Quantum Paradox of a Self-Interference of a Photon in VLBI

Aleksandr Timofeev

<jabberwocky><div class="vbmenu_control"><a href="jabberwocky:;" onClick="newWindow=window.open('','usenetCode','toolbar=no,location=no, scrollbars=yes,resizable=yes,status=no,width=650,height=400'); newWindow.document.write('<HTML><HEAD><TITLE>Usenet ASCII</TITLE></HEAD><BODY topmargin=0 leftmargin=0 BGCOLOR=#F1F1F1><table border=0 width=625><td bgcolor=midnightblue><font color=#F1F1F1>This Usenet message\'s original ASCII form: </font></td></tr><tr><td width=449><br><br><font face=courier><UL><PRE>\n\nI hardly perceive physical sense of the article written\nin the "Nature" by Burke B.F.:\n\nBurke B.F., Quantum Interference Paradox, Nature, 223, 389-390, 1969.\n\n-------------------------------------------------------------\nThere is no direct physical process of addition "of waves / photons"\npassing through "slots or telescopes" in VLBI!\n-------------------------------------------------------------\n\nThe interference fringes (picture) in VLBI (interferometer) is pure\nmathematical abstraction, since the construction of an interference\npattern is carried out in the computer.\n\nDear colleagues physicists!\n\nWhether you can describe / solve in more detail problems\nof a self-interference of a photon in VLBI:\n\n1. "Detections" of signals? ;\n2. "Recording" of signals? ;\n3. "Additions" of signals? ;\n\n....\n\nand so on?\n\n\nDear colleagues, be sure and not hide in obscurity\n\n"quantum Paradox of a self-interference of a photon in VLBI"\n\n\n---\nBest Regards,\nAleksandr Timofeev\n</UL></PRE></font></td></tr></table></BODY><HTML>');"> <IMG SRC=/images/buttons/ip.gif BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER ALT="View this Usenet post in original ASCII form">  View this Usenet post in original ASCII form </a></div><P></jabberwocky>I hardly perceive physical sense of the article written
in the "Nature" by Burke B.F.:

Burke B.F., Quantum Interference Paradox, Nature, 223, [itex]389-390,[/itex] 1969.

-------------------------------------------------------------
There is no direct physical process of addition "of waves / photons"
passing through "slots or telescopes" in VLBI!
-------------------------------------------------------------

The interference fringes (picture) in VLBI (interferometer) is pure
mathematical abstraction, since the construction of an interference
pattern is carried out in the computer.

Dear colleagues physicists!

Whether you can describe / solve in more detail problems
of a self-interference of a photon in VLBI:

1. "Detections" of signals? ;
2. "Recording" of signals? ;
3. "Additions" of signals? ;

....

and so on?

Dear colleagues, be sure and not hide in obscurity

"quantum Paradox of a self-interference of a photon in VLBI"

