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Gerson Method and Nutrition Therapy (FoodMatters)

 
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Feb26-11, 06:12 PM   #18
 

Gerson Method and Nutrition Therapy (FoodMatters)


"nismaratwork", I'd like you to selectively quote where I asked which plants are not nutritious for humans.

As for the rest of your remarks, you're clearly not someone worth debating. For one, you have trouble understanding my posts. Secondly, you have presented nothing factual to counter anything I have said. Pseudoscience isn't backed by thousands of studies, especially after they've been filtered through over a six-year period and then reviewed by twenty-one experts. Maybe you should review the findings of the The European Prospective Investigation into Cancer and Nutrition (EPIC) or the Hale Project study if you're still in denial. Maybe you should consult the French government's Institut National du Cancer for the results of Nutrition et prévention des cancers: des connaissances scientifiques aux recommandations if you can speak French (doubtful). If you're Hindu, maybe you should look into the health benefits of turmeric, something abundant in the diet of Indians. Do yourself a favor and learn something about disease prevention. Read carefully!
 
Feb26-11, 06:18 PM   #19
 
Quote by ETOPS View Post
"nismaratwork", I'd like you to selectively quote where I asked which plants are not nutritious for humans.

As for the rest of your remarks, you're clearly not someone worth debating. For one, you have trouble understanding my posts. Secondly, you have presented nothing factual to counter anything I have said. Pseudoscience isn't backed by thousands of studies, especially after they've been filtered through over a six-year period and then reviewed by twenty-one experts. Maybe you should review the findings of the The European Prospective Investigation into Cancer and Nutrition (EPIC) or the Hale Project study if you're still in denial. Maybe you should consult the French government's Institut National du Cancer for the results of Nutrition et prévention des cancers: des connaissances scientifiques aux recommandations if you can speak French (doubtful). If you're Hindu, maybe you should look into the health benefits of turmeric, something abundant in the diet of Indians. Do yourself a favor and learn something about disease prevention. Read carefully!
You want me to do your job for you? No thank you, and no amount of arguing will change that.

edit: Hmmm... it just occurred to me that you might be genuinely confused. Do you understand the difference between nutritional recommendations based on current best practices and knowledge, and scientific peer-reviewed studies? If so, you may want to look at the recent divide on Vit D supplementation, between one recommending body of experts, and another. I don't think you're confused, just dogmatic and very testy, but I feel that I should at least give you this chance.
 
Feb26-11, 06:42 PM   #20
 
Quote by nismaratwork View Post
edit: Hmmm... it just occurred to me that you might be genuinely confused. Do you understand the difference between nutritional recommendations based on current best practices and knowledge, and scientific peer-reviewed studies? If so, you may want to look at the recent divide on Vit D supplementation, between one recommending body of experts, and another. I don't think you're confused, just dogmatic and very testy, but I feel that I should at least give you this chance.
Recommendations made by governments and research agencies are based on the thousands of studies that demonstrate the preventive efficacy of a plant-based diet against the first-world chronic afflictions, namely cancer (which I have spoken most about). Scientific bodies do not publish recommendations without evidence for them. The studies I have provided inductively prove the benefit of several dietary behaviors and lifestyle habits. Individual foods, even, are particularly protective. If you search PubMed, you can find research ongoing or completed on the matter of phytochemical inhibition of tumors, whether in vitro or in vivo. If you have any interest at all, I highly recommend Anticancer by David Servan-Schreiber, MD, PhD.

Vitamin D is being discovered to be increasingly important. There isn't really a divide on the matter. People should maintain adequate 25(OH)D levels and expose themselves to the sun for 15 minutes daily, or orally supplement with cholecalciferol (D3) or ergocalciferol (D2). People do believe Vitamin D deficiency is responsible for winter flu season. The point is that people believe a lot of things.
 
Feb26-11, 06:52 PM   #21
 
Mentor
I need to close this thread temporarily to get caught up on some of the references being posted. I hope to be able to re-open it by Monday. Thanks for your patience.
 
Mar1-11, 12:24 PM   #22
 
Mentor
Okay, I think I can re-open this now. Please take care not to use any insults in the discussion, and please keep the discussion focused on nutrition and health.

I do find the study posted by ETOPS interesting and credible. Certainly better nutrition has many benefits, including helping to prevent disease. Here is the wikipedia article that he referred to (the website he posted requires registration to view the study, and wikipedia does not):

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food,_N...al_Perspective

In debating the efficacy of a particular food or vitamin, please be sure to link to credible references. And it may be true that there is still enough of a debate that there are studies supporting both sides. That is fine.

I'm also moving this thread back to Medical Sciences, where it originated. I'd moved it to S&D based on the first few responses to the OP pointing out the "quackery" in the original study. But the thread has progressed on to discussing nutrition and health in general, and that needs to be a discussion in Medical Sciences.
 
Mar1-11, 01:15 PM   #23
 
Quote by nismaratwork View Post

@Physics-Learner: How to seperate "health and genetics"?! Science has made it abundantly clear that it's nature AND nurture, not one or the other.
i think what i said was that i think that "nurture" (our environment) plays a much stronger role than does "nature" (our genetics) on our overall health. at least that is what i meant to convey.

you asked how i separate the two ? 56 years of living. health and fitness has and does play a very central role in my life.

jack lalanne would be an excellent example of the result that nurture can have on our bodies.
 
