NEED HELP How to cool air as much as possible

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In summary: It seems like a lot of work, and a lot of energy spent to get more air into the engine. However, on a hot day, the idea of pumping some of my AC's freon through the intercooler and then to the engine is appealing! In summary, the conversation discusses ways to cool air for a car's ram air induction system to increase power. Some suggestions include using thermal mat insulation, forced induction, and active refrigeration. However, these methods may not be practical or cost-effective. Other suggestions include using a centrifuge effect to separate oxygen and nitrogen, as well as using a semi-permeable membrane to increase oxygen content. These methods may also be impractical due to the high flow rate needed for
  • #1
ramair2001
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NEED HELP! How to cool air as much as possible

Hello everybody, I have signed up to this site because I have a couple of questions I would like to get help on and I need people (yall) that have a better understanding of physics to help me out with a project... I am a car enthusiast and have designed a ram air induction system for a 1999-2004 mustang GT, THis wrks really good, but the colder the air you get, the more power you can create because of the density and oxegen content. THe air is forced in by the scoop on top of the car, it then taveks into a tube about 1/4 the size of the scoop down the hod into the Air box where a k&N filter is sitting. From what I understand air travels faster around curves than in a straight path. Can some one tell me a way to cool the air more efficently to produce a maximum amount of power... I need to do this in any way possible , but without the use of a refrigerant... I am trying to keep it cjeap and uncomplicated. Can anyone please help me in any way, I would really appreciate it ! I will help you in any way tha I can if at all possible in return. THanks a bunch and I hope to hear from you soon.
 
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  • #2
A lot of people insulate their cold-air intakes with thermal mat. Some people also cover the top of their radiators with themal matt in an effort to keep the engine bay temperatures down.

A cold-air intake is really not going to gain you much -- maybe 10 hp on a decent engine. There's obviously no way to cool air down below ambient temperature without some kind of active refrigeration.

If you really need more power, just go to foced induction.

- Warren
 
  • #3
Forced induction has always been the way that people want to go but it costs between 2 and 7 thousand, depending on how bad you want it to be... I was just hoping there would be a way, or a simple solution to cool the air traveling form the scoop to the air Box.. That is why I am using this site, because you can do a lot with physics if you know enough about it.. Thanks for the reply though!

-john
 
  • #4
Besides, even if you go to some active cooling system, I doubt you'll net additional hp. The energy invested in cooling the air charge is probably not going to result in an equal or greater production of power. The temperature of the air is just not that important, unless of course you're running really lean and are approaching detonation conditions.

- Warren
 
  • #5
Let me preface this by saying I seriously doubt my proposal will be practical. It would probably be counterproductive, because the power gained would not outweigh the extra drag or weight added.

Is there a way to use a centrifuge effect to preferentially channel oxygen to the combustion rather than nitrogen. Air is roughly 20% oxygen, 80% nitrogen. If you could skew that a little more toward oxygen, maybe your engine would be more efficient.

After the air is scooped, send it through a spiral tube at high velocity. The nitrogen would preferentially be forced to the inner curve, while the heavier oxygen would be forced to the outer curve. siphon off some portion of the nitrogen rich air and expel it for cooling. Channel the cooled, oxygen rich air to the mixture for combustion.

Njorl
 
  • #6
A better (though still extremely impractical) solution for increasing oxygen content might be to use a semi-permeable membrane like those used in some scuba diving shops to prepare nitrox (a breathing gas composed of nitrogen and oxygen, but with a larger fraction of oxygen than air).

http://www.dnax.com/dnax.html [Broken]

The reason it's not practical, is, of course, that engines need huge flow rates (100 cfm or more).

As I've said, the only really practical ways to get more O2 into an engine are forced induction and the addition of nitrous oxide or other oxidizer.

- Warren
 
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  • #7
On second thought, it seems the people who make the nitrox membranes claim to be able to build systems up to 300 cubic feet per minute. I wonder how big THAT bed would be.

- Warren
 
  • #8
Originally posted by Njorl
Is there a way to use a centrifuge effect to preferentially channel oxygen to the combustion rather than nitrogen. Air is roughly 20% oxygen, 80% nitrogen. If you could skew that a little more toward oxygen, maybe your engine would be more efficient.

After the air is scooped, send it through a spiral tube at high velocity. The nitrogen would preferentially be forced to the inner curve, while the heavier oxygen would be forced to the outer curve. siphon off some portion of the nitrogen rich air and expel it for cooling. Channel the cooled, oxygen rich air to the mixture for combustion.
Ingenious! Centrifuge would be effectively forced induction though and not cheap. But, driven from belt, I wonder if it could actually be even comparable to turbo.
 
  • #9
Combine chroot's suggestion and Njorl's. Once the air is sent through the centifuge and the excess skimmed off, send the reduced volume of air through the semi-permeable membrane and then to the engine.
 

1. How does air cooling work?

Air cooling works by using a refrigerant to absorb heat from the air and transfer it to outside of the cooling system. The refrigerant is compressed and then expanded, causing it to change from a liquid to a gas and absorb heat in the process.

2. What factors affect the cooling of air?

The temperature and humidity of the air, the design and size of the cooling system, and the air flow rate all affect the cooling of air. Additionally, the type and condition of the refrigerant being used can also impact the cooling efficiency.

3. How can I increase the cooling capacity of my air conditioning system?

There are a few ways to increase the cooling capacity of an air conditioning system. You can upgrade to a more efficient and powerful system, improve the insulation of your home or building, or use a dehumidifier to reduce the amount of moisture in the air, making it easier to cool.

4. What is the most efficient way to cool air?

The most efficient way to cool air is by using a modern, energy-efficient air conditioning system. It is also important to properly maintain and clean the system, as well as control the temperature and humidity levels in the space being cooled.

5. Can I use natural methods to cool air?

Yes, there are a few natural methods that can help cool air. For example, opening windows and doors to allow for cross ventilation, using fans to circulate air, and planting trees or installing shade structures to block direct sunlight can all help to lower the temperature of the air without using electricity.

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