Do scientists know how many electrons an element has?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the question of whether scientists know how many electrons an element has, with a focus on the concept of electron shells in atoms. Participants explore the relationship between electron configuration and atomic properties, touching on foundational concepts in chemistry and quantum mechanics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that the number of electrons in an element is known and can be found on the periodic table.
  • Others explain that electrons arrange themselves into shells due to the Pauli exclusion principle, which states that no two electrons can occupy the same quantum state.
  • One participant emphasizes the importance of electron shells in determining the reactivity and characteristics of atoms, suggesting that much of chemistry is centered on electron behavior.
  • A later reply introduces the concept of bosons and mentions that at low temperatures, bosons can behave differently than fermions, which could lead to confusion regarding electron behavior in certain states.
  • There is a mention of superfluid liquid helium as an example where pairs of electrons can act like bosons.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants generally agree that the number of electrons in an element is known and related to its position on the periodic table. However, there is some disagreement regarding the implications of electron behavior and the nature of electron shells, particularly in relation to quantum mechanics and the behavior of particles at low temperatures.

Contextual Notes

The discussion includes references to complex concepts such as the Schrödinger equation and the Pauli exclusion principle, which may require further clarification for those unfamiliar with quantum mechanics. Additionally, the implications of electron behavior in different states remain unresolved.

Mk
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Do scientists know how many electrons an element has? Can someone explain why I was taught about shells of electrons in atoms?
 
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An element in its nonionized state exist primarily as its most common isotope; that is with a specific number of electrons, protons, and neutrons.

You should review the introductory chapter on atomic orbitals; the history spanning the discovery of an electron up to the development of quantum mechanics should help you to understand the logic of shells and the importance in explaining and unifying molecular phenomenas.

The chapter on "shells" is rather complex and in depth. It pertains to atomic bonding theory, molecular bonding theory, and thus explains the stability/instability, color, structure etc...of molecules and atoms.

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I think this is my first post in the Chemistry Forum!

Originally posted by Mk
Do scientists know how many electrons an element has?

Yes, we know how many electrons each element has. It is stated on the periodic table.

Can someone explain why I was taught about shells of electrons in atoms?

Two electrons, by their nature, cannot be in the exact same quantum state. For that reason, they arrange themselves into shells in an atom. These shells are solutions to the Schrödinger equation (the basic equation of nonrelativistic QM).
 


Originally posted by Mk
Can someone explain why I was taught about shells of electrons in atoms?

The shells of electrons are very very important. Where the electrons are and in what orbit goes along way to determining the reactivity and characterisitics of the atom. Basically all of chemistry in all it's forms is mostly about what the electrons are doing in their orbitals.
 


Originally posted by Tom
Yes, we know how many electrons each element has. It is stated on the periodic table.



Two electrons, by their nature, cannot be in the exact same quantum state. For that reason, they arrange themselves into shells in an atom. These shells are solutions to the Schrödinger equation (the basic equation of nonrelativistic QM).


not quite true, while electrons are Fermions, (Pauli exclusion principle. )

At low temperatures, bosons CAN behave differently than fermions because an unlimited number of them can collect into the same energy state. known as condesation

pairs of electrons on the other hand can act like bosons... (added in the edit)

eg superfluid liquid helium.
 
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