes me want to ^%@$#@$&.

sorry...

Neat idea about the CSA.
Here's a blurb from one within bicycling distance from my house:
Intensive urban agriculture is an idea that has been around for some time but now the idea is growing due to an interest in things like the expanding "local food movement", people's desire to connect with the farmers who grow their food and rising fuel/food costs. Also it's been proven that small, intensively farmed plots are many times more productive than conventional farming methods.

Taking into consideration increasing food prices, increasing fuel prices and the high productivity of small urban plots it just makes sense to grow food where we live.

hmmmm... reminds me of a foreign country someone was just talking about.
 
  • #83
OmCheeto said:
Ack! Beets... My mother used to try and force feed us those awful things. They are the only food I can truly claim that I hate. I say we make methanol out of them all. Better yet, send them all to 'Tiger Ethanol' in China. Just the thought of the smell of billions of gallons of fermenting beets makes me want to ^%@$#@$&.

OmCheeto, we are of one mind on the beet issue! My aunt made me eat them once as a child, and it was the only time in my life I was FORCED to eat anything. They're vile, nasty things, beets!
 
  • #87
I'm bumping this because I really want an opinion on whether or not what KO says is true, that it's mostly the government's fault for the oil prices we have today.
 
  • #88
WarPhalange said:
I'm bumping this because I really want an opinion on whether or not what KO says is true, that it's mostly the government's fault for the oil prices we have today.

The government definitely could have done a better job. KO was dumping on McCain though, and there is plenty of blame to share.
 
  • #89
KO makes it pretty clear that he:

1) Is a liberal.
2) A democrat at that.
3) HATES republicans.
4) Has a man crush on Obama.

So you have to take what he says with some salt. Which is why I'm asking if he's on the money or making things up. I always thought KO was a pretty good journalist, but then again I'm comparing him to O'Reilly, so that's not saying much.
 
  • #90
Oil tumbles $5 as China raises gas prices

Crude prices fall after China says it will raise gas and diesel prices and sentiment spreads about softening demand.

NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- Oil prices sank nearly $5 on Thursday after China said it would raise gas prices by lifting subsidies that have been blamed for driving oil prices higher. The move could curb demand from the country's rapidly growing economy.[continued]
http://money.cnn.com/2008/06/19/markets/oil/?postversion=2008061915
 
  • #91
$140 now
 
  • #92
Ivan Seeking said:
We are approaching peak oil, but no one knows precisely where the line may lie. For now, we are pumping more crude than ever before, so peak oil is not the issue.

Well, that is the definition of peak oil, no?
 
  • #93
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Originally Posted by Ivan Seeking
We are approaching peak oil, but no one knows precisely where the line may lie. For now, we are pumping more crude than ever before, so peak oil is not the issue.


wildman said:
Well, that is the definition of peak oil, no?

NO, pumping more oil than ever is not the definition of peak oil.
 
  • #94
Peak oil means we've gotten over the hill and it is no longer possible to pump more than ever before.
 
  • #95
loseyourname said:
My girlfriend's dad is a farmer in Pennsylvania and he runs his entire operation, including the heating of his house, the year-round heating of soil, running greenhouses, his two trucks that he ships food in, and his personal vehicles, on waste vegetable oil collected for free from the same restaurants he sells food to. The possibility is definitely there for people to ween themselves off of fossil fuels.
Isn't that illegal (EPA)? At least the driving the trucks down public roads part?
 
  • #96
I know I've seen TV programs where they do that or show people who have done it. But I guess that doesn't automatically mean it's legal...
 
  • #97
$147 now.
 
  • #98
WarPhalange said:
I know I've seen TV programs where they do that or show people who have done it. But I guess that doesn't automatically mean it's legal...

It's fully legal... just may void the manufacturers warranty on the vehicle since quite a few of them don't feel it's fully compatible with their fuel systems. A friend of mine hauls arcade machines back and fourth between a 150 mile stretch using an F350 that he converted over to use waste vegetable oil. His only cost is what it takes to refine and filter the oil. He puts about 350 miles on his truck on a daily basis and it only costs him ~$100 a month for fuel.
 
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  • #99
B. Elliott said:
It's fully legal... just may void the manufacturers warranty on the vehicle since quite a few of them don't feel it's fully compatible with their fuel systems. A friend of mine hauls arcade machines back and fourth between a 150 mile stretch using an F350 that he converted over to use waste vegetable oil. His only cost is what it takes to refine and filter the oil. He puts about 350 miles on his truck on a daily basis and it only costs him ~$100 a month for fuel.
Are you sure? A friend of mine at EPA says it is illegal to throw uncertified (i.e. no ASTM approval) fuel in your tank and then hop on the public transportation system:

EPA Registration and Health Effects Testing. All fuels and fuel additives must be registered with the US EPA and be subjected to the health effects regulations contained within 40 CFR Part 79. Companies must register their individual fuel products with the EPA in order to legally market the product to the public. In order to register their fuel, companies must either complete the health effects testing requirements using their specific fuel, or make arrangements with an entity which has completed the testing, in order to use the other entity’s data. The National Biodiesel Board has completed the required health effects testing on behalf of the biodiesel industry, and has established criteria to make the testing data available to companies seeking to register their biodiesel with the EPA. Any fuel that does not meet ASTM D 6751 is not considered biodiesel and therefore does not fall under the NBB testing umbrella. Adoption of D 6751 by the FTA will assist EPA and the biodiesel industry in preventing unregistered fuels from being illegally sold as biodiesel.
http://www.biodiesel.org/resources/definitions/default.shtm

Maybe there is some kind of blanket registration for veg. oil?
 
