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Air cooling problem? have answer

  1. Sep 7, 2005 #1
    I wanted to use air conditionar for cooling my machine. For that purpose i design one air blower and installed it in an air conditioned room. my machine is about 20 feet far from the room. so i have arranged one 6" pvc pipe for air traveling.

    I wanted to put the pipe inside my machine. Now also have air cooling for my machine but it is not fullfilling my requirement. so i want to move that blower into an air conditioned room.

    Now what my doubt is : is there any chance for condensate or dew formation in side or outside my machine. because i want to pump the air at 28 deg. C and my ambieant temperature is about 30 to 40 deg.c.

    So what will be final effect of this temperature difference? is there any body to give me helping hand?
     
  2. jcsd
  3. Sep 7, 2005 #2
    peltier coolers

    Sounds like you're trying to over clock a computer?

    If this is the case then I suggest using peltier coolers, You can research peltier systems here:

    http://www.digit-life.com/articles/peltiercoolers/

    Also, By using a neat and thin layer of Artic Silver for your heat sink contact you can improve thermal conduction more efficiently.

    Do not over use the Artic Silver because it is conductive and will spill over the chip if to much is applied and it is messy and may stain materials and cause problems with short circuit contacts. Use it sparingly!

    Do some research for Aluminum Heat Sinks that are coated with either Copper or Silver and or both, Preferably over sized it applicable to fit your computer's available heat sink space.

    Also, By applying these same techniques to your video acceleration card which can increase the cards performance by folds especially AGP

    I hoped that I helped you, I myself am a overclock hobbiest just for challenge of over clocking a 3 Ghz computer to a 6Ghz super computer for Gaming!

    Do vast research before attemping any over clocking or the computer may become an expensive paper weight instead of a wicked machine that can run simulated Universes without losing any breath!


    Gerald L. Blakley
     
    Last edited: Sep 7, 2005
  4. Sep 7, 2005 #3

    Pengwuino

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    No, it will not condense. Any air that is cold enough to condense will condense waaaaaay before the air gets to the computer. This is also an ineffective cooling method, its been tried a few times.
     
  5. Sep 7, 2005 #4
    Thanks for your reply, can you give me good method for cooling my system? it not only have computer it have some more hard ware too. And i want it tobe under ambeiant. so please help me.
     
  6. Sep 8, 2005 #5

    Pengwuino

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    Bringing a cooling system under ambient temperatures will create condensation. People who do this are normally running a refrigeration unit hooked directly to the processor and they have a LOT of condensation-proofing insulation material to make sure water doesnt form.
     
  7. Sep 8, 2005 #6
    i want to discuss with you, can i? because i can say properely about my system. so that you can able to give me right solution. pls
     
  8. Sep 8, 2005 #7
    I have big machine about 5 mtr length and 200 cm width. it that one end have PC and rest of have some moving parts. I am pumping air in that to cool the body and pc in the opposite end to the pc. if i install air blower in a 10X10 room and put 5 tonn air conditioner in that room, is this installation cause any condensate in my system? this is my doubt. my system is about 20 ft.away from the room and my airblower capacity will be around 4000 cubic meter per hour. please help me
     
  9. Sep 8, 2005 #8

    Pengwuino

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    There won't be any condensation. Remember, if the air isnt condensing directly out of the air conditioner, its not going to condense once it reaches the computer.
     
  10. Sep 8, 2005 #9

    LURCH

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    Maybe I'm misreading, but is Ramesh talking about pumping air from an Air Conditioned room to a machine outside that room? Wouldn't this have the same effect as running the AC in a room with a window open and a fan running?
     
  11. Sep 8, 2005 #10

    Pengwuino

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    Not realy, its just an A/C cooling 2 rooms (I think "outside the room" means like, nextdoor). However.... what kinda air conditioner is this? 2x5 meters ??? seems huge
     
  12. Sep 8, 2005 #11

    FredGarvin

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    Actually, bringing the temperature below dew point causes condensation. That point may or may not be ambient temperature depending on the relative humidity.

    Ramesh, take a look at what high end electronics applications do. First, they have high heat producing machines in a controlled environment. That is what you are trying to achieve with the addition of the cooled air. Secondly, there are also exhaust fans as well as supply fans. You're not going to be able to keep the cool air cool after sending it 20 feet thru an uninsulated pipe and a hefty fan (compression work will increase it's temperature). However, you will help things if you use a fan to exhaust the heated air from the enclosure. You may just not have the flow thru the cabinet that you need.

    Is there any reason why you can't simply move the PC to the room with the AC to try it out without the use of the long PVC pipe?
     
