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13 things that do not make sense

  1. Mar 17, 2005 #1

    Ivan Seeking

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    http://www.newscientist.com/channel/space/mg18524911.600

    see also: https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=58374
     
  2. jcsd
  3. Mar 17, 2005 #2
    I read through all that article, and there were several things of interest. I postulate that the placebo effect, and the Belfast Homeopathy items have a link.

    I once met a women, whom I considered to be really out of it, she was a UFO believer, this was in 1971. She had a lot of things to say about UFO visitation, but of all the things she discussed, one thing stayed with me. She did a ritual with the water she drank. She insisted that we needed to reinvigorate the water we consume by taking it out into the sunshine, and shaking it up, just as it would happen if it were running across a stream bed. She said that it added the life back to the water to do this. I thought that a charming concept, somewhat along the lines of blessing your food before you eat.

    I know that attitude is important, always, but especially important in regards to things we consume. Maybe it properly forms the water within foods, if we pass them through a highly positive field of intent.

    Yes, that's right, smile and walk away, smile and nod.
     
  4. Mar 18, 2005 #3
    To quote the article "This is all so maddeningly intriguing" .
     
  5. Mar 18, 2005 #4

    Chronos

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    That's a good, and respectable list Ivan. Permit me these questions:
    1] What purpose does 'existence' serve and why is it hierarchical?
    2] What is sentience, and what purpose does it serve?

    Those are the questions that really bother me. Until those are answered, I could give a rats alimentary canal less.
     
  6. Mar 18, 2005 #5

    russ_watters

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    I agree and I don't see what doesn't make sense about them. And of course, you guys know my opinion of cold fusion. :rolleyes: But the others seem like genuine pickles.
     
  7. Mar 18, 2005 #6

    cronxeh

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    Not only do these 2 things have a link - as a matter of fact, all 13 have one underlying link. If you look at it this way, the human body is as big as the whole Universe in terms of the laws of physics -- everything that happens there, happens inside of us too.
     
  8. Mar 18, 2005 #7

    FredGarvin

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    I would have thought "women" would have been somewhere on that list...
     
  9. Mar 18, 2005 #8

    Math Is Hard

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    hilarious. I laughed until I stopped.
     
  10. Mar 18, 2005 #9
    So what do u think causes homeopathy to work?
     
  11. Mar 18, 2005 #10

    russ_watters

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    As implied above and in the article, its the placebo effect.

    And the reason I think the placebo effect is there is because people underestimate (or just don't want to accept) the power of the mind. Initially, it was thought that the placebo effect wasn't even real - ie, that people would say they felt better because they were supposed to feel better. But it has been found that it really does work. The problem some people have is that the placebo effect can affect body chemistry. But so what?: its well documented that "feeling good" isn't all in your head - you can actually change your body physiology with a change in attitude. I mean, when you get nervous, your heart pounds, you start to sweat, etc. Those are physical changes in the way your body is operating that happen stricly because of what you are thinking in your conscious mind. Given that, I don't see why its much of a leap to say that your coscious mind can affect your body chemistry in such a way as to mimic the effects of the drug.
     
    Last edited: Mar 18, 2005
  12. Mar 18, 2005 #11

    Ivan Seeking

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    ...apparent anomaly formerly known as but not likely to be cold fusion.
     
  13. Mar 18, 2005 #12

    Ivan Seeking

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    To me the point is that the body does release real drugs, it can heal itself, and we don't understand much how this happens. Are we are brute forcing medical treatments and missing the elegant, intrinsic solution? Cases of superhuman strength, the spontaneous and inexplicable remissions of disease, and naturally produced pain killers are all known to exist.
     
  14. Mar 18, 2005 #13
    Well if its basicly the same as the placebo effect, then why mention both homeopathy and the placebo effect in the 'top 13 things that dont make sense'?

    I assume they will have figured out there is a difference between the two. Some simple experiments can make that clear, like giving 100 people normal water, 100 people homeopathic water. Tell them its just water (or tell them its medicine). According to the placebo effect, both should have the same results. But if the results differ, then homeopathy must be something else.

    I remember reading something about the homeopathic water having some kind of 'memory' of what it came in contact with.
     
  15. Mar 18, 2005 #14

    russ_watters

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    Well, the article was quite specific that it was referring to fusion.
    Dunno. I guess that's number 14.
     
  16. Mar 18, 2005 #15
    I wonder if the placebo effect also works as food.

    Give a person a pill and tell him it contains enough proteins, vitamins, etc. to last a month. Then see if he has gained any weight a week later.
     
  17. Mar 18, 2005 #16

    brewnog

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    Mmmm, I wonder indeed...
     
  18. Mar 18, 2005 #17

    Curious3141

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    As a doctor (and a rationalist), the placebo effect really does bother me. Not the psychological component (like reporting pain scores), or even the physical parameters that might conceivably be susceptible to biofeedback modulation. The placebo effect has been observed to have far more mysterious effects, like actual tumor regression without "real" medical intervention. The converse of the placebo effect (the "nocebo" effect) has also been described, and is equally intriguing.

    Medical professionals often use the placebo effect to add "that little something" to medical treatment. Patients who are convinced a particular drug or procedure will work in their case fare better than patients who are skeptical or mistrustful. I've also used the effect in a case where a patient was practically addicted to opioid painkillers and was insisting on regular injections to "ease his pain". The two obvious options were to leave him hanging unhappy and disruptive, or to give in to him, which would just perpetuate the addiction-withdrawal cycle. I chose the third option, I shot him up with a little sterile saline and told him it was an opioid. Lo and behold, he became as content as a baby.
     
  19. Mar 22, 2005 #18
    I like this.
     
    Last edited: Mar 22, 2005
  20. Mar 22, 2005 #19

    russ_watters

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    The placebo effect (or a variation of it) does work on food. Its the reason why nutritionists suggest eating between meals and eating smaller meals: if there is always a little food in your stomach, you trick your body into thinking it can burn more calories for the same net caloric intake.
     
  21. Mar 25, 2005 #20
    It has been shown that a persons level of stress has an impact on the diameter of your blood vessels, so that when you are stressed they become more constricted and blood flow is restricted. Thats how you get the "scared to death" senerio which is very real, people have heart attacks. So in that sense no chemical release has been linked to constriction of the blood vessels, why it happens nobody knows. Perhaps similar benifits come from being in a well state of mind and cons from being stressed. The placebo effect is basically showing us that people with a sense of well being are more healthy, and the reason they have a sense of well being is because they think that whatever they took is good for them, contrary to not taking a drug and being worried or stressed about their condition.
     
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