---
Best Regards,
Aleksandr Timofeev

Aleksandr Timofeev

<jabberwocky><div class="vbmenu_control"><a href="jabberwocky:;" onClick="newWindow=window.open('','usenetCode','toolbar=no,location=no, scrollbars=yes,resizable=yes,status=no,width=650,height=400'); newWindow.document.write('<HTML><HEAD><TITLE>Usenet ASCII</TITLE></HEAD><BODY topmargin=0 leftmargin=0 BGCOLOR=#F1F1F1><table border=0 width=625><td bgcolor=midnightblue><font color=#F1F1F1>This Usenet message\'s original ASCII form: </font></td></tr><tr><td width=449><br><br><font face=courier><UL><PRE>a_n_timofeev@my-deja.com (Aleksandr Timofeev) wrote in message news:<e16a4a22.0409170152.427fa424@posting.google.com>...\n> I hardly perceive physical sense of the article written\n> in the "Nature" by Burke B.F.:\n>\n> Burke B.F., Quantum Interference Paradox, Nature, 223, 389-390, 1969.\n>\n> -------------------------------------------------------------\n> There is no direct physical process of addition "of waves / photons"\n> passing through "slots or telescopes" in VLBI!\n> -------------------------------------------------------------\n>\n> The interference fringes (picture) in VLBI (interferometer) is pure\n> mathematical abstraction, since the construction of an interference\n> pattern is carried out in the computer.\n>\n> Dear colleagues physicists!\n>\n> Whether you can describe / solve in more detail problems\n> of a self-interference of a photon in VLBI:\n>\n> 1. "Detections" of signals? ;\n> 2. "Recording" of signals? ;\n> 3. "Additions" of signals? ;\n>\n> ...\n>\n> and so on?\n>\n>\n> Dear colleagues, be sure and not hide in obscurity\n>\n> "quantum Paradox of a self-interference of a photon in VLBI"\n>\n\nDear colleagues!\n\nThere are two theories of interpretation of an interference\nphenomenon of electromagnetic radiation:\n\n1. A wave point of view and\n2. A photon point of view.\n\n1. A wave point of view.\n\nThe problems does not exist for classic wave interpretation\nof an interference phenomenon in VLBI an interferometer.\n\nhttp://groups.google.com/groups?selm=7FEB199721013402%40kelvin.jpl.nasa.gov\n\n\n2. A photon point of view.\n\nFrom a photon point of view, the photon can be gripped by one\nand only by one radio telescope from two radio telescopes of VLBI.\n\n**********************************************\nNow Dear colleagues!\n\nyou should describe YOURS the physical mechanism\nof a self-interference of a photon in VLBI.\n**********************************************\n\nFrom my point of view, you can not describe\nthe physical mechanism of a phenomenon of\na self-interference of a photon in VLBI,\nsince any your "interpretation" will be foregone\nto contain logic and physical ERRORS of explanation\nof the physical mechanism of a phenomenon of\na self-interference of a photon in VLBI.\n\n---\nBest Regards\nAleksandr Timofeev\n\n\n=====================================================\nP. S. ADDITIONAL INFO:\n\nhttp://groups.google.com/groups?selm=77vg46%24mai%241%40nnrp1.dejanews.com\n\nFrom: Aleksandr Timofeev (twa@alpha.dnttm.rssi.ru)\nSubject: Re: Length of wavetrain of a single photon\nView: Complete Thread (190 articles)\nNewsgroups: sci.physics.research\nDate: 1999/01/18\n\n\nIn article <368a3615.14460797@kcbbs.gen.nz>,\nrtomes@kcbbs.gen.nz (Ray Tomes) wrote:\n> I am wondering whether any attempt has ever been made to measure the\n> wave train length and amplitude profile of a single photon?\n>\n> To explain what I mean by this, consider Young\'s two slit experiment and\n> the resulting interference for the case where the photon rate is very\n> low and we may consider that essentially all observed events are self\n> interference of single photons.\n>\n\nOn my sight, for consideration of an offered problem from all points of\nview the most approaching measuring instrument is the microwave\ninterferometr with superlong basis - VLBI. I would name this type of an\ninterferometer as an interferometer with independent registration of signals\nin shoulders. Fundamentally any other interferometer by nothing differs from\nan interferometer considered below.\n\nPrinciples of work VLBI\n\nThe microwave interferometr with superlong basis consists of two radio\ntelescopes were on a very large distance from each other. Before experiment\nor after him, the nuclear hours are synchronized. Each radio telescope writes\non a videotape a transformed radiation accepted by an antenna. Simultaneously\nwith a signal, the scores of time received from the standard of frequency,\nare written on a videotape.\nAfter ending experiment we have two videotapes with entries of a signal\nand scores of time. The "interference picture" is received after data\nprocessing of these videotapes on the computer.\n\nThere are two graphic schemes illustrating the description:\n\nThe microwave interferometer with superlong basis. Part 1.\nBlock scheme.