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Lapidus
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Repeatedly I heard the words "American Exceptionalism" from Republicans recently (Gingrich, Limbaugh, others). What do these words stand for? Do the "liberals" and President Obama do not believe in it?
http://open.salon.com/blog/sean_day..._conservatives_love_america_in_different_waysTrueCynic said:Liberals love their country the way that an adult loves something. While their love is honestly unconditional, they are willing to tell the person that they love when they are doing something wrong. When conditions are negative, they react by working to make a change and help the situation become better. They give support that is based on the nature of the relationship rather than on the particular environment of the moment. This is the way that an adult reacts within a relationship of love. Honest disagreement is evidence that they actually love the person/country; not that they hate it. They want the country to be better than it currently is, to live up to its potential. Hate is demonstrated by apathy within a relationship more so than it is action. True patriotism is striving to force the country to maintain its principles and become the best it can. If Liberals truly hated this country they would be indifferent to it and see to create society under a different organizing principle.
Conservatives love their country the way that a small child loves its parents. The relationship is based on what is going on that moment only. On one hand they see no wrong in what their parents do. A small child isn't able to decide to love a parent more or less based on the character of that parent. Children love their parents even if they beat them, molest them, or abandon them. This is the same as Conservatives. They define patriotism as blind adherence to authority and never allowing in the possibility that anything the country has ever done is wrong. They define dissent and disagreement as hating one's country and not being patriotic. Unlike Liberals they are quick to move their allegiances away from the country and into those small outlets of political agreement that serve as the basis of their identity.
I believe in American exceptionalism, just as I suspect that the Brits believe in British exceptionalism and the Greeks believe in Greek exceptionalism.
Galteeth said:American exceptionalism (by the way, physicsforums doesn't recognize "exceptionalism" as a word) is the belief that America and it's traditions of government are historically unique. I.E., the American "empire" will not go the way of other empires because it is, in some sense, categorically different.
I think the first sentence from the above referenced wiki article better answers the OP's question:
"American exceptionalism refers to the theory that the United States is qualitatively different from other countries. In this view, America's exceptionalism stems from its emergence from a revolution, becoming "the first new nation,"[1] and developing a uniquely American ideology, based on liberty, egalitarianism, individualism, populism and laissez-faire. This observation can be traced to Alexis de Tocqueville, the first writer to describe the United States as "exceptional" in 1831 and 1840.[2] Historian Gordon Wood has argued, "Our beliefs in liberty, equality, constitutionalism, and the well-being of ordinary people came out of the Revolutionary era. So too did our idea that we Americans are a special people with a special destiny to lead the world toward liberty and democracy."
russ_watters said:The fact that we're the richest in the world can explain that and it doesn't, as far as I can tell, have anything to do with the concept of exceptionalism.
jduster said:America is exceptional in its amount of high school dropouts.
WhoWee said:Haven't graduation/equiv rates improved over the past 100 years?
lisab said:When a country is trying to be exceptional, it shouldn't compare itself to how it was 100 years ago. It should compare itself to other countries, in the present.
Many aspects of life have improved all over the world in the last 100 years. Nothing exceptional about that.
WhoWee said:Perhaps we should ask WHY graduation rates are not exceptional? Don't we spend more than everyone else on education K-12? As far as I know attendance is mandatory K-age 16? What is the motivation for anyone to drop out - could it be the attraction of public assistance for some?
...Many foreign-policy experts see the present international order as the inevitable result of human progress, a combination of advancing science and technology, an increasingly global economy, strengthening international institutions, evolving "norms" of international behavior and the gradual but inevitable triumph of liberal democracy over other forms of government—forces of change that transcend the actions of men and nations.
Americans certainly like to believe that our preferred order survives because it is right and just—not only for us but for everyone. We assume that the triumph of democracy is the triumph of a better idea, and the victory of market capitalism is the victory of a better system, and that both are irreversible. That is why Francis Fukuyama's thesis about "the end of history" was so attractive at the end of the Cold War and retains its appeal even now, after it has been discredited by events. The idea of inevitable evolution means that there is no requirement to impose a decent order. It will merely happen.
But international order is not an evolution; it is an imposition. It is the domination of one vision over others—in America's case, the domination of free-market and democratic principles, together with an international system that supports them. The present order will last only as long as those who favor it and benefit from it retain the will and capacity to defend it.
There was nothing inevitable about the world that was created after World War II. No divine providence or unfolding Hegelian dialectic required the triumph of democracy and capitalism, and there is no guarantee that their success will outlast the powerful nations that have fought for them. Democratic progress and liberal economics have been and can be reversed and undone. The ancient democracies of Greece and the republics of Rome and Venice all fell to more powerful forces or through their own failings. The evolving liberal economic order of Europe collapsed in the 1920s and 1930s. The better idea doesn't have to win just because it is a better idea. It requires great powers to champion it.
If and when American power declines, the institutions and norms that American power has supported will decline, too. Or more likely, if history is a guide, they may collapse altogether as we make a transition to another kind of world order, or to disorder. We may discover then that the U.S. was essential to keeping the present world order together and that the alternative to American power was not peace and harmony but chaos and catastrophe—which is what the world looked like right before the American order came into being.