  • #100
mheslep, the passage you quoted places no restrictions on using fuels which aren't registered, only on marketing/selling them.
 
  • #101
mheslep said:
Are you sure? A friend of mine at EPA says it is illegal to throw uncertified (i.e. no ASTM approval) fuel in your tank and then hop on the public transportation system:http://www.biodiesel.org/resources/definitions/default.shtm

Maybe there is some kind of blanket registration for veg. oil?

As of now there's no restrictions on if you can legally drive with it on the roads, that's legal and fine. Where the technicalities come in is how much you're producing...

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/briefs/excise-duty/brief4307.htm

http://www.vegoilmotoring.com/eng/legal-stuff

Like I said though, it may completely void the warranty on your vehicle.
 
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  • #102
True based on that passage, nor does it give an ok to users. I also see:

...Raw vegetable oil cannot meet biodiesel fuel specifications, it is not registered with the EPA, and it is not a legal motor fuel...
http://www.biodiesel.org/resources/biodiesel_basics/
which is still not completely specific about users vs sellers, but it very well may mean nobody can use it.
 
  • #103
B. Elliott said:
As of now there's no restrictions on if you can legally drive with it on the roads, that's legal and fine. Where the technicalities come in is how much you're producing...

http://www.hmrc.gov.uk/briefs/excise-duty/brief4307.htm

http://www.vegoilmotoring.com/eng/legal-stuff

Like I said though, it may completely void the warranty on your vehicle.
Ah. Both those links address the UK. Looks like the EPA objects in the US to any quantity used or sold for transportation.
 
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  • #104
mheslep said:
Ah. Both those links address the UK. Looks like the EPA objects in the US to any quantity used or sold for transportation.

It comes down to a battle of federal vs. state. By state law here, it's legal. By federal, it's a little less clear, but we have yet to have federal involvement with it, so as of yet it hasn't been of consequence...

http://www.frybrid.com/faq.htm#legality [Broken]

dangit, using wrong links.
 
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  • #105
So: the EPA clearly believes uncertified vehicles and fuels are illegal, but there's some doubt about whether or not the EPA has anything to say about non-commercial products. To be safe, better not cross any state lines in your vege vehicle. :wink:
 
<h2>1. What caused the sudden $11 rise in crude oil prices in one day?</h2><p>There are several factors that can contribute to a sudden increase in crude oil prices, including supply and demand, geopolitical events, and market speculation. In this particular case, the rise in prices may have been caused by a combination of factors, such as disruptions in oil production, changes in global demand, and tensions in the Middle East.</p><h2>2. How will the increase in crude oil prices affect the economy?</h2><p>The impact of rising crude oil prices on the economy can vary depending on the specific circumstances. Generally, an increase in prices can lead to higher costs for businesses and consumers, which can result in inflation and a decrease in consumer spending. However, it can also benefit oil-producing countries and companies, leading to economic growth and increased profits.</p><h2>3. Will the rise in crude oil prices continue or is it just a temporary spike?</h2><p>It is difficult to predict the future of crude oil prices, as they are influenced by numerous factors. While some experts believe that the rise in prices may be temporary, others suggest that it could be a long-term trend. It is important to closely monitor market trends and events to better understand the potential trajectory of crude oil prices.</p><h2>4. How do crude oil prices impact the environment?</h2><p>Crude oil prices can have a significant impact on the environment, as they can influence the production and consumption of fossil fuels. Higher prices can incentivize the development of alternative energy sources and technologies, while lower prices can make it more difficult for these alternatives to compete. Additionally, the extraction and use of crude oil can also have negative environmental effects.</p><h2>5. What can be done to stabilize crude oil prices?</h2><p>There is no easy solution to stabilizing crude oil prices, as they are affected by a complex mix of economic, political, and environmental factors. Some suggest increasing domestic production or investing in renewable energy sources to reduce reliance on oil. Others propose implementing policies to regulate market speculation and address supply and demand imbalances. Ultimately, a combination of approaches may be necessary to achieve more stable crude oil prices.</p>

1. What caused the sudden $11 rise in crude oil prices in one day?

There are several factors that can contribute to a sudden increase in crude oil prices, including supply and demand, geopolitical events, and market speculation. In this particular case, the rise in prices may have been caused by a combination of factors, such as disruptions in oil production, changes in global demand, and tensions in the Middle East.

2. How will the increase in crude oil prices affect the economy?

The impact of rising crude oil prices on the economy can vary depending on the specific circumstances. Generally, an increase in prices can lead to higher costs for businesses and consumers, which can result in inflation and a decrease in consumer spending. However, it can also benefit oil-producing countries and companies, leading to economic growth and increased profits.

3. Will the rise in crude oil prices continue or is it just a temporary spike?

It is difficult to predict the future of crude oil prices, as they are influenced by numerous factors. While some experts believe that the rise in prices may be temporary, others suggest that it could be a long-term trend. It is important to closely monitor market trends and events to better understand the potential trajectory of crude oil prices.

4. How do crude oil prices impact the environment?

Crude oil prices can have a significant impact on the environment, as they can influence the production and consumption of fossil fuels. Higher prices can incentivize the development of alternative energy sources and technologies, while lower prices can make it more difficult for these alternatives to compete. Additionally, the extraction and use of crude oil can also have negative environmental effects.

5. What can be done to stabilize crude oil prices?

There is no easy solution to stabilizing crude oil prices, as they are affected by a complex mix of economic, political, and environmental factors. Some suggest increasing domestic production or investing in renewable energy sources to reduce reliance on oil. Others propose implementing policies to regulate market speculation and address supply and demand imbalances. Ultimately, a combination of approaches may be necessary to achieve more stable crude oil prices.

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