What is the Science Behind the Placebo Effect and Its Potential?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the science behind the placebo effect, exploring its mechanisms, implications, and potential applications. Participants consider various angles, including psychological, physiological, and anecdotal evidence, while questioning how belief and imagination can influence physical outcomes.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Experimental/applied

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants propose that the placebo effect may be linked to the power of imagination and belief, suggesting that these mental states can produce real physiological changes.
  • Others argue that the placebo effect could be harnessed scientifically, with potential benefits if its mechanisms are fully understood.
  • A participant mentions that certain individuals, like monks, may practice using their internal placebo effect throughout their lives, hinting at a possible method for enhancing its effects.
  • There is a suggestion that professional athletes might utilize similar mental techniques to exceed physical limitations, indicating a connection between belief and performance.
  • Some contributions highlight the importance of empirical study, with calls for scientists to investigate the placebo effect under controlled conditions to uncover its triggers and effects.
  • One participant notes the existence of the nocebo effect, which can produce negative outcomes, suggesting a dual nature to the placebo phenomenon.
  • A personal anecdote is shared about a seminar that taught participants to exceed self-imposed limits, linking this experience to the broader discussion of belief and performance.
  • Another participant reflects on the historical context of breaking the four-minute mile as an example of how mental barriers can be overcome once a limit is perceived as surmountable.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express a range of views on the placebo effect, with some advocating for its scientific study and others sharing personal experiences that suggest its efficacy. There is no consensus on the mechanisms or implications of the placebo effect, and multiple competing perspectives remain throughout the discussion.

Contextual Notes

Limitations in the discussion include a lack of empirical evidence presented for the claims made, as well as varying definitions of the placebo effect and its applications. The discussion also reflects personal beliefs and experiences, which may not be universally applicable.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to those studying psychology, medicine, sports science, or anyone curious about the intersection of belief and physical health outcomes.

Entheos
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I think the placebo effect needs to be scientifically explained. That is we need to find out why, when, where, and how it works. Explain it from every angle.

Perhaps when this is done, that knowledge can be used to harness the effect, and maybe one day perfected into a science of its own...
 
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I don't have a scientific explanation for it but my answer is that the placebo effect is the externally aided form of what imagination can do, what I mean is that when a reputable source tells you that this pill will help you go to sleep then it has that errie effect even though it is a sugar pill, for awhile until the "placebo effect" is realized as a lie, and it wears off, but if you believe in yourself enough and use your imagination enough then all the pills in the world and fancy cars and expensive things can't compare because you can have the effect of things simply by believing in yourself not in what others tell you to believe will make you happy. Another thing is that what would happen if a person were practiced and used their internal "placebo effect" throughout their lifetime?
This is only one angle, I'm having trouble explaining why I think this is how it works but that it makes good sense...the imagination is a lying machine, but even lies can be productive if used productively, the placebo effect is basically a well fabricated lie, yet the effects are there like magic although they wear off as the lie is revealed in time, the more elaborate and well crafted the lie the longer it may take the rational animal to catch up with the lie. The process of using the imagination to lie to oneself for practical purposes and play catch up would be a process of elation and let down, but addictive...buy why do people give up on imagination and themselves for believing in pills and what groups believe? How exactly is it possible that something that does not actually exist in reality can have a real and definite affect on a person, this is bizarre! It suggests that somewhere in the brain is the capacity to reach into areas of thinking that should be impossible such as heart rate or intestinal function, etc.. and manipulate them purely by thought, I can't think of any animal that can do this other than humans.
 
"Another thing is that what would happen if a person were practiced and used their internal "placebo effect" throughout their lifetime?"

There are people like this, they are called monks. Well not all of them, but a lot of them.

Anywho imagine the possibility. Has anyone anywhere ever tried to scientifically explain the placebo effect? Study it under a microscope. Find out exactly what triggers it. There are many potential great benefits to this science, however it could turn out to be little more than nothing, but only a scientific analysis would tell for sure.

So get busy scientists! :)
 
I think great professional atheletes do much of the same thing. But rather than using their will to sleep, or remove pain, they use it to exceed what others consider to be physical limitations. There are players who become better when they need to be. They can't turn it on at will, but when it is needed, they do it.

Njorl
 
I think you're right Njorl.

If these things really do exist there must be physical evidence that we can observe, Once observed we can study it. Once Studied we can turn it into a science. Then science can make the knowledge useful, and perhaps profitable...
 
It *is* being studied! :)
See here
http://www.newscientist.com/news/news.jsp?id=ns99994996

And check out the "Related Stories" links for more

BTW placebos can also have negative effects- the Nocebo Effect ;)

Happy thoughts
Rachel

P.S. It is also an ethically allowed treatment. It is being studied *and* used! :)
 
Last edited:
honestrosewater said:
It *is* being studied! :)
See here
http://www.newscientist.com/news/news.jsp?id=ns99994996

And check out the "Related Stories" links for more

BTW placebos can also have negative effects- the Nocebo Effect ;)

Happy thoughts
Rachel

P.S. It is also an ethically allowed treatment. It is being studied *and* used! :)

hehe, I got to get me some of them placebos! they work on everything!
 
Moonrat said:
hehe, I got to get me some of them placebos! they work on everything!

:smile: never thought of it that way... Moonrat, I'd like to buy your idea...
 
The placebo effect of dopamine for Parkinsons patients is very interesting.

Njorl, I went through a course years ago by Lou Tice of the Pacific Institute that taught how to exceed limits. I was put through it by my company. I am the most skeptical person in the world when it comes to seminars on "anything". I hate those kinds of things. I do not believe in that stuff and have killed off many programs that were being considered by my company (one of the world's largest). His seminar, however, was the most incredible I have ever had the pleasure of attending. His is the ONLY one I did not discredit. It explains how we (knowingly or unknowingly) set limits for ourselves and how to get past them. It was truly amazing, and it is what a lot of the athletes you mentioned use.

I cannot do justice to what he teaches. If any of you are fortunate enough to be able to attend his "Investments in Excellence" seminar, do so, you will not regret it. It is the one thing that I can look back on that actually changed my life and is responsible for my success today personally and financially.
 
  • #10
Evo said:
It explains how we (knowingly or unknowingly) set limits for ourselves and how to get past them. It was truly amazing, and it is what a lot of the athletes you mentioned use.

I believe it. I too am a congenital skeptic. But when I look at things like the four-minute-mile, I can see it. For years, runners got closer and closer to breaking the 4 minute barrier, but they couldn't do it. They just kept getting closer and closer by smaller steps. Then, after Roger Bannister managed to do it, all the best milers started doing it, by large margines.

Two things really impressed me about this. First, that the artificial limit could be so strong, and second, that the runners could actually sense to tenths of a second their proximity to the 4:00 limit. If they were not able to subconciously sense the limit, it could not have held them back!
Njorl
 

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