Am I being over-protective?

[DanP]

Mentallic may have overreacted, but it was his girlfriend who started this whole problem.

It might be, it might be not. We don't know. What do you know about OP ? Nothing at all, what he said about himself doesn't count. You need to hear the other side story.

All we have here so far is a guy frustrated with his women.

 

[Pattonias]

While looking into her phone is obviously a bad move, I can sympathise with the OP and I can see how he ended up doing it. This other person is obviously interested in his girlfriend and he has no way to defend against this threat to the relationship that he and she enjoys. Can anyone honestly say they have never been tempted to look at their girlfriends phone in this situtation. The OP's mistake was actually doing it.

I think you should just come clean. This is still her decision and you need to start making some of those hard decisions as they apply to you. Apologize for invading her privacy, and explain how this is making you feel. If you were sitting here with me I would avoid using the words "feel" and talking about your emotions, but as this is the internet I don't have the option of cracking a beer with you and grunting this one out.

While it might be hard for some here to believe, I agree that 90% percent of the time a guy and a girl can not have a close relationship without a sexual component/attraction developing. I have never seen it happen anywhere, but telivision. And of course every time it happened on TV the guy is gay.

If you lay it all out with her and leave it up to her how to continue, you should be prepared to move on if she chooses to continue talking to him because she wants to spare his feelings, but is willing to sacrifice your feeling in the process.

I think she probably genuinly loves you, but has gotten comfortable enough with you that she doesn't feel that she can hurt you by dealing with this guy.

Honestly though from my perspective, if this guy was making the same moves on my girlfriend at a party where I was present it would be game on. Men should share a certain mutual respect when it comes to other's relationships. It may not be PC or in line with the modern women, but look at what happens in the wild if a male lion tries to move in on another lions mate. It's biological. You just have to behave like a human and consider the rights of you're lioness.

You have to trust her, once you stop trusting her you might as well break it off now. You would only be miserable from here on out.

 

[GeorginaS]

Yes, of course people in a relationship should respect each other's wishes, assuming those wishes are reasonable and don't infringe upon the basic personhood of either of the people. I've had people I was involved with tell me what I could and couldn't do based on things that they did or didn't like when it was none of their business and didn't affect them in any way, but they thought they had the right to dictate what went on in my life. I'm sharing with you. You don't own me.

And this fellow does not own this girl. He says, point-blank, repeatedly, that he believes that controlling her is appropriate "occasionally". It's never appropriate in an adult relationship. You have to limit and control the actions of a child who is under your care and supervision, yes, but your equal and your partner? Never. It is never, ever about control. And shouldn't be. You can control yourself and your own actions. You can set limits and boundaries (as Monique pointed out) and say, "I'm not comfortable with this kind of behaviour or these circumstances". You talk about it. You sort through it. You do not ever tell your partner, "I forbid you" or "You are not allowed to". And I sincerely doubt that Evo would stand for that for three seconds.

As far as we've heard, the girl has developed a friendship with a fellow who sounds -- to me -- as if he's playing the "wounded puppy" card that that so many guys like to play on young women. Or maybe the guy's sincere and actually is a wounded puppy, although in conversation with the OP, he said something about the OP "winning" so, it sounds like a player situation to me. We're not getting the whole story, but gads I've heard and lived this story before or something awfully close to it.

So the OP fears his girlfriend may get sucked in. She very well may. She may get sucked into that, "Oh, nobody understands this poor lost soul but me!" scenario in which she further believes that she'll be the one and only person to show him how truly worthy of love he is. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then she'll get used, and squashed, and dumped on her head. There's nothing anyone can do to prevent that. You can point it out to her, but if she doesn't want to listen, she won't.

