Can Gravity Be Explained as a Composite of Electromagnetic and Strong Forces?

In summary, the conversation discussed the possibility of gravity being a composite of the electromagnetic force and other fundamental forces, and whether the Higgs boson is necessary for a complete unified field theory. It was mentioned that this idea has been ruled out due to the differences between gravity and the other forces, and that the Higgs boson has already been discovered. It was also mentioned that there are alternative theories that break electroweak symmetry without the need for a scalar boson.
  • #1
MiloOfCroton
5
0
I've been looking for work on this, and I was hoping someone could confirm or deny that anyone has done any before. I am referring to gravity being a composite of the electromagnetic (or maybe electro-magnetic-strong-weak) force between many different pieces of matter with a mostly nullified net electrical charge (a lack of a very strong net N/S pole). All I could find was composite gravity work being done on how gravitons could be put together. Maybe gravitons don't carry any kind of gravity force at all?

To put it another way, does anyone think they will never find the Higgs Boson, but the Standard Model will still be complete (as a unified field theory) without it? In other words, mass is an emergent phenomenon rather than a fundamental one.

I'm not trying to imply that this is my theory. I'm simply looking for past work where this has been studied before. If this is still against the rules of the forum (and how could it be?), I'll self-police and delete it (no need to ban me).
 
Last edited:
Physics news on Phys.org
  • #2
MiloOfCroton said:
I've been looking for work on this, and I was hoping someone could confirm or deny that anyone has done any before. I am referring to gravity being a composite of the electromagnetic (or maybe electro-magnetic-strong-weak) force between many different pieces of matter with a mostly nullified net electrical charge (a lack of a very strong net N/S pole). All I could find was composite gravity work being done on how gravitons could be put together. Maybe gravitons don't carry any kind of gravity force at all?

I don't really see what you are getting at, but Einstein worked long and hard to combine gravitation and electromagnetism with no luck. He was clearly trying to make a classical theory of both though. I don't know particulars about work within QM

To put it another way, does anyone think they will never find the Higgs Boson, but the Standard Model will still be complete (as a unified field theory) without it?

Wiki
 
  • #3
1) It would be very difficult if not impossible to rephrase gravity as a sum of electroweak and strong effects. We know enough about gravity to rule this out as a realistic possibility (i.e. even if it was possible it would require an insane amount of fine-tuning to get G out of the other force constants). The weak force can immediately be ruled out as its a massive field. Likewise, gluons are strongly charged so they can be ruled out. So all that's really left is the E&M field, and while it may resemble gravity in some situations it is fundamentally different (vector vs. tensor, charge vs. mass, etc).

2) The Higgs boson has nothing to do with gravity, and it has already been found at the LHC! There are theories beyond the standard model that break electroweak symmetry through dynamic means rather than by introducing a new field (notably technicolor). However since these theories don't predict a scalar boson that acts like the SM Higgs, they are all in trouble now.

*edit* Kaluza-Klein theory is a 5-dimensional formulation of GR which I honestly don't know enough about. However I have heard it claimed that it nicely unifies E&M and gravity classically (I've also heard its not very nice and requires some unjustified additions).
 

1. What is composite gravity?

Composite gravity is a theory in physics that suggests that the gravitational force is not a fundamental force, but rather an emergent force that arises from the collective behavior of smaller particles. It proposes that gravity is a composite of other fundamental forces such as the strong and weak nuclear forces.

2. How does composite gravity differ from classical gravity?

Unlike classical gravity, which is explained by the theory of general relativity, composite gravity does not involve the curvature of spacetime. Instead, it is based on the idea that gravity is a result of the interactions between subatomic particles.

3. What evidence supports the concept of composite gravity?

One of the main pieces of evidence for composite gravity comes from studies of dark matter and dark energy. These phenomena cannot be explained by classical gravity, but composite gravity offers a potential explanation for their effects. Additionally, observations of galaxy clusters have shown that the gravitational pull between galaxies is stronger than predicted by classical gravity, which supports the idea of composite gravity.

4. Are there any experiments being conducted to test composite gravity?

Yes, there are ongoing experiments and research efforts to test the concept of composite gravity. One example is the LHCb experiment at CERN, which is studying the behavior of subatomic particles to look for evidence of composite gravity. Other experiments involve studying the properties of dark matter and the movement of galaxies to further investigate the effects of composite gravity.

5. How could the acceptance of composite gravity impact our understanding of the universe?

If composite gravity is proven to be a valid theory, it would greatly impact our understanding of the universe and the fundamental forces that govern it. It could potentially lead to a unified theory that combines all the fundamental forces, including gravity. It could also change our understanding of the origins of the universe and the role of gravity in its evolution.

Similar threads

B What’s the necessity of the strong force?
    • Quantum Physics
Replies
2
Views
736
I irrationally dislike composites (Rant)
    • Materials and Chemical Engineering
Replies
21
Views
1K
I How Do Quantum Field Theory and Quantum Loop Gravity Explain the Quantum World?
    • Quantum Physics
Replies
1
Views
832
I Understanding Spin-2 Bosons & Graviton Theory of Gravity
    • Quantum Physics
Replies
31
Views
4K
I Why is anyone looking for a graviton/force mediator if it's so widely accepted that that gravity is not a force, but physical curvature?
    • Beyond the Standard Models
Replies
4
Views
381
Is Gravity a Force or a Deformation of Space?
    • Quantum Physics
Replies
22
Views
2K
A Higgs inflation and quadratic gravity
    • Beyond the Standard Models
Replies
1
Views
150
Higgs vs Graviton: Causes of Mass & Gravity
    • Quantum Physics
Replies
1
Views
2K
I A proposed experiment to test quantum gravity
    • Quantum Physics
Replies
12
Views
3K
Strong interaction and unified field theory
    • Quantum Physics
Replies
1
Views
1K

Hot Threads

Recent Insights

Back
Top