How High Can a Roller Coaster Start Without Flying Off the Track?

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Homework Help Overview

The discussion revolves around a physics problem involving a roller coaster car on a frictionless track, starting from a height h and navigating circular segments. The main question is to determine the maximum height from which the car can start without losing contact with the track at a specific point, referred to as point C, in terms of the radius R of the circular segments.

Discussion Character

  • Exploratory, Conceptual clarification, Mathematical reasoning, Assumption checking

Approaches and Questions Raised

  • Participants discuss the relationship between height, velocity, and forces acting on the roller coaster car at point C. There are attempts to analyze the free-body diagram and the implications of circular motion. Questions arise about the role of the normal force and how it relates to maintaining contact with the track.

Discussion Status

Participants are actively exploring the problem, with some providing hints and guidance regarding the conditions for maintaining contact at point C. There is a focus on understanding the net force and acceleration involved in circular motion, although no consensus has been reached on the specific calculations or methods to apply.

Contextual Notes

Participants express uncertainty about the significance of the angle and the presence of two circular segments in the problem setup. There is also a mention of the need to consider the scenario where the normal force becomes zero as a critical point in the analysis.

dekoi
A roller coaster car on the frictionless track shown, starts from rest at height h. The track is straight until point A. Between points A and D, the track consists of circle-shaped segments of radius R.

Question:

What is the maximum height hmax from which the car can start so as not to fly off the track when going over the hill at point C? Give you answer in terms of the radius R.
Hint: This is a two-part problem. First find vmax at C.

My answer:

I have tried many different methods, but cannot find the right one. The answer in the textbook tells me that hmax = 3/2R.
I know how to find hmax once I have vmax, but the problem is finding vmax in the first place.
I don't know what I'm supposed to do with the 30 degree angle. I thought of using it as the angular position, but I can't seem to continue from there to find vmax. I calculated that the angular position would be 60 degrees (90 - 30).
Does the fact that there are 2 circles have something to do with my answer? Or is that just there to confuse me?
I also tried drawing a FBD at point C. The only two forces I obtained were a normal force (up) and gravity (down). However, because it is a circle, is my normal force supposed to be pointing down also (toward the centre of the circle)? Does this have something to do with my answer also?
Please help-- I have tried many different methods but cannot seem to get the right answer.
 

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Consider that if the car is to maintain contact with the track at point C, what kind of motion must it execute? (Hint: Is it accelerating?) How do you specify the condition for "just about to lose contact"? (Hint: What happens to the normal force?) Apply Newton's 2nd law to the car at point C. (What's the net force on the car?)
 
I do not know what the net force is on the car. That's what I was trying to figure out with the free-body diagram. I'm assuming the net force is toward the centre of the circle since the car is undergoing circular motion at point C.

If the car is to maintain contact with the track at point C, it must execute circular motion which means it's accelerating toward the centre of the circle. Right?

I don't know what happens to the normal force when the car is just about to lose contact. Can you help?
 
dekoi said:
I do not know what the net force is on the car. That's what I was trying to figure out with the free-body diagram. I'm assuming the net force is toward the centre of the circle since the car is undergoing circular motion at point C.
Right.
If the car is to maintain contact with the track at point C, it must execute circular motion which means it's accelerating toward the centre of the circle. Right?
Exactly! This is key: use what you know about centripetal acceleration.
I don't know what happens to the normal force when the car is just about to lose contact.
Here's a hint: What happens to the normal force when there is no contact?
 
When there is no contact, the normal force is 0, so only gravity is taken into account. I'm assuming this is what I have to use in order to find the acceleration? And just for some clarification before I attempt this problem again: Does the angle have anything to do with my answer? Or even that fact that there are two circles...
 
dekoi said:
When there is no contact, the normal force is 0, so only gravity is taken into account.
Right. That's what you need to find the net force.
And just for some clarification before I attempt this problem again: Does the angle have anything to do with my answer? Or even that fact that there are two circles...
All that matters is that point C is on the top of a circle. Use that fact to determine the acceleration at point C.
 
Thank you.

I will attempt the problem and post again if I don't get the correct answer.
 

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