Boltzmann Equation-where'd the 3 come from?

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the derivation of the Boltzmann equation for a particle in thermal equilibrium within the context of the Friedman-Robertson-Walker metric. Participants explore the mathematical formulation and the origin of the factor of 3 in the equation, referencing specific equations from Kolb and Turner's work.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • One participant expresses confusion regarding the factor of 3 in the Boltzmann equation derived from Kolb and Turner, questioning its origin and the treatment of energy in the momentum integral.
  • Another participant suggests comparing the derivation with Wayne Hu's PhD thesis, implying that it may provide additional clarity.
  • A different participant proposes that the factor of 3 arises from the expression \(\frac{1}{R^3}\frac{d}{dt}(R^3)n\), indicating a potential source for the confusion.
  • A later reply provides a detailed breakdown of the derivation steps, showing how integration by parts leads to the appearance of the factor of 3, but does not resolve the initial confusion about its necessity.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the origin of the factor of 3, with multiple viewpoints and interpretations presented. The discussion remains unresolved regarding the clarity of the derivation and the treatment of the energy integral.

Contextual Notes

There are references to specific equations and derivations from Kolb and Turner, as well as Wayne Hu's thesis, which may contain assumptions or definitions that are not fully explored in the discussion.

fliptomato
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Boltzmann Equation--where'd the 3 come from?

Greetings, I'm a little bit confused about the derivation for the Boltzmann equation for a particle in thermal equilibrium in the Friedman-Robertson-Walker metric. I've been following the exposition in Kolb and Turner, The Early Universe p. 116. I reproduce all the relevant results here.

In particular:
We are given (K&T, eq 5.5) that for a phase space distribution [tex]f[/tex] the form of the Liouville operator in the FRW model is given by:

[tex]\hat{\mathbf{L}}[f(E,t)] = E\frac{\partial f}{\partial t}-\frac{\dot{R}}{R}|\mathbf{p}|^2\frac{\partial f}{\partial E}[/tex]

Further, the number density [tex]n[/tex] is given by an integral over momenta (K&T eq. 5.6):

[tex]n(t) = \frac{g}{(2\pi)^3}\int d^3p f(E,t)[/tex]

where [tex]g[/tex] is the number of internal degrees of freedom.

The Boltzmann equation, [tex]\hat{\mathbf{L}}[f]= \mathbf{C}[f][/tex], can then be written out by plugging in the above equation for the Liouville operator on the left hand side.

We can then divide by [tex]E[/tex], multiply by [tex]\frac{g}{(2\pi)^3}[/tex], and perform a momentum space integral to express the Boltzmann equation in terms of [tex]n[/tex].

Kolb and Turner write the result as:

[tex]\frac{dn}{dt} + 3\frac{\dot{R}}{R}n = \frac{g}{(2\pi)^3}\int\textbf{C}[f]\frac{d^3p}{E}[/tex]

I'm confused by the factor of 3 in the seccond term and am not sure how this is resolved. I'm also not sure how to treat the energy in the momentum integral--I assume that since [tex]E^2=\mathbf{p}^2+m^2[/tex], one can rewrite the momentum integral in spherical coordinates where the function [tex]f[/tex] is a function of the radial coordinate alone. I assume some integration by parts is necessary, but this still does not account for the factor of 3.

Any help would be appreciated,


Flip
 
Last edited:
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fliptomato said:
I assume some integration by parts is necessary, but this still does not account for the factor of 3.
I haven't read Kolb and Turner's book, but I think you'll find the factor 3 and the rest of that term comes from:
[tex]\frac{1}{R^3}\frac{d}{dt}(R^3)n[/tex]

Garth
 


<deleted>
 
Last edited:


A bit late for the one who asked, but perhaps it helps those who have the same problem

[tex]E\frac{\partial f}{\partial t}-\frac{\dot{R}}{R}|\mathbf{p}|^2\frac{\partial f}{\partial E} = \hat{\mathbf{C}}[f(E,t)][/tex]
divide by E
[tex]\frac{\partial f}{\partial t}-\frac{\dot{R}}{R}|\mathbf{p}|^2\frac{\partial f}{E\partial E} = \hat{\mathbf{C}}[f(E,t)]\frac{1}{E}[/tex]
integrate
[tex]\frac{g}{(2\pi)^3}\int d^3p\frac{\partial f}{\partial t}-\frac{\dot{R}}{R}|\mathbf{p}|^2\frac{\partial f}{E\partial E} = \frac{g}{(2\pi)^3}\int\hat{\mathbf{C}}[f(E,t)]\frac{d^3p}{E}[/tex]
[tex]n(t)-\frac{\dot{R}}{R}\frac{g}{(2\pi)^3}\int d^3p|\mathbf{p}|^2\frac{\partial f}{E\partial E} = \frac{g}{(2\pi)^3}\int\hat{\mathbf{C}}[f(E,t)]\frac{d^3p}{E}[/tex]
use
[tex]E\partial E=p\partial p[/tex]
[tex]n(t)-\frac{\dot{R}}{R}\frac{g}{(2\pi)^3}\int 4\pi dp|\mathbf{p}|^2|\mathbf{p}|^2\frac{\partial f}{p\partial p} = \frac{g}{(2\pi)^3}\int\hat{\mathbf{C}}[f(E,t)]\frac{d^3p}{E}[/tex]
[tex]n(t)-\frac{\dot{R}}{R}\frac{g}{(2\pi)^3}\int 4\pi dpp^3\frac{\partial f}{\partial p} = \frac{g}{(2\pi)^3}\int\hat{\mathbf{C}}[f(E,t)]\frac{d^3p}{E}[/tex]
integration by part:
[tex]n(t)+\frac{\dot{R}}{R}\frac{g}{(2\pi)^3}\int 4\pi dp3p^2f= \frac{g}{(2\pi)^3}\int\hat{\mathbf{C}}[f(E,t)]\frac{d^3p}{E}[/tex]
[tex]n(t)+3\frac{\dot{R}}{R}\frac{g}{(2\pi)^3}\int 4\pi dpp^2f= \frac{g}{(2\pi)^3}\int\hat{\mathbf{C}}[f(E,t)]\frac{d^3p}{E}[/tex]
[tex]n(t)+3\frac{\dot{R}}{R}n(t)= \frac{g}{(2\pi)^3}\int\hat{\mathbf{C}}[f(E,t)]\frac{d^3p}{E}[/tex]



stanix
 

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