My girlfriend, her family, and human dysfunctionality in general

ee1978

Thanks.

Just as a homosexual with self-respect would not dream of acting heterosexual just to make troglodyte bigots happy, unless he had a damned good reason, such as his immediate physical safety.

She promised me that her parents' opinions will not influence her decision to stay with me and eventually marry, if that's what we both want. Therefore, they are going to have to give up their bigotry if she and I marry (or else forget about interacting with the grandchildren, which, of course, they won't do).

It's humiliating to conform to the ways of people who passionately hate you. That should not require further explanation.

See above. She already accepts me and will not let their opinions interfere with our relationship.

Antiphon

You may have to accept the fact that you don't have what it takes to pull off this relationship.

See a shrink. They can help you overcome your obvious denial and give you exercises to help you fit in better socially.

From what I can see here, her parents have the right attitude. I wouldn't want you dating my daughter either.

You need to man up already and seek the professional help you need instead of seeking validation under the guise of cerebral discourse.

ee1978

> 70k

I turned 33 earlier this year. She will turn 29 in a couple of months.

If things go well between now and then, I may propose in the summer or fall of 2012.

He's not a mechanic any longer. I think that his lack of income, if it hasn't already, will stress the sister out fairly soon.

He's a dumbass. I'm a hardworking, intelligent man, who is kind to everyone, unless given reason to be otherwise, who is loyal to friends, who puts maximum effort into communicating effectively, and who is patient, considerate, thoughtful, and loving when in a relationship. I don't see why you'd think that a "brainy engineer" like me would stress his family out.

Lichdar

You have made your choice in relation to her family; rather than just making value judgments and seeking be validified by peers, I think you should simply accept that there are consequences associated with your choice. I also believe that you are not operating in an efficient manner if you sought to change them or even to demonstrate your value as a human being to them.

I'm slightly worried that you have stated openly that you are 'kind and intelligent' when your way of expressing it, at least over text, does not seem to immediately convey that. Your method of communicating is clearly not effective, as effectivity can be measured by the results. I'm an arrogant and judgmental bastard with a diagnosed antisocial personality disorder; at least I'm aware of it.

ee1978

I have so far, and she has stated that her parents will have no effect on whether or not we marry.

No.

My denial of what?

Read more carefully. I have stated, numerous times, that I can fit in socially perfectly well (after years of practice, and tips from a cousin who is a psychologist), but that it is emotionally costly for me, so I only do it sparingly, when I have a very good reason to do so.

Hating someone for not simultaneously schmoozing with a large number of people is unreasonable, to say the least.

I talked with her uncle quite a bit. If that's not good enough, then tough ****.

I wouldn't want to date your daughter, unless she takes after her mother, with her mother being a hell of a lot different than you are.

You need to man up and stop being a bigot.

I dare you to go to some gay pride event and try to sell your conformity excrement sandwich there.

ee1978

I have accepted that there will be consequences associated with my choice. If and when we have children, they will lose a lot of face.

Isn't it axiomatic that being human gives me value? Arguably, history's worst tyrants and similar types may not have such value because of very bad deeds that they have committed, but that's another discusion for another day. I haven't done anything remotely close to murder or any of the other things generally considered to strip a human of his or her value.

Yes, I am angry. Kind people can become angry when provoked.

I'm still with her, so apparently it's effective enough.

Lichdar

A lot of abusive jerkwads also have loyal girlfriends, so that argument toward effectivity is minimal. You clearly have the ability to communicate with one or a few people; this, however, does not logically extend to all people by the merits of deductive reasoning.

I have to admit that your almost singular obsession with homosexuality is slightly frightening as well; as an average hetrosexual male, I would find that your anger to a bit beyond what I would expect. I am a person of color and I respond to racism with snideness and sarcasm; if bigotry is ignorance, then there's not much to be accomplished by squabbling with the ignorant.

I do think that you have communication issues and you will benefit from speaking with a therapist. Introspection, also, is always a good thing.

JDStupi

I can understand your sentiments, but I have a number of observations. First, if you're so intelligent why can't you make this decision yourself? Jean Paul Sartre spoke of how even in seeking advice individuals tend to turn to those people who they feel may very well give them the advice they want. A group of "intelligent" physicists would seemingly be a group who would agree with your anti-social tendencies and give you the advice you want to hear, now that they aren't you are arguing tooth and nail.

Second observation, as everybody else said you are placing value judgements, and you said "How am I not, of course I value being human" well being human doesn't mean being intellligent. Your just unhappy because you feel as though your traits are superior and under-appreciated and would rather a world in which you could be the majority. I see more than a little Will to Power in your actions.