If she's committed to her relationship, then no one else can interfere with that, even someone who has amorous intent for her. But, you see, you can't go around cutting everyone out of your life who your partner doesn't like or feel comfortable with, because controlling people are awfully, awfully good at isolating you. You have to maintain the integrity of your own person -- and that goes for both people involved in here -- and know where your limits are. If the OP's limits are that he can't tolerate her relationship with the fellow, then he has to make that plain. He can't demand or limit or "allow" or "disallow" anything. That's not his right. He can make decisions for himself based on his own boundaries. And she has to make decisions for herself based on her own boundaries.

Again, if you're doing something that makes your partner feel uncomfortable, then yes, you should sit down and honestly think about what you're doing and whether or not it's intrinsic to who you are and whether or not it realistically has anything to do with the other person. (Example: one of my exes was very uncomfortable with me wearing high-heeled shoes and dressing nicely. [Note: he was almost six inches taller than me, so that wasn't the issue.] He just didn't like me looking nice in the eyes of other people. I decided that was none of his business. Guess how long that lasted?)

And he has to set his boundaries too. If he can't live with what's going on, then talk about it. If that doesn't resolve the issue, then he has to make some decisions. However, no, "controlling" isn't ever part of the equation in a fair, mutual, adult relationship. Ever.

 

[DanP]

While looking into her phone is obviously a bad move, I can sympathise with the OP and I can see how he ended up doing it. This other person is obviously interested in his girlfriend and he has no way to defend against this threat to the relationship that he and she enjoys.

She and he enjoys ? Sorry, but if she is looking for comfort in another place is clear that she does not enjoy the relationship as much as you think to believe.

And sorry, if you feel defenseless against the threat a 3rd person may pose to your relationship, then you have another problem. One which can be pretty much summed up as lack of balls to take any action whatsoever.

Can anyone honestly say they have never been tempted to look at their girlfriends phone in this situtation. The OP's mistake was actually doing it.

What for ? If you are not happy , move on.

 

[DanP]

There's nothing anyone can do to prevent that. You can point it out to her, but if she doesn't want to listen, she won't.

Actually, beating the **** out of the other man sometimes does the trick :P Rarely indeed , but sometimes it does work.

 

[Monique]

This is what I call nice theory. Most of humans act on what is healthy for them, and not what is healthy for abstract ideas. And relationship ethics become pretty much abstract when you want what's best for yourself. It;s just an experience after all. Beeing true to yourself is the healthiest thing you can do in your life. Might not be always ethical, but well, at hell with ethics. A couple should not stay together because of ethics. This is why I call unhealthy, to spend you life in a "ethical" cage.

That's just called being selfish. You can decide to live that way, but don't expect other people to be a victim of it, you will be trapped in the "selfish cage" and it probably can get very lonely in there.

A couple should not stay together because of ethics, they should stay together because they respect each other. Many people have testified that it's not possible for a girl to "just be friends" with a guy, I've tried it a long time ago and it indeed doesn't work. GeorginaS made some good points, tell her how you feel so that she can be sensitive to your feelings.

 

[Pattonias]

She and he enjoys ? Sorry, but if she is looking for comfort in another place is clear that she does not enjoy the relationship as much as you think to believe.

And sorry, if you feel defenseless against the threat a 3rd person may pose to your relationship, then you have another problem. One which can be pretty much summed up as lack of balls to take any action whatsoever.




What for ? If you are not happy , move on.

From what I have read the OP doesn't feel defenceless. He just can't decide what defence is appropriate. It would probably make it all a lot simpler if this new guy would walk up and say "me want your girlfriend" and then allow him to respond, but that's not how real life works (usually). His girlfriend has said that he has nothing to worry about, the guy isn't interested. The OP know for a fact that the guy was interested and is still activley trying to talk to her.

She could go a long way to ease her boyfriends mind if she just let the other guy find a soul mate elseware.

 

[IcedEcliptic]

That's just called being selfish. You can decide to live that way, but don't expect other people to be a victim of it, you will be trapped in the "selfish cage" and it probably can get very lonely in there.