\n\n-> radio-telescope 1\n->\n-> parabolic antenna tape 1 clock 1\n-> \\\n-> \\ [ microwave ]\n-> \\ [ receiver + ] [videotape] [hydrogen ]\n-> ) )--->[analog-to-digital]--->[recorder ]<---[frequency]\n-> / [ converter ] ^ ^ [standard ]\n-> / | |\n-> / radio-signals time-marks\n-> microwave\n-> radiation\n-> for synchronization of atomic clocks\n-> [transportable caesium]\n-> [ frequency standard ]\n[snip] ====================================================================\n-> radio-telescope 2\n->\n->\n-> parabolic antenna 2 tape 2 clock 2\n-> \\\n-> \\ [ microwave ]\n-> \\ [ receiver + ] [videotape] [hydrogen ]\n-> ) )--->[analog-to-digital]--->[recorder ]<---[frequency]\n-> / [ converter ] ^ ^ [standard ]\n-> / | |\n-> / radio-signals time-marks\n->\n->\n->\n.. The microwave interferometer with superlong basis. Part 2.\n.. ----------------------------------------------------------\n\n.. "Interference picture"\n.. ^\n.. |\n.. [videotape 1] ------> [ COMPUTER ] <---------- [videotape 2]\n.. ^ ^\n.. | |\n.. radio-telescope 1 <- synchronization clocks -> radio-telescope 2\n.. Length of basis\n.. |<----------------------------- {snip} ------------------------------->|\n.. /^\\ /^\\\n\n\n\n..^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ {snip} ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^\n..| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |\nNoise microwave radiation\n\nFlexible possibilities of a computer interference of signals.\n\n1. Our interferometer has the right and left shoulders. The distance\nbetween shoulders does not influence sensitivity of an interferometer. The\nsensitivity of an interferometer to a signal is determined by the worse\nreceiver from both radio telescopes.\n- The distance between shoulders of an interferometer can be no matter\nhow large. (This problem is reduced to a problem of transportation of clocks\nof a synchronization).\n2. The addition of signals is carried out in the computer, that allows\nto apply no matter how complicated algorithms of addition of signals.\n- In that specific case, we can arbitrary vary delay of signals in each\nfrom a shoulders in any direction.\n\nConditionality of physical concept " an Interference picture ".\n\nHere we shall be convinced of a celebration of a principle of a causality.\nThe events happening on slots of an interferometer have primary significance,\nall other events happening in an interferometer have the status\nsecondary.\nLet\'s analyze physical concept addition of signals in an interferometer.\nThe radiation incident on an input of an interferometer has the following\nperformances:\nWavefront; Frequency band; Spectral fluence of energy;\nFor each frequency:\nPolarization; Amplitude; Phase; Stability.\nThe interferometer considered by us, is an interferometer with\nindependent registration of signals in shoulders and the process of addition\nof signals is carried out in the computer. The phrase " process of addition\nof signals is carried out in the computer " allows clearly to seize essence "\nconcepts of an interference picture " and source of an origin of this\nconcept. In the given type of an interferometer there is some arbitrariness\nin choice by us of the law of addition of signals from the right and left\nshoulders. In our case " the kind of an interference picture " depends on\nthe concrete law of addition of signals selected by us. In other kinds of\ninterferometers geometry (physical) construction of an interferometer\ndetermines the law of addition of signals and " a kind of an interference\npicture ".\n\n</UL></PRE></font></td></tr></table></BODY><HTML>');"> <IMG SRC=/images/buttons/ip.gif BORDER=0 ALIGN=CENTER ALT="View this Usenet post in original ASCII form">  View this Usenet post in original ASCII form </a></div><P></jabberwocky>a_{n_timofeev}@my-deja.com (Aleksandr Timofeev) wrote in message news:<e16a4a22.0409170152.427fa424@p...google.com>...
> I hardly perceive physical sense of the article written
> in the "Nature" by Burke B.F.:
>
> Burke B.F., Quantum Interference Paradox, Nature, 223, [itex]389-390,[/itex] 1969.
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------
> There is no direct physical process of addition "of waves / photons"
> passing through "slots or telescopes" in VLBI!
> -------------------------------------------------------------
>
> The interference fringes (picture) in VLBI (interferometer) is pure
> mathematical abstraction, since the construction of an interference
> pattern is carried out in the computer.
>
> Dear colleagues physicists!
>
> Whether you can describe / solve in more detail problems
> of a self-interference of a photon in VLBI:
>
> 1. "Detections" of signals? ;
> 2. "Recording" of signals? ;
> 3. "Additions" of signals? ;
>
> ...
>
> and so on?
>
>
> Dear colleagues, be sure and not hide in obscurity
>
> "quantum Paradox of a self-interference of a photon in VLBI"
>