Mar1-11, 01:37 PM   #24
 
Quote by Physics-Learner View Post
i think what i said was that i think that "nurture" (our environment) plays a much stronger role than does "nature" (our genetics) on our overall health. at least that is what i meant to convey.

you asked how i separate the two ? 56 years of living. health and fitness has and does play a very central role in my life.

jack lalanne would be an excellent example of the result that nurture can have on our bodies.
Or he was genetically gifted; this is why we use studies and not anecdotes.
 
Mar1-11, 01:49 PM   #25
 
i am afraid that jack just rolled over in his grave after hearing your comment - LOL.

do you honestly think that it was because he was genetically gifted that allowed him to live his life the way he did ?

he worked out almost every day. after his childhood of sugar addiction, he had a very disciplined life of the proper type of nutrition.
 
Mar1-11, 01:54 PM   #26
 
Quote by Physics-Learner View Post
i am afraid that jack just rolled over in his grave after hearing your comment - LOL.

do you honestly think that it was because he was genetically gifted that allowed him to live his life the way he did ?

he worked out almost every day. after his childhood of sugar addiction, he had a very disciplined life of the proper type of nutrition.
Which may have had an incredibly positive effect, but that doesn't make it a valid study or sample. Anecdotal evidence just doesn't cut it.
 
Mar1-11, 02:00 PM   #27
 
every one comes from a different perspective. i see in my life, and others around me, the extremely positive effect that nurture has.

since i dont know you, i have no idea what your perspective revolves around.
 
Mar1-11, 02:01 PM   #28
 
and just as importanly, the extremely negative effect a lack of nurture has.
 
Mar1-11, 02:07 PM   #29
 
Quote by nismaratwork View Post
Which may have had an incredibly positive effect, but that doesn't make it a valid study or sample. Anecdotal evidence just doesn't cut it.
it would have been very interesting to me to see how long his body could live. he did not die because of "old age".

by that, i mean that his body was not falling apart as is customary when it really does reach the end of its lifeline.

jack died rather suddenly because he was unable to fight of a pneumonia virus.

i personally hope to make it between 120-140. but more importantly, i hope i can demonstrate yet another "anecdote" of how nurture plays an important role.

but that gives me still another 70 years or so - LOL.
 
Mar1-11, 02:20 PM   #30
 
Quote by Physics-Learner View Post
it would have been very interesting to me to see how long his body could live. he did not die because of "old age".

by that, i mean that his body was not falling apart as is customary when it really does reach the end of its lifeline.
How on earth do you come to that conclusion, and what evidence do you have?

Quote by Physics-Learner View Post
jack died rather suddenly because he was unable to fight of a pneumonia virus.
A common killer of the elderly.

Quote by Physics-Learner View Post
i personally hope to make it between 120-140. but more importantly, i hope i can demonstrate yet another "anecdote" of how nurture plays an important role.

but that gives me still another 70 years or so - LOL.
Good luck with that, in the meantime this is now in the medicine forum, so please add some kind of... SOMETHING to back these claims.
 
Mar1-11, 02:21 PM   #31
 
Quote by Physics-Learner View Post
every one comes from a different perspective. i see in my life, and others around me, the extremely positive effect that nurture has.

since i dont know you, i have no idea what your perspective revolves around.
My perspective is essentially DanP's, and ironically, very close to ETOPS; that has nothing to do with this discussion. This isn't about our personal views, or wagers in life, but about medicine, approached as scientifically as possible.
 
Mar1-11, 02:24 PM   #32
 
perhaps you did not follow jack's life ?

he was not sickly. still working out, etc. in other words, his body was not yet out of gas.

i will exit now, if you want to compare study "a" with study "b".
 
Mar1-11, 02:52 PM   #33
 
Quote by Physics-Learner View Post
perhaps you did not follow jack's life ?

he was not sickly. still working out, etc. in other words, his body was not yet out of gas.

i will exit now, if you want to compare study "a" with study "b".
What do you think this is about?! And how on earth does your immunse sytstem crapping out not = "running out of gas"?

Come on man, just read the guidelines... please? This is not the way to conduct yourself here... maybe not enough for infractions, but in terrible faith. I may disagree and frankly dislike ETOPS, but at least he provided enough evidence to satisfy mentors, if not me.
 
Mar1-11, 02:58 PM   #34
 
Back to the topic, I would consider the source, and motivation here.

http://www.gerson.org/

Quote by Gerson Org Front-Page
Gerson Institute / Cancer Curing Society
The Gerson Institute is a non-profit organization located in San Diego, California, dedicated to providing education and training in the alternative, non-toxic treatment of cancer and other disease, using the Gerson Therapy.

The Gerson Therapy is a safe, natural treatment developed by Dr. Max Gerson in the 1920’s that uses organic foods, juicing, coffee enemas, detoxification and natural supplements to activate the body’s ability to heal itself. Over the past 60 years, thousands of people have used the Gerson Therapy to recover from so-called “incurable” diseases such as cancer, diabetes, heart disease and arthritis.

Founded by Charlotte Gerson (Dr. Gerson’s daughter) in 1977, we are the true source of information on the original, unmodified, proven Gerson Therapy. We refer people to licensed Gerson clinics and treatment centers, practitioners and caregivers. We also train health professionals, patients and others who want to learn this natural therapy. Visit our STORE for a wide selection of educational books, audio and video tapes.

You have the power to heal yourself. We can give you the tools and show you how!
Cure. Not prevent, not help... CURE. Good thing they have that STORE.
 
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