A couple should not stay together because of ethics, they should stay together because they respect each other. Many people have testified that it's not possible for a girl to "just be friends" with a guy, I've tried it a long time ago and it indeed doesn't work. GeorginaS made some good points, tell her how you feel so that she can be sensitive to your feelings.

You are proposing that men and women cannot be platonic friends? I would need to see some heavily reviewed studies before I buy that line.

 

[IcedEcliptic]

From what I have read the OP doesn't feel defenceless. He just can't decide what defence is appropriate. It would probably make it all a lot simpler if this new guy would walk up and say "me want your girlfriend" and then allow him to respond, but that's not how real life works (usually). His girlfriend has said that he has nothing to worry about, the guy isn't interested. The OP know for a fact that the guy was interested and is still activley trying to talk to her.

She could go a long way to ease her boyfriends mind if she just let the other guy find a soul mate elseware.

What is so complex here? He is the kind of person who selfishly violates the privacy of another rather than being direct. That is cowardice, and deception. I can only judge the OP by his stated actions and inaction; he's chosen a coward's way to feed his sense of security. If he has an issue here, and we all agree that honesty and respect are the center of a good relationship, this is egregious.

 

[rewebster]

I'm 18...

So we can assume she about the same age? that does make a difference...

and recently decided since I was with my mate and we both have never been to a strip club to try it out. She didn't like this at all and was distant to make me feel bad for it, and only stopped once all her friends heard about it and started siding with me. How is this really any different to what I did? I've never really enforced anything on her, just this one thing really got to me. I think I need to be controlling sometimes at least.

not good---let me guess, you're idea?, and she went along with it?

Younger age relationships are often trial and error.

She is still looking for more friends (and maybe more). And like you said, she may (or may not) realize that men are hitting on her rather than, in the way she thinks, of people (men) just wanting to be 'friends'----and if its happened more that once, and she's doing it again, then there's a variety of reasons 'why' she may be doing it----and if its one of several reasons, she may stop or she may continue doing it her whole life.

Taking her to a strip club, may to you seem like she's open minded, but there's hardly any middle ground it---she'll either like it as 'exciting' (aphrodisiac) or she'll think its disgusting and degrading.

Think of it another way, would you go with her to a 'male' strip club?

I still think she has a wandering mind and hasn't decided on anything yet.

Also, some (and young) women often know what they're doing and see what they can do with sexuality (flirting), and see how far they can take it.

 

[IcedEcliptic]

She is clearly on the line, if not across it, but as the OP has already shown a lack of trust and confidence, I am inclined to either go with DaveC and say open up and make a loiving attempt to pt things in order... or DanP and give it up or grow some balls.

By the way, I'm a man and I find stripping pathetic. Sad women, most of whom are abuse or drug cases; I've been once in my life and I just felt badly for them. If I were a woman, I would have had an added layer of disgust.

 

[Mentallic]

I've had people I was involved with tell me what I could and couldn't do based on things that they did or didn't like when it was none of their business and didn't affect them in any way

And when it does affect you? If what you're doing is going to hurt them emotionally but you yourself believe that it's harmless and your friend has nothing to fear, would you be totally dumbfounded if your friend turns up the heat and becomes more forceful to express how much he truly doesn't want you to do it?

If she's committed to her relationship, then no one else can interfere with that, even someone who has amorous intent for her. But, you see, you can't go around cutting everyone out of your life who your partner doesn't like or feel comfortable with, because controlling people are awfully, awfully good at isolating you.

You'll be surprised what can happen when people act on instinct. When I saw all the messages on her facebook, then her phone, then her msn from this guy; my first thought wasn't
"Oh, he wants my girl. Well I better let her go hang out with him so he can try and pull some moves, it's only fair since he has sexual desires like everyone else."

Why don't I just sell her to the highest bidder?

I'm not ready to face a break-up in this way...

And anyway I've already apologized to her for what I've done, I acted irrationally as a "spur of the moment" type thing.