WhoWee said:Perhaps we should ask WHY graduation rates are not exceptional? Don't we spend more than everyone else on education K-12? As far as I know attendance is mandatory K-age 16? What is the motivation for anyone to drop out - could it be the attraction of public assistance for some?
Char. Limit said:As odd as it may be, I was recently in high school, and I don't remember anyone dropping out so that they could get a welfare check.
WhoWee said:That still doesn't answer the question of why they did drop out - did they think they didn't need an education?
Char. Limit said:Of course, there were also the rare few that were expelled, but they're not doing so well.
SixNein said:Back to the OP,
American exceptionalism is probably a result of 12 years of American history and not the most unbiased view of it either.
I'm sure many of you remember reading about how Columbus discovered America and the misnomer of Indians that sticks to this day.
Conquering countries, then rebuilding them and returning the countries to the people of those countries is a pretty exceptional thing for an "empire" to do.Jasongreat said:It is not hard to find examples of American Exeptionalism from 1770- 1850, harder to find from 1850-1930, then harder to find from 1930 on. Now it seems american exceptionalism is that we do what every other county does towards the end of empire, imo, which kind of destroys the exceptionlism part.
Which years are you referring to? Please explain.SixNein said:American exceptionalism is probably a result of 12 years of American history and not the most unbiased view of it either.
Bobbywhy said:The United State and the "coalition of the willing" made war in Iraq for about ten years based on "faulty intelligence" about S. Hussein having Weapons of Mass Destruction".
jambaugh said:As I recall, the war started when S. Hussein invaded his neighbor, literally raping and pillaging Kuwait, poised to invade Saudi Arabia, planning to capture and control a substantial percentage of the world's oil supply.
Your question was pretty much answered in some early posts in this thread, imo. But since the thread has rambled on, as threads will do, here's my two cents:Lapidus said:Repeatedly I heard the words "American Exceptionalism" from Republicans recently (Gingrich, Limbaugh, others). What do these words stand for? Do the "liberals" and President Obama do not believe in it?
russ_watters said:Conquering countries, then rebuilding them and returning the countries to the people of those countries is a pretty exceptional thing for an "empire" to do.
In any case, here's what I believe: I believe that the US is primarily responsible for the unprecedented explosion of peace in the world over the past century or so due to a change in philosophy, specifically with respect to the conduct of war and building of empires in their aftermath. Near as I can tell, the idea of not building an empire with the spoils of war originated with Wilson's 14 points. His ideas led to the UN and to the dissolution of the old empires from the "age of empires" and hence an end to wars between major world powers.
Yes, America's military power allows us to force our will on the rest of the world. But in this context, "our will" is a world free from empires, aggressive wars and tyrants. And for that I think the world owes us at least a debt of gratitude that it was our will imposed on the world instead of the will of, say, the USSR or 1940 Germany or Japan.
ThomasT said:But America is nevertheless clearly exceptional in terms of its wealth, military power, and the social and political freedom and standard of living of its inhabitants ... all taken together.
Ok, then (if you want to be nitpicky ) consider it so defined.Jack21222 said:Wealth: Depends on how you define it. GDP, yes, per capita GDP, no, we're around 7th.
Military Power: No question
Social freedom: Not even close. According to the UN, we rank 13th.
http://articles.chicagotribune.com/...an-freedom-political-human-development-report (Note: this article is outdated, but I cannot find any new data)
Standard of living: Again, we're not number 1 here either. According to the report sited here, we're 13th: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quality-of-life_Index
So, you'll need to define "exceptional" as "among the top 10" for your statement to work.
WhoWee said:IMO - there used to be a saying - "America - love it or leave it" - perhaps we should bring it back?
Lapidus said:Repeatedly I heard the words "American Exceptionalism" from Republicans recently (Gingrich, Limbaugh, others). What do these words stand for? Do the "liberals" and President Obama do not believe in it?
Rush Limbaugh said:RUSH: Really, the founding of this country is a miracle. You and I know it. What is American exceptionalism? Everybody has their own definition. I'll tell you what mine is. The rule for human beings since the creation of time, since the creation of the planet, the normal, standard operating procedure has been tyranny, dungeons, oppression, poverty. The vast majority of the people who have ever lived in the world have been imprisoned or dictated toward, lived under tyranny, been poor. It's been the standard. The exception to that has been the United States. The exception to what life was like for most every human being has been the United States of America. That's one definition of American exceptionalism. It's not that we're better than anybody else. This is what Obama and the Democrats don't like. They think we're saying we're better people. No, no, no, no. We're luckier. We have a country that was founded by brilliant people who understood that we are blessed by God.
(applause)
RUSH: The whole notion of hating the country, I know it exists, I know there are people out there who hate this country, don't like it. Intellectually it doesn't compute, and it saddens me to no end, but I know that they believe that this is a country that has stolen from every other country, that we have raped and pillaged and that we have conquered and that we have murdered and all this. No concept, no understanding, 'cause they're not taught of the wonderful things this country has done for the rest of the world, the standard of living that we brought to ourselves and people around the world. And at some point, you have to say, I'm not going to waste my time trying to persuade 'em anymore. I'm just going to try to see to it that those people remain few in number and can't win elections. Because it really comes down to that.
Er, did you read it? What was so bad about it?ThomasT said:@ Decimator,
Thanks for reminding me why I don't bother to listen to anything that Rush Limbaugh has to say about anything.