Air conditioner thermodynamics

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the thermodynamics of air conditioners and heat pumps, specifically addressing the concept of overunity and the energy transfer involved in these systems. Participants explore the mechanics of how air conditioners operate, including the role of compressors and the joule effect.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Conceptual clarification
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant questions the validity of a claim regarding air conditioners as a form of overunity, stating that they move energy rather than create it.
  • Another participant attributes the energy transfer to the electric joule effect, suggesting a connection to the operation of air conditioners.
  • A later reply confirms the initial claim about energy transfer, expressing enthusiasm for the topic and indicating a desire to learn more about the joule effect.
  • Further elaboration describes the mechanics of a heat pump, detailing the process of compressing a working fluid and the subsequent heat exchange that occurs in both indoor and outdoor units.
  • It is noted that the outdoor cooling coils must be larger to accommodate the heat added to the fluid during the compression process.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the concept of overunity in relation to air conditioners, with some affirming the idea while others remain skeptical. The discussion does not reach a consensus on the validity of the initial claim.

Contextual Notes

Participants do not fully explore the implications of the joule effect or the thermodynamic principles at play, leaving some assumptions and definitions unaddressed.

Who May Find This Useful

This discussion may be of interest to individuals exploring thermodynamics, HVAC systems, or the principles of energy transfer in mechanical systems.

n00dle
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Hey, sorry if this is slightly off topic but it's the closest forum i could find that might be able to help me answer my question..

A while back i read a page and a little bit of information on it remained behind in my memory. Basically what it stated was 'the simplest form of overunity is an air conditioner/heat pump. overunity is not achieved here by gaining more energy, but by moving it. For example, if 1 kilowatt of electrical power is placed into the compressor, 2 kilowatts of heat will be transferred from plate to plate, due to thermodynamics."

Can someone confirm if this is true, false, or what's the go?

Thanks in advance
n00dle
 
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This is due the (electric) joule effect.
 
So this is true? Kickass!
Thanks very much, i will look up the 'joule effect' now for more information.
Thanks again :)
 
An http://www.houstonairconditioners.net/air_conditioning_replacements.html" is a heat pump. It uses a compressor to `compress a working fluid (usually freon). This compression (work) causes the fluid to heat up. The fluid is then chilled to just above the outdoors ambient temperature using a large fan and cooling surfaces. All of this is done in the outside of your home.
The compressed fluid is then allowed to expand to ambient pressure. This expansion chills the fluid to a COLD temperature. This cold fluid is next passed across coils and fins on the inside of your home. Air is blown across these coils and fins into your house, chilling the home.
The cycle then starts over again by compressing the fluid as it leaves these coils.
As work is performed on the fluid, more heat (energy) is added than is removed by chilling your home. Thus, the outdoor cooling coils must be sized larger to cool the heated fluid than the ones inside your home.
 
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