  13. Sep 8, 2005 #12

    russ_watters

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    Staff: Mentor

    Conditioned air is dehumidified to whatever temperature the supply-air from the a/c unit is. Ie, if the a/c unit supplies air at 55F (13C), which is typical, the dew point will be 55F (13C) and no condensation will occur.

    Now if he's running conditioned air through a duct through an unconditioned space, he may get condensation on the outside of the duct, but that wouldn't be a concern for the computer.

    Now about those temps, ramesh_king11 - they are really high. What kind of climate do you live in?

    Also, I think others may be misunderstanding, so can we clarify: this 5mx200cm "machine" of yours is enclosed and you want to supply conditioned air directly to it (ie, not to the room)? That will work (cavet: 5T is a lot of cooling and your duct is too small...), but like Fred said, you should insulate the duct. 5T is enough to condition about 200m^2, so you can just cool the entire room (unless its huge), but also like Fred said, you need to run return ductwork so you don't just lose all that cool air.

    It is not uncommon for people to duct air directly from an a/c unit an intake on the case of a PC and it works just fine, with no internal condensation.
     
    Last edited: Sep 8, 2005
  14. Sep 8, 2005 #13
    Dear Mr.Russ_Watters,
    Thanks for a good reply, As you think my aim is to cool my machine by pumping cool air in it, It is a sealed machine and have doors on both ends, it is some how 5 met.long, 200 mm wide and 1.5 mtr height.it is like a duct. I will try to arrange return path to the same room as you said. My outer temperatures are not always same and its humidity will also alwasy gets change. Alltime minimum humidity willbe 55 to 60%.
    some times it will go to 85% or more. is there any chance of condensation of the air in that Rh%. that is what my fear.

    Thanks for good reply......ramesh
     
  15. Sep 9, 2005 #14
    Cooling Techniques

    Hi ramesh_king11.

    If your Computer has a built in Temperature software probe.

    1. Do you know what the computers normal CPU idle temperature is?
    2. Using a Bench Mark program, What is the computers Temperature at 100% CPU usage?
    3. Do you know what your temperature is on questions 1 through 2 but with your phyical memory instead of CPU?
    4. What is the Normal Operating temperature inside the Computer box itself?

    5. You can eliminate between 5 and 10 degrees from the CPU's Heat sink by using Aluminum Duct tape and making a thermal strip that can be attached to the side of the Heat sink and the other end of the thermal strip attached to the bottom of the computers chassis. Use a drop of Artic Silver thermal compound on the Aluminum Tape so the compound will conduct heat directly to the Thermal strip but leave some of the sticky glue that's already on the Tape as a border so the thermal compound does not leak out of the tapes edges, Use a small drop and smear it gently in the middle of the tape so that when you attach the thermal strip it will stick, It is important to use thermal compound when attaching the thermal strip because the glue on the tape by itself is not a very good Heat conductor. Make sure that you place the thermal strip onto the Heat sink without blocking any air flow in or out of the heat sink.

    Super Conductor Thermal Strips are Thee best but is impractical at this time because of temperature dependancy.

    Normal Metal Thermal Strips can be used until then.
    Silver, Copper, Gold, Aluminum Duct Tape in this order is the best where Aluminum is fourth place and Silver being best heat transfer.

    Apply the thermal strips to the heat sink and not directly to the chip/chips itself and set it up so the thermal strip/strips do not have kinks or wrinkles in the setup, Make sure that the Thermal strip does not come into contact with any electrical circuits where the Tape will short circuit something.

    Kinks, Wrinkles, Edges will radiate heat prematurely so make sure there are none if possible.

    If Possible try to keep the thermal strip as short as possible so heat transfer is optimal.

    This method and the other techniques I described in my earlier post can drop the idle and working temperature considerably.

    Other techniques is to draw heat away rather than to fill the box with cold air.

    If for some reason this becomes an extreme hobby of building a better heat transfer then I would suggest in buying thermal optic goggles so Heat can be seen on every location of your motherboard and better thermal research can be implimented visually.

    However, I would suggest buying a 500 watt Power box for your computer to run all motherboard electronics and to power up a peltier cooling block preferrably in Cascade series with a heat sink and Fan all together and applying this to both Video Card and CPU chips.

    22 years experience at over clocking computers is my motto.

    Please tell us a little about your over all Hardware system, Make/Model/Year
    Video Card, BIO's etc.

    then it would give me an idea of what kind of things we can take advantage of when trying some cooling techniques for your system.

    Using my techniques
    it is possible to double or triple your computers speed without electron or Heat creepage, If your system has a configurable multiplier for your system in BIOs, If the computer can be made thermally stable then it will last a long time, but if you cannot stablize the thermal ability to its maximum then over clocking a system will only shorten its life and may run slow or even have glitches or hangs.

    Gerald L. Blakley
     
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