If Intelligent Design is exactly that, what's with all the design flaws?

ComputerGeek

with the multi-verse theory of the universe, if everything that can happen does happen in any number of alternate universes, then our existence is inevitable. no irreducible complexity.

Moonbear

This week, an article in the Vatican newspaper has supported the argument that ID is NOT science. I'm providing links to the story from a variety of sources, though you can search "Intelligent Design and Vatican" and come up with numerous hits that all say the same thing, regardless of the news source you trust most.

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,10117...-13762,00.html
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/19/sc...8F7BDS03.shtml
http://www.catholicnews.com/data/sto...ns/0600273.htm

I think this helps support what the scientists have been saying all along, Intelligent Design belongs in the realm of religion, not science, and even the religious (e.g., the Vatican) recognizes this, with the exception of a very small faction of U.S., fundamentalist, Christian groups.

phcatlantis

All right, a lot relative to the lifespan of a human being.

I'm not talking about those. I'm talking about people so concerned with what happened 6,000 years ago that they feel the need to ridicule others who don't share their beliefs.

6000 years ago is the distant past to me, and I reckon most people not concerned with the scale of time over secular geological and cosmology history.

Nah, I don't think so. At least the creationists have this magnificent God thing to inspire commitment to their beliefs. But for the typical modern layman, I don't see what value they'd find in a debate over something that happened millenia before their language and way of life even existed.

Orefa

Ok. I wouldn't debate anyone on whether their reasons to care are good enough or not. A number of people care, for their own reasons. Your "typical modern layman" may lack such reasons. Meh.

Evo

That's another reason why "young earth" creationists" are to be ignored. They picked that date based on the Bible. It's meaningless.

What does any of this have to do with ID?

Amp1

Question: Is the design of the universe flawed? Is the way chemical reactions happen flawed? Are the natural laws flawed? All of that is considered a part of ID.

How could man have the capacity to learn and experience if they are perfect?

Is there one kind or type of perfection or is there different levels to it?

What could experiential perfection entail?

What is absonite perfection?

Can one imagine absolute perfection?

jimmie

Perhaps, the only "flaw" in the universe was your perception of the universe.

ComputerGeek

Large systems that have a few set of rules can interact in highly organized ways.

I guess Clouds are intelligent or each were specifically designed by an intelligent being because of their highly organized and predictable behavior?

Amp1

There is order in chaos.

Jimmie,
ComputerGeek,
Funny, I didn't say anything about intellect...ComputerGeek. Jimmie, No one perceives the 'entire' universe unless you believe in an infinite personality.

I just asked a few questions that all. The question after the 'if' statement "...whats with all the design flaws" presumes there to be some volitional 'Architect'. But it seems to focus in on only a specific set - the set of elements classified as man. So, I figured I'd ask something like "Is the current expansion of the universe a flaw?". Maybe, it is still expanding so that there will be enough room for an infinite number of beings.

ComputerGeek

If the multi-verse theory is correct, then our existence is inevitable no matter how imporbable.

Amp1

I agree ComputerGeek. It's also fascinating that there could be a universe where Superman is real along with any or all other comic book heros and villains, where realities like those portrayed in books by Koonz, S. King, Terry Pratchett, ect. exist. < brrrrrrrrr > I would want to be alive in a place like the universe of H.P. Lovecraft.

phcatlantis

I don't know. I can see how their version of events is sexier, and it comes complete with a whole bunch of other religious stuff.

I don't see how its any more meaningless to the average joe than ~3 billion.

This is an aside on Orefa's point about how "the past is all we have to understand the present." My point is who cares about the past that far distant besides, well, people who study it? I like clam chowder, I don't expect everybody else to share my taste.