MSNBC poll on impeachment disturbing

turbo

And in the Rather segment, it was pointed out that it is much faster and cheaper to bring in "experts" to shout at each other than to actually do any real reporting, which is why TV "journalism" is nose-diving in quality.

Astronuc

'pundits' rather than "experts".

I believe Moyers's program made the point that the 'experts' who made that case that 'aluminum tubes' were for high speed centrifuges were in fact 'unqualified' to make such an assessment. Typical for the Bush administration.

turbo

That's why I put "experts" in quotes. Those people assume a mantle of authority and simply re-assert the arguments of the people they're shilling for without dissecting the situation and laying out the motivations of the principals. In fact, as you point out, many of them lack the qualifications to speak intelligently on the subjects they are expounding on. The real experts (like Scott Ritter) have to look to Amy Goodman and other progressive journalists to get the time and free rein to do the kind of in-depth analysis that complex situations deserve.

edward

It wasn't just that the reporting was not investigative, it was done by people with no experience in the area and then exploited by the administration.

For instance, the Judith Miller article in the NY Times about the aluminum tubes came about because of a leak from the White House.

Then Cheney appeared on Meet the Press and quoted the Times story as if it was verifying evidence against Iraq.

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/media...es_05-26.html#

denverdoc

Clever bastards aren't they?

Astronuc

Devious perhaps, or maybe deviant?

Ivan Seeking

Really, I don't think they're very clever at all; more like used car salemen or two-bit con men if you ask me. I think too many people simply aren't paying attention - too much watching S Park instead of the News Hour, listening to the likes of Rush instead of NPR, or watching Fox and believing every word from that some guy yelling at them because he slams the liberals in every other sentence. Most people don't want real news. It's too depressing and they feel powerless.

edward

If anyone needs a few minutes, well 33 minutes to be exact, of informative comic relief here is a link to the entire Bill Moyers John Stewart interview.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...+stewart&hl=en

Astronuc

Thanks, edward! That's great!

"Are you ready to bumble?" I agree with Moyers insight. Tens of thousands of words written by journalists and others on the Gonzo testimony, and Stewart distills it in a few words.

Stewart really has the Bush administration pegged. I appreciate his comment about the disconnect between what Bush says and what he does. Bush stated that the US is in 'the fight for its way of life', a monumental battle, yet he sends 10,000 troops to Baghdad out of 30,000 troops in the 'surge', as if that will do it. And Stewart is right about the administration keeping the nation fearful enough to get away with their current mismanagement of the war, but not so fearful that people stop from their everyday routine and start paying attention to what's really going on.

Moyers and Stewart should both get a Medal of Freedom, but that is not likely from the current regime.

siddharth

I agree. That's a wonderful interview. It's very interesting to listen to his views on the current Bush administration. I think he's spot on with his observation on the method by which the administration (mal)functions.

denverdoc

I guess I meant clever(devious/deviant) enough to get the drumbeats for war going at a staccato pace, thinking this would all be over long before now, and they would appear to be great champions for freedom, meanwhile having snagged some sweet oil deals, pad their pockets, etc.

Dumb enough to ignore both sound military advice and the abundant lessons of history.

Ivan Seeking

Sure, the fact is though, they took advantage of a vulnerable public during a time when it counted the most. What is not 100% clear to me is whether this was driven primarily by greed, arrogance, delusions of grandeur, or irrational, faith based decisions.

Astronuc

Try all of the above - greed, arrogance, delusions of grandeur, AND irrational, faith based decisions. All are elements of the Bush administration. Those and a certain amount of depraved indifference.

edward

I will go along with that. It was great to see Moyers back on PBS. I have always believed that he had been pressured to leave in 04 because of his stance against the war and especially after he made the no holds barred statement presented below.

http://www.mediaresearch.org/cyberal...20030421.asp#1

turbo

Moyers has it right. War brings instability and if you are in control during a period of instability, you can make a LOT of money. The people beating the drum for war almost always stand to profit from it. They wave the flag, point to threats, real or imagined, call for patriotism and solidarity, threaten dissidents, and hope they can fool enough of the public (easily done) to get popular support for slaughter.

Mentz114

Silver Fox writes ( my emphasis )-
You mean Cheney, Wolfowitz, and their cohorts ? The puppeteers.

As for criminality, one of the charges at the Nuremburg tribunal was 'waging aggressive war' which is still considered a crime against humanity.

turbo

I have a depressing persistent image of Bush as Mortimer Snerd with the ventriloquist (Cheney) talking out the side of his mouth so the audience thinks the dummy is talking. Those of you who are under 50 may have to Google on Mortimer Snerd.