OP, for disrespecting her privacy, you are a selfish, insecure bastard that has issues that need counselling... oh and break up with her already

All I can say is that it was just one time! I don't do this on a regular basis. I could barely even navigate her phone...
For her to be deleting inbox messages obviously meant she was expecting it. Her reason was because she knows he messages her a lot and I've seen it, she doesn't reply enough for the amount he messages her. She knew I wouldn't like it, but (from what I know) she believed that it was just out of friendship.

 

[rewebster]

Why don't I just sell her to the highest bidder?

Do you have the owner registration and a good title on her?

if you do, then you can sell her off...

 

[Mentallic]

You are proposing that men and women cannot be platonic friends? I would need to see some heavily reviewed studies before I buy that line.

Yes that's right. For teenagers it's very uncommon to see male and female friendships to be truly platonic. But you need heavily reviewed studies to believe that? So am I right to assume you've never been in this situation then?

So we can assume she about the same age? that does make a difference...

Yes she is the same age. Why, what was everyone else assuming so far?

not good---let me guess, you're idea?, and she went along with it?

First of all, it was me and my mate that went to a strip club for the first time. And it was neither of our ideas, the opportunity popped into our minds when a bouncer offered us a cheap deal to get in.
But that's not the point of what I was trying to say. What I meant was that she had a problem with what I had done and said I should have called her about it before I went. At which point she would've told me she didn't want me to go and such.
We've both placed restrictions on each other at some point in our relationship, and I've never had a problem with it. Asking me to not be friends with a girl trying to hit on me is a given...

 

[Pattonias]

I hope you got enough from this thread to help you decide what to do. I don't think you're really going to get much more from this forum. At this point, you are about to end up defending your relationship with this girl with a lot of strangers over the internet. I just hope you get enough out of this to see that you can't make your girlfriend do anything. You can just tell her what you think and hope she decides in your favor.

 

[Char. Limit]

I'm starting to wonder what some of these people think about relationships. Inferring from the comments that "she's her own person, you can't own her, let her do what she wants", is it then true that I can sleep with as many women as I want who are not my girlfriend, and if she gets angry, I can then say "you don't own me, I'm my own person"? Excellent... oh, and if this is not actually true, then you are applying a double standard, saying women should be praised for straying (Mentallic's girlfriend), while men should be vilified for the same thing (examples? pick 'em). I don't support a double standard.

 

[IcedEcliptic]

Yes that's right. For teenagers it's very uncommon to see male and female friendships to be truly platonic. But you need heavily reviewed studies to believe that? So am I right to assume you've never been in this situation then?

Yes she is the same age. Why, what was everyone else assuming so far?




First of all, it was me and my mate that went to a strip club for the first time. And it was neither of our ideas, the opportunity popped into our minds when a bouncer offered us a cheap deal to get in.
But that's not the point of what I was trying to say. What I meant was that she had a problem with what I had done and said I should have called her about it before I went. At which point she would've told me she didn't want me to go and such.
We've both placed restrictions on each other at some point in our relationship, and I've never had a problem with it. Asking me to not be friends with a girl trying to hit on me is a given...

If your skin is so thin that you cannot take honest opinions, do not post about your relationships in an online forum. For the platonic bit, yes, I have been there, but that is anecdotal, not in any way evidence. Welcome to physics forums.

The point of you going into her phone is that you could have confronted her, but you took the spineless route and invaded her privacy. If she did that to you, I doubt that her ineptitude with your phone would be a balm to you. If you're mature enough to be in a relationship, you're mature enough to be honest with her for better or worse. You want to control what you can only influenced, and in doing so you've compromised an ethic you seem aware of, and crossed a line.

Jealousy is fundamentally the result of insecurity, which is understandable given our nature as people. ACTING on it in an inappropriate way is not.

