Dynamics: Angular Momentum Calculations

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Discussion Overview

The discussion revolves around the calculations of angular momentum and moment of inertia in a dynamics problem involving a ring and a rod. Participants are exploring the correct application of formulas and principles related to angular momentum, moment of inertia, and the specifics of the problem setup.

Discussion Character

  • Technical explanation
  • Mathematical reasoning
  • Debate/contested

Main Points Raised

  • Mark presents his calculations and expresses uncertainty about the correctness of his angular velocity results, specifically noting a discrepancy between his calculated value and the expected answer.
  • Some participants inquire about the components of the position vector \(\vec{r}\) and the choice of pivot point, suggesting that these factors may influence the calculations.
  • Mark clarifies the components of \(\vec{r}\) and the pivot point, indicating that calculations are based on the principal axis through the center of mass.
  • Another participant introduces the formula for the moment of inertia with respect to an axis not passing through the center of mass, suggesting it may be relevant to Mark's calculations.
  • Mark mentions a potential error in his moment of inertia calculation and expresses a willingness to continue working on the problem.
  • Participants share resources for LaTeX formatting, indicating a desire to improve the presentation of their mathematical expressions.

Areas of Agreement / Disagreement

Participants do not reach a consensus on the correctness of the calculations or the approach to the problem. Multiple competing views regarding the moment of inertia and angular momentum calculations remain, and the discussion is unresolved.

Contextual Notes

There are indications of missing assumptions regarding the choice of pivot point and the definition of the principal axis. The discussion also highlights the complexity of calculations in three dimensions, particularly with respect to angular momentum.

Who May Find This Useful

Students and practitioners interested in dynamics, angular momentum, and moment of inertia calculations, particularly those working with complex three-dimensional systems.

MarkL
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Could someone could show me where I am going wrong? Here is my work so far.
Given: [itex]F\cdot\nabla t = (5.4 N.s) j[/itex], Density = 1.2
So, [itex]M_{ring} = 1.696 kg[/itex], [itex]M_{rod} = 0.36 kg[/itex], [itex]M_{total} = 3.753 kg[/itex]
Part a) V = 1.44 m/s j (which is correct)
Part b)

Moment of impulse:

[itex]H_{G} = r\times mv = (-0.225 m)\cdot (5.4 kg.m/s) i + (.225 m)\cdot (5.4 kg.m/s) k[/itex]

Mass moments and product of Inertia:

[itex]I_{x} = 2\cdot (\frac{1}{2}M_{ring}\cdot r_c^2 + M_{ring}\cdot r_c^2 + M_{ring}\cdot (\frac{1}{2}\cdot L)^2) + \frac{1}{12}M_{rod}\cdot L^2[/itex]

[itex]I_{y} = 2\cdot (M_{ring}\cdot r_c^2 + M_{ring}\cdot r_c^2) = 4\cdot (M_{ring}\cdot r_c^2)[/itex]
[itex]I_{z} = 2\cdot (\frac{1}{2}M_{ring}\cdot r_c^2 + M_{ring}\cdot (\frac{1}{2} L)^2) + \frac{1}{12}M_{rod}\cdot L^2[/itex]
[itex]I_{yz} = M_{ring}\cdot (0.15)\cdot (-0.225) + M_{ring}\cdot (-0.15)\cdot (0.225)[/itex]
[itex]I_{xz}= I_{xy} = 0[/itex]
[itex]H_x = (-)(.225 m)(5.4 kg.m/s) = I_{x}*/omega_{x} = 0.336*w_x[/itex]
[itex]H_y = 0 = I_y*w_y - I_yz*w_z = 0.343*w_y + 0.114*w_z[/itex]
[itex]H_z = (.225 m)*(5.4 kg.m/s) = - I_yz*w_y + I_x*w_x = 0.114*w_y + 0.164*w_z[/itex]
Solving for w_x: w_x = (- 3.62 r/s) , which is wrong!
I won't bother with the rest.
The correct answer is (-3.55 r/s)i + (-3.2 r/s)j + (9.87 r/s)k
Note: I would use Latex, but it would not preview. Is there a way I can practice this offsite?
Thanks,
Mark
 

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This problem seems to be a bit of beast.

As for LATEX resources, these have been recommended -

MiKTeX
http://www.ctan.org/tex-archive/systems/win32/miktex/?action=/installationadvice/

WinEdt (must pay)
http://www.winedt.com/

Tex -> Html
http://www.cse.ohio-state.edu/~gurari/TeX4ht/mn.html

Tex -> Pdf
http://www.tug.org/applications/pdftex/

---------------------------------------

As for the problem, what [itex]\vec{r}[/itex] are you using? It should have three components.

This would relate to the moment arm - what pivot point to you expect?

I take it that i, j, k are in x, y, z directions, respectively.
 
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[itex]r = (0.225 m) i + (0.15 m) j + (.225 m) k[/itex]
through the center, G, to the point of impulse.

Yes, i, j and k are in x, y, z directions.

The pivot point is definitely at A.
But calculations are made on the principle axis through G. (is this right?)

Maybe my principle axis is incorrect since there are products of inertia.
But [itex]H_{x}[/itex] should be independent of this. So,

[itex]I_{x} = 2\cdot (\frac{1}{2}M_{ring}\cdot r_c^2 + M_{ring}\cdot r_c^2 + M_{ring}\cdot (\frac{1}{2}L)^2) + \frac{1}{12}M_{rod}\cdot L^2[/itex]

[itex]H_{x} = (-.225 m)(5.4 kg.m/s) = I_{x}*w_{x} = 0.336*w_{x}[/itex]

I have a hunch the moment of inertia, [itex]I_{x}[/itex], is incorrect.

No hurry. I'll keep working on it and post the solution, if I get it.
 
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Mark, I am curious, from what textbook is the problem taken?

The moment of inertia I of an object with respect to an axis other than the one through its center of mass if given by

I = ICM + M d2

where,

ICM in the moment of inertia of the object with respect to the axis passing through the center of mass,

M is the mass of the object

and d is the distance between the CM and the point of rotation on the other axis.

and the angular momentum, [itex]\vec{L}[/itex] = [itex]\vec{r}\,\times\,m\vec{v}[/itex].

I wonder if this would help - http://scienceworld.wolfram.com/physics/AngularMomentum.html
http://scienceworld.wolfram.com/physics/MomentofInertia.html
 
Textbook: Beer and Johnston, Statics and Dynamics, Chap 18

Use this link:

http://gaia.csus.edu/~grandajj/me115/me115index.htm"

The lecture is straight from the book, plus some example problems.

In three dimensions, [itex]\vec{L}[/itex] is now [itex]\vec{H}[/itex]

As they say in the book, the computation of the angular momentum [itex]H_{G}[/itex] is now considerably more involved.

They aren't kidding.
 
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