Why Water Decreases in Cross-Sxn Area: Conservation of Mass

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the behavior of water as it flows from a faucet, specifically addressing why the cross-sectional area of the water stream decreases as it falls. Participants explore concepts related to conservation of mass and energy, the effects of gravity, and the implications of fluid dynamics.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory
  • Technical explanation
  • Debate/contested
  • Conceptual clarification

Main Points Raised

  • Some participants assert that the conservation of mass principle explains the decrease in cross-sectional area, suggesting that the product of cross-sectional area and velocity remains constant as water falls.
  • Others argue that while all water is accelerating due to gravity, water further from the faucet has been falling longer and thus has a higher velocity, contributing to the change in cross-section.
  • One participant emphasizes that the volume of water passing through the faucet must equal the volume hitting the sink, proposing that if the cross-section were constant, it would lead to a buildup of water.
  • Questions arise about whether the cross-section would decrease in a vacuum, with some participants asserting that gravity is the primary factor affecting the stream's behavior.
  • A participant introduces a contrasting scenario involving a fountain, suggesting that the cross-section increases as water rises before falling again.
  • Another participant highlights the role of energy conservation, noting that gravitational potential energy converts to kinetic energy, affecting the velocity of water molecules at different heights.
  • One contribution discusses intermolecular interactions and density, proposing that the cross-sectional area decreases due to the constant average distance between molecules, rather than a change in density.
  • Surface tension is mentioned as a factor that holds the stream together, reinforcing the idea that the vacuum condition does not significantly alter the behavior of the water stream.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants express multiple competing views regarding the mechanisms behind the decrease in cross-sectional area, with no consensus reached on the primary factors or the implications of different scenarios.

Contextual Notes

Some discussions involve assumptions about the effects of gravity and vacuum conditions, as well as the interplay between energy conservation and fluid dynamics, which remain unresolved.

quasi426
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Why does water bottleneck or decrease in cross sectional area when it falls from the faucet. The book says it is conservation of mass stuff...
(Cross-Sxn Area)* (velocity) = constant.

How can that be if all the water is accelerating at the same pace. What I mean is that all the water in the cross sectional area at the start should be increasing in velocity at the same rate due to gravity.
 
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What I mean is that all the water in the cross sectional area at the start should be increasing in velocity at the same rate due to gravity.

This is absolutely true. But the water further away from the faucet has been falling for a longer duration and has a higher velocity.
 
Bear with me; per second, the amount (volume) of water that passes through the hole is equal to the amount that falls onto the sink, right? Otherwise there would be some kind of water buildup in between. If the 'water beam' were to have constant cross-section, there would be less water exiting the faucet than what fell on the ground: imagine the velocity of the water is 1m/s at the faucet, and 10m/s just before hitting the surface underneath. Then, in 1 second, one meter of 'beam' will have past through the faucet, and, in that same second, 10 meters of beam will have hit the surface. Because the volume of either is the same, the cross section must have decreased. Hope that clears things up.
 
Would the cross section of the water decrease towards the bottom if it was in a vacuum?
 
quasi426 said:
Would the cross section of the water decrease towards the bottom if it was in a vacuum?
Yes it would. A vacuum is not the issue here, it is gravity. Gravity accelerates the stream of water.
 
quasi:
Consider the inverted case, with a fountain:
Do you agree that the cross-section of the spurt INCREASES until you get to the top where the water starts falling down again?
 
Just a couple of points I thought I'd throw in. First off, the pertinent law is the conservation of energy, not mass. As gravitational potential energy is converted into kinetic energy, and the longer any given water molecule has been accelerated the faster it must be falling, then on average a molecule nearer the sink than the tap will be traveling faster than one nearer the tap than the sink. If you take any given area, say a cubic centimetre, the molecules at the top of that area also must be moving slower than those at the bottom, so the water is kind of being stretched out vertically. This in itself does not necessitate that the cross-sectional area must decrease. If this were the only concern, the cross-sectional areas may be the same at the top as the bottom, but the density would be greater at the top. What makes the cross-sectional area decrease, rather than the density, is (on a fundamental level) the intermolecular interactions between the water molecules. For the density to decrease, the average distance between molecules has to to increase, meaning an increase in potential energy. This requires an increase in temperature, but no heat is being transferred to the water (bar the negligible friction with this air, and not even that in a vacuum). Therefore the average distance between molecules has to be constant, and so it is the cross-sectional area that has to decrease. This is explained macroscopically by the laws of fluid mechanics, involving field lines and viscosity and other things I can't remember much about.
 
quasi426 said:
Would the cross section of the water decrease towards the bottom if it was in a vacuum?
Yes. Surface tension holds the stream together. (As Fred says, vacuum is not the issue.)
 

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