Dear colleagues!

There are two theories of interpretation of an interference
phenomenon of electromagnetic radiation:

1. A wave point of view and
2. A photon point of view.

1. A wave point of view.

The problems does not exist for classic wave interpretation
of an interference phenomenon in VLBI an interferometer.

http://groups.google.com/groups?selm...n.jpl.nasa.gov

2. A photon point of view.

From a photon point of view, the photon can be gripped by one
and only by one radio telescope from two radio telescopes of VLBI.

[tex]**********************************************[/itex]
Now Dear colleagues!

you should describe YOURS the physical mechanism
of a self-interference of a photon in VLBI.
[itex]**********************************************[/tex]

From my point of view, you can not describe
the physical mechanism of a phenomenon of
a self-interference of a photon in VLBI,
since any your "interpretation" will be foregone
to contain logic and physical ERRORS of explanation
of the physical mechanism of a phenomenon of
a self-interference of a photon in VLBI.

---
Best Regards
Aleksandr Timofeev

=====================================================
P.S. ADDITIONAL INFO:

http://groups.google.com/groups?selm...1.dejanews.com

From: Aleksandr Timofeev (twa@\alpha.dnttm.rssi.ru)
Subject: Re: Length of wavetrain of a single photon
View: Complete Thread (190 articles)
Newsgroups: sci.physics.research
Date: [itex]1999/01/18[/itex]

In article <368a3615.14460797@kcbbs.gen.nz>,
rtomes@kcbbs.gen.nz (Ray Tomes) wrote:
> I am wondering whether any attempt has ever been made to measure the
> wave train length and amplitude profile of a single photon?
>
> To explain what I mean by this, consider Young's two slit experiment and
> the resulting interference for the case where the photon rate is very
> low and we may consider that essentially all observed events are self
> interference of single photons.
>

On my sight, for consideration of an offered problem from all points of
view the most approaching measuring instrument is the microwave
interferometr with superlong basis - VLBI. I would name this type of an
interferometer as an interferometer with independent registration of signals
in shoulders. Fundamentally any other interferometer by nothing differs from
an interferometer considered below.

Principles of work VLBI

The microwave interferometr with superlong basis consists of two radio
telescopes were on a very large distance from each other. Before experiment
or after him, the nuclear hours are synchronized. Each radio telescope writes
on a videotape a transformed radiation accepted by an antenna. Simultaneously
with a signal, the scores of time received from the standard of frequency,
are written on a videotape.
After ending experiment we have two videotapes with entries of a signal
and scores of time. The "interference picture" is received after data
processing of these videotapes on the computer.

There are two graphic schemes illustrating the description:

The microwave interferometer with superlong basis. Part 1.
Block scheme.

-> radio-telescope 1
->
-> parabolic antenna tape 1 clock 1
[itex]-> \-> \[/itex] [ microwave ]
[itex]-> \[/itex] [ receiver + ] [videotape] [hydrogen ]
-> ) )--->[analog-to-digital]--->[recorder ]<---[frequency]
[itex]-> /[/itex] [ converter [itex]] ^ ^[/itex] [standard ]
[itex]-> / | |-> /[/itex] radio-signals time-marks
-> microwave
-> radiation
-> for synchronization of atomic clocks
-> [transportable caesium]
-> [ frequency standard ]
[snip] ====================================================================
-> radio-telescope 2
->
->
-> parabolic antenna 2 tape 2 clock 2
[itex]-> \-> \[/itex] [ microwave ]
[itex]-> \[/itex] [ receiver + ] [videotape] [hydrogen ]
-> ) )--->[analog-to-digital]--->[recorder ]<---[frequency]
[itex]-> /[/itex] [ converter [itex]] ^ ^[/itex] [standard ]
[itex]-> / | |-> /[/itex] radio-signals time-marks
->
->
->
.. The microwave interferometer with superlong basis. Part 2.
.. ----------------------------------------------------------

.. "Interference picture"
.. [itex]^[/itex]
.. |
.. [videotape 1] ------> [ COMPUTER ] <---------- [videotape 2]
.. [itex]^ ^[/itex]
.. [itex]| |[/itex]
.. radio-telescope 1 <- synchronization clocks -> radio-telescope 2
.. Length of basis
.. |<----------------------------- {snip} ------------------------------->|
.[itex]. /^\ /^\[/itex]

..[itex]^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^[/itex] {snip} [itex]^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^[/itex]
..[itex]| | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | | |[/itex]
Noise microwave radiation

Flexible possibilities of a computer interference of signals.

1. Our interferometer has the right and left shoulders. The distance
between shoulders does not influence sensitivity of an interferometer. The
sensitivity of an interferometer to a signal is determined by the worse
receiver from both radio telescopes.
- The distance between shoulders of an interferometer can be no matter
how large. (This problem is reduced to a problem of transportation of clocks
of a synchronization).
2. The addition of signals is carried out in the computer, that allows
to apply no matter how complicated algorithms of addition of signals.
- In that specific case, we can arbitrary vary delay of signals in each
from a shoulders in any direction.

Conditionality of physical concept " an Interference picture ".

Here we shall be convinced of a celebration of a principle of a causality.
The events happening on slots of an interferometer have primary significance,
all other events happening in an interferometer have the status
secondary.
Let's analyze physical concept addition of signals in an interferometer.
The radiation incident on an input of an interferometer has the following
performances:
Wavefront; Frequency band; Spectral fluence of energy;
For each frequency:
Polarization; Amplitude; Phase; Stability.
The interferometer considered by us, is an interferometer with
independent registration of signals in shoulders and the process of addition
of signals is carried out in the computer. The phrase " process of addition
of signals is carried out in the computer " allows clearly to seize essence "
concepts of an interference picture " and source of an origin of this
concept. In the given type of an interferometer there is some arbitrariness
in choice by us of the law of addition of signals from the right and left
shoulders. In our case " the kind of an interference picture " depends on
the concrete law of addition of signals selected by us. In other kinds of
interferometers geometry (physical) construction of an interferometer
determines the law of addition of signals and " a kind of an interference
picture ".

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