 

[IcedEcliptic]

I'm starting to wonder what some of these people think about relationships. Inferring from the comments that "she's her own person, you can't own her, let her do what she wants", is it then true that I can sleep with as many women as I want who are not my girlfriend, and if she gets angry, I can then say "you don't own me, I'm my own person"? Excellent... oh, and if this is not actually true, then you are applying a double standard, saying women should be praised for straying (Mentallic's girlfriend), while men should be vilified for the same thing (examples? pick 'em). I don't support a double standard.

Is there a reason you can't say, "XXXX, I don't mean to sound jealous, and you may not realize this, but the time you're spending with YYYY is too much for me. I am not going to tell you who can and cannot be your friend, but what you're doing makes me worry, and that's hurting my trust in you."

or some variation. Hell, you can confront the other guy and tell him to stop bird-dogging your girlfriend. What you can't do is MAKE someone be faithful, stay with you, or choose their friends. When you've sunk to snooping around, that is smoke where there is already fire.

 

[Pattonias]

Is there a reason you can't say, "XXXX, I don't mean to sound jealous, and you may not realize this, but the time you're spending with YYYY is too much for me. I am not going to tell you who can and cannot be your friend, but what you're doing makes me worry, and that's hurting my trust in you."

or some variation. Hell, you can confront the other guy and tell him to stop bird-dogging your girlfriend. What you can't do is MAKE someone be faithful, stay with you, or choose their friends. When you've sunk to snooping around, that is smoke where there is already fire.

I actually agree with this approach totally.

 

[IcedEcliptic]

I actually agree with this approach totally.

Thank you, I find honesty is a good policy when you are in a relationship, even if it means an end to it. Especially for the young, relationships often linger painfully after they are walking ghosts, and honesty is the surgery which prevents cheating, snooping, jealousy...


There is nothing wrong with telling the one you love that you feel jealous, it is wrong to try and coerce. Honesty, as one would have the other do for you. Besides, maybe she has NO INTEREST in this guy, and his interest is therefore meaningless! Why stew and worry when communicating with your love is so much of the point anyway?

 

[rewebster]

First of all, it was me and my mate that went to a strip club for the first time. And it was neither of our ideas, the opportunity popped into our minds when a bouncer offered us a cheap deal to get in.
But that's not the point of what I was trying to say. What I meant was that she had a problem with what I had done and said I should have called her about it before I went. At which point she would've told me she didn't want me to go and such.
We've both placed restrictions on each other at some point in our relationship, and I've never had a problem with it. Asking me to not be friends with a girl trying to hit on me is a given...

"First of all, it was me and my mate that went to a strip club for the first time."
("You'll be surprised what can happen when people act on instinct.")

if you were single, and not in a relationship--I think it would have been OK


"the opportunity popped into our minds when a bouncer offered us a cheap deal to get in."

cheap deal? that's your reason/excuse?


"At which point she would've told me she didn't want me to go and such."

relationships are built on trust through communication---so, you wanted to go, and didn't care if it would bother her, until you found out that it did bother her


"Asking me to not be friends with a girl trying to hit on me is a given."

nothing is a 'given'


If you want her, sit and talk --and apologize for not calling her first

 

[Moonbear]

Oh, sorry, I misinterpreted your criticism for thinking that you aren't agreeing with me whatsoever.

For the record, I'm not particularly agreeing or disagreeing. Rather, I've been trying to point out how your words come across to a female.

I don't know you or your girlfriend or anything about how your relationship works or doesn't work. You may very well have real cause for concern about the direction that relationship is heading because of her "friendship" with this other guy. Sometimes that suspicion that they aren't telling you everything is spot on.

However, if you think the relationship is worth fighting to keep (if you are indeed competing with someone else), then you need to be careful how you approach expressing your concerns to your girlfriend. The way you describe the situation here sounds very controlling on your part (and she may be doing her share too...sometimes there is manipulation in both directions). If you're fighting to keep her, and your actions are pushing her away, I hope it's helpful for someone uninvolved to let you know why your actions or words are coming across badly so you can make adjustments. If it doesn't work out with this relationship, then learn from your mistakes to avoid them with the next one.

