The Phosphorus Cycle: Gas or No Gas?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the phosphorus cycle and whether phosphorus can exist as a gas. Participants explore the implications of phosphorus states in ecological contexts and the broader question of elemental states of matter.

Discussion Character

  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that phosphorus cannot be a gas, particularly in the context of the biosphere, where temperatures do not reach levels sufficient for gaseous phosphorus.
  • Others argue that while phosphorus can technically exist as a gas, it is not found in that state within the phosphorus cycle, which primarily involves inorganic phosphates.
  • One participant mentions the presence of detectable phosphines in the biosphere, suggesting that while rare, gaseous phosphorus does exist in some form.
  • There is a discussion about whether all elements can exist in all four states of matter, with a participant suggesting that helium may remain a liquid at absolute zero, but this remains uncertain.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express differing views on the existence of gaseous phosphorus, with no consensus reached on the teacher's claim or the broader question of elemental states.

Contextual Notes

Some statements rely on specific conditions, such as temperature and pressure, which may not be universally applicable. The discussion also touches on potential miscommunications regarding the context of phosphorus states.

HBar
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My last chemistry class was in the 7th grade (currently 10th grader) so bear with me. Last year duing a biology class we were talking about ecology and how phosphorus would cycle through the environment. The reason that the phosphorus cycle is interesting is because phosphorus cannot be a gas, or so my teacher said. I Immediatly questioned this because in my chemistry class i remeber hearing that elements can be in any of the 4 states, but my teacher insisted that it could not. So, who was right?
-HBar
 
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He probably meant within a living organism. Phosphoros bnoils at just over 500o (like maybe 550?).
 
Your teacher was right. Technically phosphorous can be a gas, but not in the biosphere, the temperature never gets hot enough. And besides, it doesn't occur as elemental phosphorous in the cycle but as inorganic phosphates.
 
There are detectable phosphines floating about in the biosphere in the vapor phase --- that said, the quantity is probably insignificant as far as atmospheric transport of phosphorus.
 
I agree with him that natural vaporizing phosphorus in nature is a rare sight, but he claimed that it couldn't be a gas at all. Or maybe it was just a miscomunication.
But this brings up another question. Can all the elements be in all the 4 states?
 
Originally posted by HBar
I agree with him that natural vaporizing phosphorus in nature is a rare sight, but he claimed that it couldn't be a gas at all. Or maybe it was just a miscomunication.
But this brings up another question. Can all the elements be in all the 4 states?

I'm thinking it was a miscommunication. He probably meant it couldn't be a gas in the context of the phosphorous cycle.

To answer your question, yes, all elements can exist in all 4 states, with one exception. It is believed that helium will remain a liquid at absolute zero, but of course we'll never know.
 
Ahh, that's good to know. I was wondering about that for awhile. I have heard the same about helium, but i thought it was it cannot become a solid at absolute zero at 1 atmosphere of presure. I think that if the presure is increased it can become a solid.
-HBar
 

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