Politics and World Affairs...

Blahness

Is it just me, or is that forum there mostly for our community to rag on the world?

Or is it just me? >_>

Moonbear

That's not the intent of the forum, but it seems to be the current pattern of posts. We're working on a clearer set of guidelines for that forum.

Evo

Hi Blahness, as Moonbear mentioned, we are putting together guidelines which will hopefully improve the quality of discussion in P&WA.

If you have any ideas on how to improve the forum, please feel free to pm me. All suggestions will be considered.

Astronuc

I think some people discuss politics like they discuss religion, which leads to heated exchanges.

I think it would be worthwhile trying to elevate discussion of politics as one would discuss a scientific problem - with evidence or facts.

Part of the problem is the mixing of opinions and factual statements, or perhaps it is more a case of opinions are stated as though one is making a factual statement, rather than preface an opinion with something like, IMO, or whatever.

Another problem is the use of allegations, which are often unsubstantiated. People should be encouraged to use statements such as "it is alleged that . . . .", "it seems that . . . ", or it appears that . . . .".

It would be nice if people can simply agree to disagree and still be mutually respectful.

There are many important issues regarding economics, social policy and international relations, which are worthwhile to discuss, but not if the only result is acrimonious bickering.

Ivan Seeking

Yes, let's try an ironical approach.

Astronuc

I guess one problem with respect to politics is getting the evidence or the facts.

And one certainly has to contend with the reliability (or lack thereof) of the media.

Moonbear

These are both problems that make politics a bit different from science topics. But, with regard to your other points, yes, one of the things the new guidelines will very likely address is that when people make a statement of opinion, they make it clear that it is opinion. In other words, opinion in politics is okay, as long as it is not asserted as fact. If someone does assert something as fact, then they should also have the burden of providing evidence to back up that claim.

Pengwuino

And politics is too subjective. There is no real right or wrong unless you're one of these people who think their views on life are the only right way of looking at things and any opposing viewpoint is evil.... which means you're wrong by default even if you're right . It's tough to compare with things like physics or math because you can't have someone say "E=mc^2" while someone else says "no no, E=mc^3" since theres a set proof of how science works. How could you really scientifically approach things like a certain congressmen's immigration policies? In the end, you will run into subjective roadblocks where it completely comes down to a persons core beliefs in life which you can't really say "no, that's wrong" to.

russ_watters

While that's true, there are objective facts involved in supporting arguments.

Lisa!

That's exactly why I think discussing politics shoud be banned in this forum! (I've almost banned myself from these discussions. )
Anyway I think the main problem is that some people couldn't be objective. Anyone who read some of posts in that forum, could see how some people 's positions is inconsistent in different discussions!

Pengwuino

One thing that really really confuses me are the people who are in P&WA who have at least 95% (and often 100%) of their posts in P&WA. How did they find this forum? Do they just go around the internet looking for forums to argue on? The whole P&WA thing was a side-affair for me when Evo kidnapped me and tossed me into this god forsaken place.

I mean... loving community full of devoted members :P

Lisa!

I guess they're invited by their friends to this forum. If it would be true, that explains why most of people in P&WA are liberal!
On the other hand, they might come to this forum because of other sciences but unfortunately they've got stuck in P&WA.

matthyaouw

You mean that's not what political discussion is?

El Hombre Invisible

The trouble with P&WA is that the most emotive topics will be discussed more often, simply because they are more emotive.

The one thing that seems to make P&WA descend into mayhem more often than not is certain members making ill-advised generalisations that others will find offensive, usually about republicans, democrats, liberals, conservatives, Americans, French and theists. Actually, scratch that - no-one complains about French-bashing. But saying things like "That's stupid liberals for you" is a red rag to a bleeding heart bull.

I think if that could be moderated, a substantial increase in quality would follow. It's just a matter of respect. When one person disses a second's posse, the second will diss the first's posse, then you have gang warfare. (Note to self: do not try and emulate what you think is the common parlance of your audience - you suck at it.)

On the other hand, we should really crack down on f--king limeys coming in here thinking they can tell Americans how to moderate. DON'T THEY KNOW THEY LOST THE WAR OF INDEPENDANCE?!? And they'd all be speaking German if it wasn't for etc.

Pengwuino

Are you trying to start the War of 1812 part II?... which i suppose would also be known as the War of 2005?

El Hombre Invisible

Merely a touch of self-deprecation to remove any air of pomposity that could have been observed in my post, I assure you.

Bystander

Anyone want to invoke a "death penalty" for violations of posting guidelines in P&WA? "The line through the name" includes erasure of all posts --- and, said posts containing many pearls cast before swine and all other manner of gems of wisdom will not be resurrected at the end of three weeks or whatever the banning period happens to be. The idea being that members who want their ideas to be considered will behave while those who wish to "carpet bomb" the forum with rhetoric will be subject to a potentially infinite numer of "executions," and unable to leave permanent marks.