 

[Monique]

You are proposing that men and women cannot be platonic friends? I would need to see some heavily reviewed studies before I buy that line.

No, most of my friends are male and the relationships are platonic. The difference is that they are part of a larger group, if a male were to walk up to me and say "I want to be friends with you" I'm not naive enough to believe that it would stay platonic. If the situation were to come up, I'd hang out with a larger group of people and leave it at that. I'm not being paranoid, just realistic.

 

[HeLiXe]

Well...I was in the same situation before, but I was like how your girlfriend is. NOT FUN I can tell you that! Things is, human behaviour is so very hard for me to understand at times, so I am unsure if anything I can say about my situation will help at all-- everyone is so different! I just hope things work out for the best for all of you and I wish you some peace because I know it is an awful and maddening thing to be going through. If your girlfriend feels anything like how I did, I think she might be going crazy as well.

Best wishes!

 

[Pattonias]

Are we defining platonic as a relationship in which there is no sexual attraction, or are we defining it as those urges are mutually not being acted on? I mean seriously. I am a guy and know that I can not be friends with an attractive women and not feel a sexual attraction to her. I don't think that is some sort of failure on my part, I think it is bilogical. That doesn't mean that I don't have girls who are friends, but in the past I have found that girls can be unaware or don't realize what this means. I would almost go as far as to say that it is impossible for me to be friends with a girl like I am friends with my best guy friends. If I found a girl I connected with like that I would be madly in love with her.

 

[Pattonias]

I have two sisters who are both in college and their relationships are a constant source mental anquish for me.
They live together in a town house and between the two of them they have a harem of about twenty guys who are constantly around them. They float among these boys in what they think is a platonic fashion. They have only dated a select few. And of those few who they have broken up with none hang around anymore. I have been present for two unreturned professions of love and am aware of a handful of borderline stalkers (I say that in jest). They have one seemingly truly platonic friend who I have seen make no advances and behave in a truly friendly manner. I am just waiting for him to come over to the house with his boyfriend to confirm what myself and several others have already suspected (also said in jest, he is an honestly nice guy albeit very well dressed and has a few gayish tendencies, not limited to drinking rasberry vodka and wine coolers).

I say all this to show that in my personal experience that guys don't just hang out with girls they like. If they like them they will be sexually attracted to them and given the opportunity will act on them. I don't say this to be mean or to imply that it is in some way a bad thing. I just think that if girls could read minds they would be very very surprised. Either that or they would confirm what they had been denying to themselves.

 

[Monique]

Are we defining platonic as a relationship in which there is no sexual attraction, or are we defining it as those urges are mutually not being acted on. I mean seriously. I am a guy and know that I can not be friends with an attractive women and not feel a sexual attraction to her. I don't think that is a some sort of failure on my part, I think it is bilogical. That doesn't mean that I don't have girls who are friends, but in the past I have found that girls can be unaware or don't realize what this means. I would almost go as far as to say that it is impossible for me to be friends with a girl like I am friends with my best guy friends. If I found I girl I connected with like that I would be madly in love with her.

That is my experience as well, I was convinced I could maintain a platonic friendship (non-sexual) with particular guys. I was convinced that if I said "no, we should stay just friends" that it would be possible, but it is not (in my experience). In some cases I was completely oblivious to the other intent and managed to get feelings hurt. I think zoobyshoe wrote an interesting post in another thread:

I don't know if I can explain it. It is a thing that seems to be completely foreign to women. Women seem to be very big on, at least, staying friends with guys they can't have, or who have broken up with them. They want to stay in close contact even if the guy is totally disinterested.

If I'm intensely interested in a woman, not being able to have her is torture. Imagine being famished and being invited to sit in presence of a fabulous meal you can't eat. The host of this meal seems inexplicably indifferent to the fact the sight and smell of this meal are driving you crazy, and seems to think you should be perfectly content to just look and smell.