You have to be intelligent enough to realize that not everybody can be as intelligent as you, just as not everybody can be as good at sports or music as the next guy. You also have to realize that before your anything your a human being first, and there is much more to being human than being "intelligent" and "successfull". You rally against "the herd", but all I see is a social deviant who wants the same goals and has the same values as society, but dislikes his under appreciation. You are saing that you are "successfull" and "smart" and "hard-working", you sound like a your trying to "sell yourself".

As un-intelligent as your sister-in-laws husband may be, he may be much more profound than you are. How so? Because again profundity can be a matter of experience, and living, rather than intellectualizing. What if he offers his family hard work and love? Those are some of the most profound things you can offer somebody in a personal relationship. And here you are bitching that he's not worthy of their affections. Your not interested in equality, stop fronting. Your interested in getting your way, if he was the one outcasted you would say "good he's un intelligent etc etc".

Stop pretending to be important or better, stop saying "society shouldn't expect me to do x or y" ...Listen, I hate acting fake, I hate that society is interested in stupid banal crap. So often I just solve the problem, by telling the truth.

That is my piece of advice that you can use, tell the truth. Tell the parents that you aren't good at talking to people and you are sometimes not interested in what people have to say, and it may be your own fault, and you apologize for offending them, but it is something that is a part of you. Just say what's up. You don't like social BS, then tell the truth and keep it real and if that doesn't work, whatever. Keep in mind when I say "tell the truth" I don't mean be a douche and snub the parents and claim your superiority, I mean tell them that you aren't good at socializing.

Mentallic

Mmm... I don't know about this part. A lot of people instinctively connect the dots in such a way as to say that any type of disorder which hinders your ability to act normal is seen as being a retard. You wouldn't want that at all.

ee1978

That does not constitute evidence that I'm abusive.

I have the ability to communicate with most people if I am sufficiently motivated.

It is a logical comparison. Homosexual rights have grown by leaps and bounds lately. Homosexual rights are a perfect analogue for rights for other oppressed groups, such as introverts, allegedly "AS" people, etc.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but anti-person of color bigots have little to no significant power over your life, correct? The same can't be said for the types of people that I refer to in the OP.

Please elaborate.

I have always been introspective.

ee1978

I simply want discussion.

See immediately above.

I most certainly did not type the sentence that you put in quotes. Check this thread.

I do see the world as less than ideal, and I don't see anything particularly wrong with expressing that opinion. Do you?

I never indicated that I want anyone to be mistreated. That's not at all incompatible with being angry at those who mistreat others.

See above. They will eventually be forced by circumstances to be more reasonable.

ee1978

First, anyone who associates a person of high intelligence with retardation, is a retard.

Second, "any type of disorder which hinders your ability to act normal" looks like a tautology.

DaveC426913

I'm having some trouble figuring out exactly what's being done to whom.
No, it's not clear enough. You seem to have conflated two independent concepts in that one sentence. How does education and intelligence versus not having a job equate with social skills?

It should be fairly obvious that her and her parents regard social skills as an important facet of a person whereas education or income less so.


Also, can you go over the bigotry aspect again? I missed it. How are they bigoted? Something about Aspies and nerds? They stated they dislike them as a group?
Wait. That's twice you've attempted to parallel your situation with that of gays. Why do you feel your argument is not strong enough to stand on its own without erecting a strawman?

Lichdar

It doesn't; it consitutes evidence that your metric is invalid.

Res ipsa loquitur. Either you do not value communication with your family in law or you are incapable. It seems that it is the former.

Illogical analogue of sexual orientation choice to mental disability.

I have a disability that prevents me from emphathizing with others in a normal fashion, causes me to lie regularly, increases my tendency to manipulate and virtually removes my ability to see how things such as human life ought to have instrinsic value. I believe it makes me more capable than most; I still do not go around announcing it to others.


Are you kidding?

A therapist will assist you in developing strategies to more effectively communicate with others in a way, and perhaps expose you to different methods of thinking. You seem strongly convinced that yours is the only appropriate one; as you can see from resistance even here in your peer group, it is not so.

If you say so. You do not seem to admit to any error but slams almost everyone else.

cristo

It's likely this pompous attitude that her parents dislike.

Mentallic

I'm not talking about high intelligence, I'm speaking of the fact that JDStupi was suggesting you tell them about your social inadequacies. This could be seen as retardation.

Not all disorders make people seem different. Mental (extending to physical disorder) and social disorders are the most obvious which people conclude as being a retard.

Femme_physics

I'm sorry but this is very annoying to me. Are they paying you for service that you have to be extra nice to them? wtf? And what about THEM trying to get to know you better? Why is it always you having to do the work? Why is it that you can't be the "harsh" one and judge them like they judge you? What gave them the courtroom and gavel?

And besides, if my parents didn't like my bf I'd tell them to deal with it. He's my bf and I love him. Their damn problem.

As far as that guy they worship, why do you give a damn? I hope you'd stop grovelling for what people you don't even respect like.