Relativistic Mass Propulsion or the RMP

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the concept of relativistic mass propulsion (RMP) and the mechanics of using spinning plates for propulsion. Participants explore the implications of mass changes during motion, energy transfer during braking, and alternative propulsion methods such as neutrino and neutron propulsion.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Debate/contested
  • Technical explanation

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that spinning plates would have higher mass when moving down compared to moving up, suggesting this could be utilized for propulsion.
  • Questions arise regarding the mechanisms for spinning up and stopping the plates, with one participant stating they would be spun by an engine and stopped by a brake.
  • One participant argues that applying the brake to the spinning disk would result in heating, which increases the disk's energy and momentum, potentially negating upward movement unless energy is radiated away.
  • Another participant challenges the effectiveness of the proposed braking method, suggesting that it would lead to no net upward movement and proposes that directly generating photons would be more efficient.
  • Some participants express skepticism about the feasibility of neutrino propulsion, citing the weak interaction of neutrinos with matter as a significant limitation.
  • A later reply corrects a mention of neutrino propulsion to neutron propulsion, indicating a potential confusion in terminology.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express multiple competing views regarding the effectiveness of the proposed propulsion methods and the implications of energy transfer during braking. The discussion remains unresolved with no consensus on the viability of the concepts presented.

Contextual Notes

Participants have not fully explored the assumptions underlying their arguments, particularly regarding the interactions of particles like neutrinos and neutrons, and the implications of energy transfer in the proposed propulsion system.

Sariaht
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Plates spinning when they move down and are still when they move up; the plates would have higher mass when moving down then moving up. Should work.
 
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How are the plates spun up? How are they stopped?
 
They are spun up by an engine and stopped by a brake.
 
Sariaht said:
They are spun up by an engine and stopped by a brake.

Okay, then here is what will happen:

As you apply the brake to the spinning disk, both it and the brake will heat up. Since the heating of the disk increases the disk's energy (and thus its momentum) you will only decrease its effective mass by the amount of energy that is transferred to the brake as heat. Thus it will retain a great amount of the momentum it had while spinning while moving up again. Also, the heat energy transferred to the brake will carry the downwards momentum with it and transfer to the ship you are trying to move, and you will get no net movement upwards.

The only way you could get any upward movement would be to radiate the energy away before it is transferred to the ship. But if you do that, your upward movement comes from throwing the energy away in the form of photons, and all you have is an inefficient action-reaction engine. It would better to just directly generate the photons and shoot them out the back like a rocket.
 
No, it would not.
 
Sariaht said:
No, it would not.
Specifics? Or is that the extent of your argument?
 
Perhaps you're right.

Neutrino propulsion then, NP?
 
Sariaht said:
Perhaps you're right.

Neutrino propulsion then, NP?

Highly unlikely. Since neutrinos only interact lightly with whole atoms and molecules, you wouldn't be able to apply the right thrust. After all, they could pass through a bar of lead that leads from Earth to Saturn and the neutrinos would barely effect it. The same goes for gamma rays, when trying to manipulate them for a rocket.

Over and out.
 
Sorry! ment neutron propulsion.
 

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