This is a horrible situation: you being famished, and the host of the meal seeming not to get something so basic. Not only are you hungry, but you feel completely psychologically depersonalized. You would clearly be better off if the person hated you and wanted nothing to do with you in the future. Out of sight, out of mind. You need complete cold turkey to recover.

Women, for some reason I can't fathom, seem to decide it's preferable to stay friends with guys they're insane about who've rejected them romantically. I don't understand how they ever recover. In fact, it looks to me like they don't recover.

https://www.physicsforums.com/showpost.php?p=2702509&postcount=7

 

[DanP]

That's just called being selfish. You can decide to live that way, but don't expect other people to be a victim of it...

Monique, what part of my post made you feel I expect anything from anyone ? Or how I made you would you feel a victim of my lifestyle (or anyone) ? By accepting the "you" , the theoretical women, can do anything, be what you want to be, do whatever you dream off ? Think a bit about it

A couple should not stay together because of ethics, they should stay together because they respect each other.

Good. Respect,in the wild, will never keep a couple together. Its a fairy tale. What keeps a couple together is accomplishment for both, on multiple planes. Starting with social and economical demands, and ending with sex.

Many people have testified that it's not possible for a girl to "just be friends" with a guy, I've tried it a long time ago and it indeed doesn't work.

And what part of my posts made you feel I advertise man-women friendship ? Can you find any post where I promote a man -women friendship ? I promote choice, as opposed to 2 penny whining on ethics .

GeorginaS made some good points, tell her how you feel so that she can be sensitive to your feelings.

Monique, isf there is anything you think I should tell to Georgiana about my feelings send me a PM :P i was never aware till now that Georgiana has to be soft on my little puppy soul. Thanks for tip, anyway.

This is ridiculous. If you have anything to tell me, do it directly, don't involve Georgiana.

 

[Monique]

Um, I was adressing the OP with the last comment.

 

[DanP]

Um, I was adressing the OP with the last comment.

Good. Then i'll present you my apologies for the misunderstanding. Please accept them.

 

[DanP]

Think of it another way, would you go with her to a 'male' strip club?

This would be gay with capital G.

 

[IcedEcliptic]

No, most of my friends are male and the relationships are platonic. The difference is that they are part of a larger group, if a male were to walk up to me and say "I want to be friends with you" I'm not naive enough to believe that it would stay platonic. If the situation were to come up, I'd hang out with a larger group of people and leave it at that. I'm not being paranoid, just realistic.

I believe you, this makes a great deal more sense.

 

[IcedEcliptic]

This would be gay with capital G.

I took that challenge from some female friends, along with two other lads and I. You are right, it was mostly a lot of gay men, and women out for a laugh. There is a HUGE difference between male and female stripping, for better or worse. I am not homophobic, but I found the situation deeply awkward. I don't know how a completely straight women could possibly find a female strip club anything but awkward as well, at best.

 

[HeLiXe]

and ending with sex.

Isn't that where everything ends

 

[GeorginaS]

Good. Respect,in the wild, will never keep a couple together. Its a fairy tale. What keeps a couple together is accomplishment for both, on multiple planes. Starting with social and economical demands, and ending with sex.

I'm not sure I understand this comment specifically addressing the function of respect in a relationship. Can you explain this better to me, please?

GeorginaS made some good points, tell her how you feel so that she can be sensitive to your feelings.

Monique, isf there is anything you think I should tell to Georgiana about my feelings send me a PM :P i was never aware till now that Georgiana has to be soft on my little puppy soul. Thanks for tip, anyway.

I'm pretty sure that that comma in the sentence Monique wrote was supposed to be a period. Punctuation misunderstanding.

Monique, isf there is anything you think I should tell to Georgiana about my feelings send me a PM :P i was never aware till now that Georgiana has to be soft on my little puppy soul. Thanks for tip, anyway.

This is ridiculous. If you have anything to tell me, do it directly, don't involve Georgiana.

I get the impression from this that you may have taken offense to something I wrote. If so, want to address it with me?